Zwift Chat

[steverob]

I took part in the first round of the Herd Winter Racing league today, but I wouldn't worry about missing a round as there's 23 in total - it doesn't end until next March! There are seven time slots from Friday evening to Sunday afternoon and you can ride a different one each week and it still counts towards the same league table.

It's an "E" category only, everyone starts together sort of race, so for a low-C like me, while I know I'm going to get shelled from the main pack within the first mile, it's fun to then try to find other groups behind that you are able to hold on to and can battle it out with. Also there's no primes, it's finishing line points only if that's more your sort of thing.

I finished 52nd out of 73; pushed hard to make a breakaway from my group coming down the final bit of the Epic KOM (course was the Ocean Lava Cliffside Loop) got myself a 6 second gap and managed to hold off all but two of them through the underwater tunnel to the finish line at the Watopia pier.

 

[Peter Salt]

That's the FRR series done

Will have to wait for official results till tomorrow, but I made some time on my main competitors today and hope to make it into the top 30 in my (lower 'B') category. Considering I only broke into 'B' a few weeks ago - I think that's alright.

I feel that these races improved my abilities - not sure if physical or mental (or both?) but they sure did something.

 

[alex_cycles]

That's the FRR series done

Will have to wait for official results till tomorrow, but I made some time on my main competitors today and hope to make it into the top 30 in my (lower 'B') category. Considering I only broke into 'B' a few weeks ago - I think that's alright.

I feel that these races improved my abilities - not sure if physical or mental (or both?) but they sure did something.

Well done mate! Legs will be strong after a couple of days rest you should do a new FTP test. It'll probably blow you away.

 

[<Tommy>]

Yup, me and at least 170 others. The league didn’t show in the Companion app until sometime today for some reason, so I expect more to join.

I took part in the first round of the Herd Winter Racing league today, but I wouldn't worry about missing a round as there's 23 in total - it doesn't end until next March! There are seven time slots from Friday evening to Sunday afternoon and you can ride a different one each week and it still counts towards the same league table.

It's an "E" category only, everyone starts together sort of race, so for a low-C like me, while I know I'm going to get shelled from the main pack within the first mile, it's fun to then try to find other groups behind that you are able to hold on to and can battle it out with. Also there's no primes, it's finishing line points only if that's more your sort of thing.

I finished 52nd out of 73; pushed hard to make a breakaway from my group coming down the final bit of the Epic KOM (course was the Ocean Lava Cliffside Loop) got myself a 6 second gap and managed to hold off all but two of them through the underwater tunnel to the finish line at the Watopia pier.

Thanks for the info

Do we need to sign up to to these series to be included in the tables or it’s automatic?

 

[Brusgaard]

Thanks for the info

Do we need to sign up to to these series to be included in the tables or it’s automatic?

You race - that’s it. At least for the DBR one.

 

[steverob]

You race - that’s it. At least for the DBR one.

Same with the Herd league, you automatically appear in the results after the final race of each weekend is over - https://zwiftpower.com/league.php?id=1310

 

[berty bassett]

finished the event and ive come away from it a bit dejected , certainly highlighted my weaknesses . small groups I can disrupt and take away a bit of their sprint then keep up but I get smashed in large groups as I haven't got the power. done the last one in a smaller field that could have been / was a mistake yet again didn't know where there was a sprint ( my fault ) got dropped by front group (also my fault ) thought , slow down a bit and keep in next group - it will be faster in the long run - wrong ! no-one took a turn at front even though one of them said lets work together ! think that was code for lets hide behind the muppet ! did 2 circuits like that and then thought I had nothing to lose by just trying to drop them so spent rest of race in no mans land apart from a little battle I had with a straggler from the front group
should I have done last one in a bigger field , maybe , still would have been dropped but maybe faster in the second group
the other platforms I have been on just have points to cross and a finish line so maybe chugging power is up but certainly sprint has plummeted so I walk away from it pushing bike head down wondering what to do
I've worked on flat courses a lot to up power a bit but aint gonna help sprint , so got to have a rethink
don't I moan a lot on a Monday

