Winter Strength training

[Dusty Bin]

Fair point but I guess that is where most of the issue arises - what springs to people's minds when talking about a "strong" cyclist. Obviously there is a legitimate strength requirement in cycling but it is very low but it relates more to a highly conditioned aerobic capacity.

Certainly the word is regularly mis-used, no doubt about that. But in the context of this thread, the meaning is certainly more closely related to the OED definition, hence the references to gym work...

 

[Rob3rt]

Please try to avoid personal attacks on each other.

Would also be nice if you could prompt people not to keep posting the same thing over and over!

 

[VamP]

And cookies, cookies would be nice...

 

[Rob3rt]

And cookies, cookies would be nice...

As long as you aren't expecting Maryland! There is a shortage as I ate all the Maryland on the shelves in the week after the National HC!

I am currently working on the Malted Milk situation...

 

[VamP]

As long as you aren't expecting Maryland! There is a shortage as I ate all the Maryland on the shelves in the week after the National HC!

I am currently working on the Malted Milk situation...

Given that I'm currently starving myself in an attempt to reach race weight by Sunday for the regional champs in Ipswich, any cookies at all would be amazing.

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

I'll be thinking of you at our coffee stop later Vamp

 

[VamP]

I hate all you knuts whose season's are now finished!

 

[madpensioner]

Wow, this has moved on huh?

In the context of weight lifting strength has a different application than in cycling. It is neuromuscular meaning the ability of your central nervous system and recruitment of contractile muscle tissue to move a maximal load over short periods of time generally in the absence of oxygen (anaerobically.) In cycling strength is the ability to move a very light load over multiple revolutions per minute over much longer periods of time by the use of mainly the cardiovascular system in the presence of oxygen (aerobically.) They are opposite ends of the spectrum really and opposing goals. However, if you have the "strength" to walk then you have sufficient "strength" to cycle because the load bearing requirement is very small (and hence why endurance cyclists are more at risk of osteopenia etc)

Does weight training confer any additional benefit to cycle performance than doing just cycle specific training? It's possible but in reality highly doubtful. Specificity will always be the trump card. As an addition to a cycling program if you have time it may be of some use for a variety of non performance related issued (also IIRC there is a study where adding weight training on to an endurance programme increases the amount of mitochondria more than endurance training alone although the reasons were not really known) However, this does not necessarily equate to an increase in performance.

Anecdotally, if someone has seen a positive influence on their chosen sport by cross training that is terrific. However, that does not mean simply because there is a correlation that it was causative of that improvement.

I thankyou very much indeed for your feed back - weight training has provided me with core strength mainly - and i have read many scripts that indicate older sportsmen benefit from weight
training than the younger. I also found that high reps. has improved my breathing. the weights i use are cycling specific and only involve two exercises - squats and lats pull downs - the additional
exercises are rowing and crunches ( I am very fortunate to have my own gym ). I do realize that it does not on its own improve my cycling - however the increased core and leg strength has given me a
greater ability to improve .
Again - thankyou - Leigh

 

[Dusty Bin]

I thankyou very much indeed for your feed back - weight training has provided me with core strength mainly - and i have read many scripts that indicate older sportsmen benefit from weight
training than the younger. I also found that high reps. has improved my breathing. the weights i use are cycling specific and only involve two exercises - squats and lats pull downs - the additional
exercises are rowing and crunches ( I am very fortunate to have my own gym ). I do realize that it does not on its own improve my cycling - however the increased core and leg strength has given me a
greater ability to improve .
Again - thankyou - Leigh

So you start out by patronising anyone who asked you a question - and you finish up by agreeing with everyone. I can't wait to get to your age, it's gonna be awesome.

 

[Pedrosanchezo]

I love these threads. They never fail to amuse.

IMO there are two sides to the argument but for some reason neither party concedes this. One is right, not both.

Well IMO both are correct.
Cycling alone will not provide the best possible core from which the power will ultimately derive from. Core specific training is not done on the bike. Core training is widely known to aid power transfer and cycling efficiency, not to mention helping the ability to endure serious time in the saddle.
One could also argue, though not proven that i am aware of, that a cyclist can only train the muscles directly related to cycling. The result being that the cyclist is prone to muscle imbalance and/or future injuries that might otherwise be avoidable with a more rounded training program. Some cyclists add running etc to their training to prevent bones becoming brittle and have a more general fitness rather than cycling specific. Specific stretching also can be applied to ones training. Little of the above is "weight training" but it is not just "riding a bike" either.

End of the day though one could manage to become a very good cyclist just through cycling alone, with not one other bit of training at all. I don't think that person would be reaching their potential as an injury free cyclist or even utilising their power most efficiently, but that's just my opinion. It just happens to be fortunate for me that it also happens to be the similar view of the "strength and conditioning" GB cycling coach. The same guy who has all the cyclists in team GB partake in core strength training and adding dreaded "weights" to their schedule. Not just the track guys either.

FWIW, i ONLY do core training and do not subscribe to the view that weight training your legs will make you a better/faster cyclist. It MAY, i speculate, help to better balance muscle groups, if done correctly, but i do not personally find this a worthwhile or desirable end product.

 

[montage]

Can we just get a weight training thread locked to the top?
It would save people going to the trauma of having to search, and seeing as it is a pretty ongoing topic...

 

[Dusty Bin]

IMO there are two sides to the argument but for some reason neither party concedes this. One is right, not both.

Well IMO both are correct.

errr, what?

Can we just get a weight training thread locked to the top?
It would save people going to the trauma of having to search, and seeing as it is a pretty ongoing topic...

It's a good idea in principle - but whatever was in the thread, nobody would agree with it.

 

[Dusty Bin]

This 'core' argument always puzzles me a bit. Can someone explain to me why (from a cycling p.o.v) it would be necessary to train muscles that may not already get sufficient stimulus from cycling? And if they don't get sufficient stimulus from cycling alone, why is it necessary to train them for cycling purposes?

 

[Pedrosanchezo]

errr, what?



It's a good idea in principle - but whatever was in the thread, nobody would agree with it.

You should read that as each party thinks they are correct and do not concede both have a point.

This 'core' argument always puzzles me a bit. Can someone explain to me why (from a cycling p.o.v) it would be necessary to train muscles that may not already get sufficient stimulus from cycling? And if they don't get sufficient stimulus from cycling alone, why is it necessary to train them for cycling purposes?

The core argument is quite obvious imo. Better to push off an unflinching, non-flexing base than a weak base. Also cycling does not directly improve core muscles, so the time taken to achieve a solid core from cycling alone would be far more substantial than adding core training to part of your schedule.

 

[Dusty Bin]

The core argument is quite obvious imo. Better to push off an unflinching, non-flexing base than a weak base.

Surely this base already gets a workout whilst cycling? In which case, why does it need more stimulus than any other muscle which gets a workout from cycling? Surely the act of cycling itself is sufficient to train these muscles?

Also cycling does not directly improve core muscles, so the time taken to achieve a solid core from cycling alone would be far more substantial than adding core training to part of your schedule.

If cycling does not directly improve core muscles, then surely that would suggest that core muscles are not critical to cycling performance, no? It all sounds like a bit of a self-defeating argument to me...a bit like training your fingers to work the gear shifters better...