lane
Veteran
What happens mid march? Mainly second doses given through to end of May or middle of June? So it you don't get it by mid March you gotta long wait or have I misunderstood?
COVID Vaccine !
- Thread starter kingrollo
- Start date
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What happens mid march? Mainly second doses given through to end of May or middle of June? So it you don't get it by mid March you gotta long wait or have I misunderstood?
Ajax Bay
Guru
- Location
- East Devon
Yes. The plan is to ensure enough Pfizer vaccine from mid-March onwards for a second dose to match the Pfizer vaccination profile of 1 Jan - mid March (12 weeks) as well as further first doses. So from then the Pfizer supplies (profile) will go on second doses for 12 weeks (end May) and then revert back to Pfizer and Oxford-AZ together. Remember that a small amount (7M doses ordered) of Moderna are due mid March as well. Their use will need to be husbanded so that there's enough for first and second doses so I expect, for management ease) its use will be geographically focused rather than spread around the countries.
Increasingly the heavy lifting will be with Oxford-AZ (NB at 1/8 the price).
Increasingly the heavy lifting will be with Oxford-AZ (NB at 1/8 the price).
Don't think that's a stated target.
There is clear direction NOT to 'mix'. Except in extremis (detail in Green Book) the second dose is to be the same make as the first.
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vickster
Legendary Member
Never said that. I was pondering whether In March, those already vaccinated get Pfizer while those who get their first in March more likely to get AZ (and then second AZ in June). There’ll be a mix of use across the population not individuals. 40m Pfizer doses ordered will only vaccinate 20m people
midlife
Guru
Ah, sorry. Misunderstood your post. Makes sense now.
DCLane
Found in the Yorkshire hills ...
- Location
- Dewsbury, West Yorkshire
SWMBO was due hers a while ago but only had the first injection today - AZ version. She's NHS on a Covid support/rehab ward.
Ajax Bay
Guru
- Location
- East Devon
I said: "The direction to move to one dose and then a second at the 12 week point was sent out by NHS HQ (passing it on from JCVI) on 31 Dec."
I have a little more guidance from the BMA site:
"The MHRA, JCVI and [national] CMOs announced that the gap between doses should be extended . . . to 12 weeks in order to offer a first dose of the vaccine to more people in priority cohorts [faster].
". . . difficulties . . . hundreds or thousands of appointments with patients to receive the second dose [already made] . .
"As a transitional arrangement, pre-arranged appointments for the administering of second doses up to and including 10 January 2020 can still take place with written notification of clinical judgement.
"Appointments for second doses due to take place after that date [10 Jan] should be rescheduled to reflect the current guidance to delay for up to 12 weeks."
My 90+ year young mother received her second dose on 7 Jan - she expected that to be cancelled, but it wasn't.
Also that guidance reflects what @tom73 said a week ago about the second dose having to be given by the same organisation as the first dose.
"Patients will need to receive the second dose from the same practice grouping. In some cases, patients receiving a second AZ dose may do so at their own practice (as opposed to the original designated site), but only where their practice is part of their original practice grouping that delivered the first dose."
lane
Veteran
Thinking about this some more, I can't see the rate at which first vaccination are given not slowing after they start on second doses. They would need to get close to 4m a day and at the moment they are struggling to consistently do 2m. The target for the 4 top groups of mid Feb looks like it will slip to end of March by which time they will be doing the second doses. I can't see any way they will then get through all the over 50s by Easter - I would think more like late May early June.
lane
Veteran
My mum originally went for the Pfizer vaccination at Grantham but was refused due to allergies and told to wait for the Oxford vaccine. They booked her in at Boston then transferred her booking to Grantham. She decided to phone Grantham to double check and they said no they are only doing Pfizer so she then had to get back in touch with someone else to get re booked ta Boston for Monday next week. As she said right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing. Good that in her 80s she is able to resolve these issues herself.
Ajax Bay
Guru
- Location
- East Devon
I agree that daily delivery of first doses will surely fall from about 3 Mar as all those who received their first dose from 20 Dec onwards 'need' their second.
I do not discount the possibility that, based on the science of course, the 12 weeks may be extended. If at the 8 week gap point antibody levels remain as high as they had been found to be after 4 weeks, then there's clearly a case to be made for giving a million a second dose at 12 weeks and another million a 4 week extension. I would be amazed if the data capture programme was not ready to roll. The first cohort who were given a dose after 20 Dec have just hit the 4 week point and a lot of NHS staff are in that cohort so testing will be logistically easy. There will be a communications challenge with that, but the JCVI and MHRA were pretty robust with the '12 week gap' decision and so they have the palmares. We (the UK) is brilliantly served by those groups (and a side shout out to UK's superlative genomic capability, effort and honesty).
I am optimistic that the clear target of all those in Groups 1-4 to be offered a vaccine by 15 Feb WILL be hit. (I think you must mean 'end of Feb' as the slip date)
Comments:
1) We don't know what the refusal or can't be bothered rate is - 20%? - that'd be 3M less so 12M actually given.
2) Assumes supplies of the vaccine are not interrupted by 'events, dear boy, events'.
Still need to get the daily rate consistently up above 300,000.
Has anyone suggested that all over 50s might be given a first dose by Easter (4 Apr)?
There's about 6M in Groups 5 and 6 combined: 20 days? So by 6 Mar. About the time the second doses will need to be started.
Hope your mother's Boston date comes off.
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BoldonLad
Not part of the Elite
- Location
- South Tyneside
What did anyone expect from pensioners??
Quite! (I say that as a member of that illustrious group)
- Location
- London
Am no fan of this government but if this is true/no clever statistics jiggery pokery, I must say that this sounds like a very creditable performance.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55748645
Good points made above about very probable fall-off in march as doses have to be sent to second jab folk.
My mum had her first jab in semi rural lancs at the very end of december - am hoping/trusting she will get the second around the middle of march.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55748645
Good points made above about very probable fall-off in march as doses have to be sent to second jab folk.
My mum had her first jab in semi rural lancs at the very end of december - am hoping/trusting she will get the second around the middle of march.
- Location
- Somewhere wet & hilly in NW England.
Huge step up to around 340000 vaccinations for the day on Tuesday 19th as well.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/vaccinations