 

[Whorty]

finished the event and ive come away from it a bit dejected , certainly highlighted my weaknesses . small groups I can disrupt and take away a bit of their sprint then keep up but I get smashed in large groups as I haven't got the power. done the last one in a smaller field that could have been / was a mistake yet again didn't know where there was a sprint ( my fault ) got dropped by front group (also my fault ) thought , slow down a bit and keep in next group - it will be faster in the long run - wrong ! no-one took a turn at front even though one of them said lets work together ! think that was code for lets hide behind the muppet ! did 2 circuits like that and then thought I had nothing to lose by just trying to drop them so spent rest of race in no mans land apart from a little battle I had with a straggler from the front group
should I have done last one in a bigger field , maybe , still would have been dropped but maybe faster in the second group
the other platforms I have been on just have points to cross and a finish line so maybe chugging power is up but certainly sprint has plummeted so I walk away from it pushing bike head down wondering what to do
I've worked on flat courses a lot to up power a bit but aint gonna help sprint , so got to have a rethink
don't I moan a lot on a Monday

Not that my help is really needed, but don't forget that very few riders can climb and sprint ... we don't see Froome sprinting or Cav climbing .... I think Zwift makes us think we can all do everything but reality is we can't, so pick races that suit your strengths.

In a series there is a mix, like normal tours.

Maybe it's the familiarity of racing and beating the same people each week, we think we're somehow weaker when we race in a strong field. We're not ... it's just that there are stronger riders out there.

Sounds like you excelled in the climby bits, as expected

 

[<Tommy>]

finished the event and ive come away from it a bit dejected , certainly highlighted my weaknesses . small groups I can disrupt and take away a bit of their sprint then keep up but I get smashed in large groups as I haven't got the power. done the last one in a smaller field that could have been / was a mistake yet again didn't know where there was a sprint ( my fault ) got dropped by front group (also my fault ) thought , slow down a bit and keep in next group - it will be faster in the long run - wrong ! no-one took a turn at front even though one of them said lets work together ! think that was code for lets hide behind the muppet ! did 2 circuits like that and then thought I had nothing to lose by just trying to drop them so spent rest of race in no mans land apart from a little battle I had with a straggler from the front group
should I have done last one in a bigger field , maybe , still would have been dropped but maybe faster in the second group
the other platforms I have been on just have points to cross and a finish line so maybe chugging power is up but certainly sprint has plummeted so I walk away from it pushing bike head down wondering what to do
I've worked on flat courses a lot to up power a bit but aint gonna help sprint , so got to have a rethink
don't I moan a lot on a Monday

If you raced in B you would fair slightly better in the sprints because you’d have more chance to rest between sprints as the pace is lower than A. Unfortunately you get punished for joining races that take you over the 20 minute mark at full power.

Some people choose to avoid these types of races at all costs so they don’t fall into this ‘trap’

Spoiler

Morning!!

 

[Peter Salt]

finished the event and ive come away from it a bit dejected , certainly highlighted my weaknesses . small groups I can disrupt and take away a bit of their sprint then keep up but I get smashed in large groups as I haven't got the power. done the last one in a smaller field that could have been / was a mistake yet again didn't know where there was a sprint ( my fault ) got dropped by front group (also my fault ) thought , slow down a bit and keep in next group - it will be faster in the long run - wrong ! no-one took a turn at front even though one of them said lets work together ! think that was code for lets hide behind the muppet ! did 2 circuits like that and then thought I had nothing to lose by just trying to drop them so spent rest of race in no mans land apart from a little battle I had with a straggler from the front group
should I have done last one in a bigger field , maybe , still would have been dropped but maybe faster in the second group
the other platforms I have been on just have points to cross and a finish line so maybe chugging power is up but certainly sprint has plummeted so I walk away from it pushing bike head down wondering what to do
I've worked on flat courses a lot to up power a bit but aint gonna help sprint , so got to have a rethink
don't I moan a lot on a Monday

Mate, your fitness is off this planet.

