COVID Vaccine !

[byegad]

I've spoken to quite a few vaccinated people, not least the nurses involved in my regular care.

A straw poll among them indicates lots of instances of AZ causing flu-like symptoms, but almost no adverse reaction to Pfizer.

One of the AZ'ed nurses had a nasty swelling on her arm and felt properly grotty for several days.

I think that extreme reaction is unusual, the other AZ people I've spoken to either had no reaction or felt below par for a day or so.

Yes, got my Oxford-AZ Friday evening and by Saturday as I got up I felt as if 'I was coming down with Something', By Sunday lunchtime I was back to normal, I suspect the vaccine sets off your infection response big time, which is a 'good thing' as it means you're body is ready to fight the actual bug.
Lady Byegad, who got her jab a few days before me had a similar experience.
Personally I'm looking forward to early May when I get my second shot, even if I have a similar reaction. Far better that than getting the bug.

 

[PK99]

Test and trace has been an obvious issue, but I asked this question a week or so back and haven't received a reply that I can remember, I would like to know which countries have made a success of Test and Trace. The only real positives I seem to find are in SE Asia, dealing with far lower numbers and possibly a far more intrusive use of personal data. We need a really good system to learn from, but I don't know where that is.

And despite apparent early success, Germany is not that place or system

 

[Julia9054]

Al has just got a text to book his vaccine. I'm surprised as he is 57 which means that either we are onto group 8 round here or that his blood pressure medication puts him in group 6 - which, reading all the literature about who is in group 6, we didn't think it did.
Really pleased (if a tiny bit jealous!)

 

[johnblack]

Although this article is 5 months old, it’s worth a read....

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...es-south-korea-germany?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

The crucial thing is that Germany’s system linked to existing health care structures and didn’t require a new network being set up. Public health and primary care are good at testing and tracing. Odd that they should largely be excluded from the UK system.

Germanys fell over as soon as they had a lot of cases.

 

[mjr]

In @mjr world, if the figures for actually vaccinated is not 100% in all those groups (1-4) then the government has, entirely predictably, just managed a big fat 'Freddie'.

When you have to resort to lying about other people's views, you know you are losing the argument! I never said the figures for actually vaccinated would be 100%. What I said is that Boris's address to the nation was quite clear that offered "means vaccinating", but I was quite willing to accept that there would be those unable and those unwilling who must be excluded from the count.

What there must not be is people who are able and willing to have the vaccine who have only had a farking message sent to them — and definitely not if a letter was sent and there is no confirmation of receipt yet, given the very variable state of the post service now. Even people waiting for appointments doesn't seem in the spirit of the target IMO.

Today, the BBC is reporting that "An "offer" means you've received an invitation for a vaccine, normally through a phone call, text or letter" and also that we do not know how many have been vaccinated or declined in each group.

If this is confirmed, Johnson and Hancock have pulled the testing mailshot stunt again. That must not be accepted IMO. I hope the BBC is mistaken on these and the target was really hit.

 

[Rocky]

Germanys fell over as soon as they had a lot of cases.

The UK’s never stood up......I agree it’s hard to find examples of a really good system but my point still stands...why invent a completely new system when you’ve got experienced people already in post? Ignoring primary care and the communicable disease parts of the public health network wasn’t the best way forward. Thank goodness the government changed tack for the vaccine roll out.

 

[johnblack]

The UK’s never stood up......I agree it’s hard to find examples of a really good system but my point still stands...why invent a completely new system when you’ve got experienced people already in post? Ignoring primary care and the communicable disease parts of the public health network wasn’t the best way forward. Thank goodness the government changed tack for the vaccine roll out.

What's the point of using a system that doesn't work, at least in trying something different you may hit upon a better way? I think we just have to accept that currently Track and Trace is not really viable, that may well change when we are dealing with far fewer cases and can use the experience of the past year to refine a system. Dido and her friends are a great target for mockery, and they didn't help themselves, but we need to put it into perspective, they failed, as have nearly every other country.

 

[Rocky]

What's the point of using a system that doesn't work, at least in trying something different you may hit upon a better way? I think we just have to accept that currently Track and Trace is not really viable, that may well change when we are dealing with far fewer cases and can use the experience of the past year to refine a system. Dido and her friends are a great target for mockery, and they didn't help themselves, but we need to put it into perspective, they failed, as have nearly every other country.

I’m not sure I agree with a couple of your points. I may have misunderstood but are you saying that primary care and public health test and tracing failed? It never had the chance, the app was given to NHS X to develop and Harding was brought in to head up a largely privatised service. My argument is that the country had the expertise and experience and this was ignored. That was a major mistake.

If I’ve misinterpreted your post, my apologies.

 

[johnblack]

I’m not sure I agree with a couple of your points. I may have misunderstood but are you saying that primary care and public health test and tracing failed? It never had the chance, the app was given to NHS X to develop and Harding was brought in to head up a largely privatised service. My argument is that the country had the expertise and experience and this was ignored. That was a major mistake.

If I’ve misinterpreted your post, my apologies.

No apologise required and I may have misunderstood yours too! Germany used local health authorities to contact trace and it worked while numbers were very low, then buckled as soon as numbers ramped up, so I'm not sure why ours would've faired any better, but you're right they didn't get the chance. I also think there was maybe a decision to take responsibility away as to not overload an overstretched and creaking service. Ideology would obviously have played some part. The use of outside help in the vaccine programme is a great example of how non NHS and the NHS can work together and should be used as template for future. The NHS as the knowledge and experience, but is such a huge and slow moving organisation that outside help for procurement, logistics and technology in times of emergency is vital.

 

[lane]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56069455

It's definite Asthma sufferers will not be prioritized unless taking oral steroids or have emergency admission to hospital

 

[AuroraSaab]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56069455

It's definite Asthma sufferers will not be prioritized unless taking oral steroids or have emergency admission to hospital

I guess they are working from stats on the danger, though I can imagine a bad case of covid would be more unpleasant to an asthma sufferer, even if their asthma is under control, than to the average non sufferer. There is a lot of variance between asthma sufferers anyway but presumably they had to look at the data from admissions and draw the line somewhere.

 

[vickster]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56069455

It's definite Asthma sufferers will not be prioritized unless taking oral steroids or have emergency admission to hospital

Not sure why my friend has been invited, doesn’t meet those criteria?

 

[marinyork]

Not sure why my friend has been invited, doesn’t meet those criteria?

A GP can bump someone into group 6 based on 'clinical judgement' and do out of order under 'extreme individual circumstances'. These are where a lot of group 6s have been done a bit early.

The same is true of a number of other conditions which are also 'not included' but very interesting and slightly scary when it comes to covid, it's just the tabloids focus on asthma.

 

[vickster]

He’s only 36 and was rather surprised to be invited

 

[Julia9054]

A GP can bump someone into group 6 based on 'clinical judgement' and do out of order under 'extreme individual circumstances'. These are where a lot of group 6s have been done a bit early.

The same is true of a number of other conditions which are also 'not included' but very interesting and slightly scary when it comes to covid, it's just the tabloids focus on asthma.

I guess this is what must have happened with Al then. He has hypertension under control with medication (like lots of middle aged men). The rules seem to say that hypertension is only in group 6 if it has also caused damage to the heart - which it hasn't in Al's case.