Are we being forced to go electric?

[the snail]

I can't afford one, whether or not other people can does not affect my own circumstances.....

If the majority of car buyers (new or used) can afford an EV then maybe I am an outlier as your post suggests.

Most people don't buy new vehicles. ICE vehicles will still be around for a decade or two, by which time there will be plenty of used EVs to buy, and the choice of vehicles will be much wider. Complaining that you can't afford a £50k EV makes no sense, you probably can't afford an equivalent ICE vehicle either.

 

[icowden]

I can't afford one, whether or not other people can does not affect my own circumstances.....
If the majority of car buyers (new or used) can afford an EV then maybe I am an outlier as your post suggests.

I would say that it's in the middle. If you want a runaround then for most people, it's affordable to get one.
For example you could get an MG MG4EV for £2,500 down and then £288 a month for 4 years on a lease allowing 5000 miles per year. It increases to £349 if you go for 15,000 miles.

If you want to buy one on PCP then an example is £6k down and £269 a month with 8000 miles per year.
Alternatively the Nissan Leaf is lovely and for 5K down you pay £273 per month over 37 months, 6000 miles.

Second hand for under 6k you can pick up a leaf, a Zoe, a Twizy or a Peugeot ION.

EVs are 10% cheaper on average this year than last. Tesla have just made big price cuts. Battery tech keeps improving and getting cheaper - so things can only get better...

 

[classic33]

No one is saying they shouldn't, just that it's pointless using an outlier to justify your viewpoint.
Yes there are many mobility impaired people. For the majority of them an EV is great - one pedal driving. For those needing wheelchairs and who can drive, the car can be fairly easily adapted to hand control only. FOr those needing storage for their wheelchairs, cars exist such as the e-berlingo with its 170ish mile range.

If you are a wheelchair user who regularly needs to travel long distances, you are an exception, not the rule. And yes, there may not be an EV that fits your use case *yet*.

It does not follow however that we should abandon EVs because there are:-

I would argue that this group of people is very *very* small.

Exception or not, what is required of the user of the vehicle is what decides their final choice.

As for your initial response, of "Why are all these mobility impaired people driving so far all the time?". Who are you to question, in that manner, the requirements of the person who'll be parting with the money? Whatever powers the vehicle they choose.

 

[icowden]

As for your initial response, of "Why are all these mobility impaired people driving so far all the time?". Who are you to question, in that manner, the requirements of the person who'll be parting with the money? Whatever powers the vehicle they choose.

I think you have missed the point which is that if you use a strawman to try and present a rational case as to why EVs are unusable, expect it to be knocked down. You were not presenting the point of view of drivers with mobility impairment, you were presenting an extreme edge case.

In the UK the average journey per day per car is 20 miles. Not 200 miles.

 

[icowden]

Exception or not, what is required of the user of the vehicle is what decides their final choice.

And as has been pointed out to you, EVs are suitable for the vast majority of people, including those with disabilities.

 

[icowden]

Unbelievable

Indeed. Fancy using disability as a tool to do down electric vehicles.

 

[classic33]

I think you have missed the point which is that if you use a strawman to try and present a rational case as to why EVs are unusable, expect it to be knocked down. You were not presenting the point of view of drivers with mobility impairment, you were presenting an extreme edge case.

In the UK the average journey per day per car is 20 miles. Not 200 miles.

And as has been pointed out to you, EVs are suitable for the vast majority of people, including those with disabilities.

I asked why a persons requirements from the vehicle mattered, more than what it was powered by.

Your cheap insult, at the expense of a person who is less mobile than yourself, was just that, cheap. Or as you would say a "strawman" argument. The vehicle requirements came first for the person you replied to, not what it's powered by.

You have this habit of knocking others when their view doesn't match yours. And to scoff at someone with different requirements to yourself, due to mobility issues, is about as low as you can go.
Whether they are the driver, or passenger, they have the right to travel just the same as you do.

 

[icowden]

I asked why a persons requirements from the vehicle mattered, more than what it was powered by.

Can you find me where you asked that, because I don't see it.

Your cheap insult, at the expense of a person who is less mobile than yourself, was just that, cheap. Or as you would say a "strawman" argument. The vehicle requirements came first for the person you replied to, not what it's powered by.

Yes, and it was pointed out that vehicles exist which would allow carriage of a wheelchair.

You have this habit of knocking others when their view doesn't match yours. And to scoff at someone with different requirements to yourself, due to mobility issues, is about as low as you can go.

Well as I did neither of those things, I think you are rather misinterpreting the conversation.

Whether they are the driver, or passenger, they have the right to travel just the same as you do.

Of course, and the EV market will meet their needs just as the ICE market has done. It will take time to be affordable however.

 

[Jameshow]

Had the JWs knock on the door earlier, think I'd prefer a debate with the JW rather than the EV evangelists on here!! 🤣🤣🤣

 

[All uphill]

Had the JWs knock on the door earlier, think I'd prefer a debate with the JW rather than the EV evangelists on here!! 🤣🤣🤣

Or the EV deniers!

 

[fossyant]

Spotted my first Ami on Thursday. Little tiny things that make even a Smart Car look big. Looked cool though. As has been said above, average daily drive is 20 miles. We need more e-city cars not the likes of current advertising - "Urban SUV", Who needs that ? Give us some cool/funky e-city cars, I'd get one (if it could hit motorway speeds for a short while). I'm not in the market for long distance cars, we've some ICE cars that will do for a long time yet.

 

[DRM]

All the points were yours and not selected. I addressed them all.
Here is an article about being a field engineer - this chap does 150 miles on a bad day, but presumably stops for lunch:
https://www.ajmhealthcare.com/jobs/day-in-the-life/a-day-in-the-life-of-a-field-service-engineer/#:~:text=I plan my route and,the road until 10.00pm.

This chap has 3 visits, each 16 miles from the office. A maxmium of 96 miles if he goes back to the office between jobs.
https://www.gilkes.com/news-media/working-day-of-a-hydro-service-engineer
Both of these could easily do their jobs in a 2024 esprinter. It would be harder if they used the current esprinter and would require a charge at some point during the day (lunchtime or during site visits).

Both examples pie in the sky, first one does 14 jobs a day, that's literally 30 mins per job at 7 hours work, plus driving time, 150 miles on a bad day, I average across the year 130 miles per day, the other bloke goes no further then 16 miles from the office, in reality he has no need to go back there so frequently, both articles are trying to get people to consider the job, the reality is far different, how about planning a local days jobs then being redirected to Newcastle, or having to cover other areas to help out with their workload

 

[icowden]

how about planning a local days jobs then being redirected to Newcastle, or having to cover other areas to help out with their workload

So give an example. How far from Newcastle? What distribution of jobs and how many? Calculate the mileage involved.
I suspect you will find that you don't need a van that can drive 500 miles without refuelling.

 

[cougie uk]

Both examples pie in the sky, first one does 14 jobs a day, that's literally 30 mins per job at 7 hours work, plus driving time, 150 miles on a bad day, I average across the year 130 miles per day, the other bloke goes no further then 16 miles from the office, in reality he has no need to go back there so frequently, both articles are trying to get people to consider the job, the reality is far different, how about planning a local days jobs then being redirected to Newcastle, or having to cover other areas to help out with their workload

You do 130 miles a day ? So no need to charge on site ? Plug in overnight and you're sorted.

 

[DRM]

You do 130 miles a day ? So no need to charge on site ? Plug in overnight and you're sorted.

Wrong, average per day across 12 months, some days local most days in excess of 200