I hope you don't mind me saying that each time you got dropped in this series it wasn't down to fitness or lack of sprint. I think it was just lack of course knowledge. If you knew where the segment was yesterday, you would have played it differently and managed to stick to the front group with ease without having to sprint - like this guy from your race: https://zwiftpower.com/profile.php?z=179133. Same when you lost the field on Aqueduc KOM on that flat race in France - you just didn't know it was there.

But you're also right in saying that 'second group' didn't really form properly in your race due to lower rider numbers. It did in my race and as a result I went around ~2 minutes quicker than you.

 

[alex_cycles]

Mate, your fitness is off this planet.

I hope you don't mind me saying that each time you got dropped in this series it wasn't down to fitness or lack of sprint. I think it was just lack of course knowledge.

I find course knowledge to be absolutely essential. It can compensate for lack of ability if you know where all the peaks and troughs and all the sprints and KoMs are. You can make sure you're in the right position to get the best possible result out of limited ability.
And, dare I say it, have a plan. (e.g. smash up Titan's Grove at 350Watts)

None of that would change how much of a bastard the Champs Elysées is for a lightweight though, but maybe get dropped a bit later.

 

[Whorty]

I find course knowledge to be absolutely essential. It can compensate for lack of ability if you know where all the peaks and troughs and all the sprints and KoMs are. You can make sure you're in the right position to get the best possible result out of limited ability.
And, dare I say it, have a plan. (e.g. smash up Titan's Grove at 350Watts)

None of that would change how much of a bastard the Champs Elysées is for a lightweight though, but maybe get dropped a bit later.

I'm heavier than you, with a bit more power, and I was dropped in Paris the same as you and without your help I'd have been much further back in the field. That course is just a real 'b'stard unless you're a big engine who can hold close to cat boundaries for the full race, and add in the odd sprint. I always get dropped in Paris!! Maybe I need to wear my aero gimp suit, see if that helps next time

 

[<Tommy>]

I'm heavier than you, with a bit more power, and I was dropped in Paris the same as you and without your help I'd have been much further back in the field. That course is just a real 'b'stard unless you're a big engine who can hold close to cat boundaries for the full race, and add in the odd sprint. I always get dropped in Paris!! Maybe I need to wear my aero gimp suit, see if that helps next time

The chaffing must play a part too?

To be honest though I find with all these conversations it’s normally
most relevant to the field your racing against. The race pace is dictated by the pack and that in turn defines how hard you find it. As you say, being closer to the top end, or above the top end of a boundary, is always going to put you in good stead. Also some races just have much stronger fields than others.

But really in lee’s case it’s a double whammy. He’s not near the top of the cat boundary, racing in a tough field. Even with a stronger sprint, when the sprints come around he’s not got much in reserve at that point.

 

[Legs]

The problem is that most Zwift races are won either in sprints, or in short efforts of 1-5 minutes on crucial climbs, so the vast majority of B races won't threaten to put the top contenders over category limits. Even the mystical autocat algorithm hasn't bumped up this guy (who, you can see, used to be an 'A'). What's the verdict of the Tragic Gimp Committee?

 

[Whorty]

The chaffing must play a part too?

To be honest though I find with all these conversations it’s normally
most relevant to the field your racing against. The race pace is dictated by the pack and that in turn defines how hard you find it. As you say, being closer to the top end, or above the top end of a boundary, is always going to put you in good stead. Also some races just have much stronger fields than others.

But really in lee’s case it’s a double whammy. He’s not near the top of the cat boundary, racing in a tough field. Even with a stronger sprint, when the sprints come around he’s not got much in reserve at that point.

It's a gimp suit ... the chaffing is part of the fun

i get Lee's position, and that's why it's unlikely anyone is going to self promote and end up like Lee. As Lee can see, it's frustrating being dropped, so why would someone choose a higher cat than their numbers ... just to get dropped? Especially if those riders are already getting dropped in the lower cat that they already race in?

Each to their own I guess ....