I am not conspiracy theorist so am struggling, it seems Sweden got it largely right with a sensible "light lockdown" so beyond reputation/career saving, why we are continuing down this crazy path I do not know.
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I am not conspiracy theorist so am struggling, it seems Sweden got it largely right with a sensible "light lockdown" so beyond reputation/career saving, why we are continuing down this crazy path I do not know.
Adam4868
Legendary Member
Don't know if anyone has read this..
https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-12-minute-covid-testing-service-within-weeks
120 quid ! whilst people have to travel for hours for a test.Surely if Boots can do this the goverment could have ?
Or is it just a case of capatalism at its best.
https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-12-minute-covid-testing-service-within-weeks
120 quid ! whilst people have to travel for hours for a test.Surely if Boots can do this the goverment could have ?
Or is it just a case of capatalism at its best.
classic33
Leg End Member
- Location
- The Cronk
It's a Mods post - the Mods a/c is not used for personal posts. Mods posts sent from personal a/c's (it's often faster and easier to do this) are clearly marked with 'Mod note' etc
The Mods too believe in freedom of speech. And, yes, the community can be relied upon to counter arguments etc.
Re the CV pandemic. Early on it was recognised that the various related threads would not only serve as a debate format but as an information service for our members. To this end we asked that posts containing information represented as fact include the source where possible.
As it is not possible for us to check every post made we rely on other members to report posts where this is not the case. Where we think the report requires follow-up action we will intervene by eg cleaning up the post, deleting the post, pm'ing the member to clarify the situation or directly intervening in-thread etc.
In this particular instance we had received reports, the statement was very powerful and we simply asked for a source link from the posting member.
For the record this action neither confirms or denies the accuracy of the posted information from the Mods team perspective - it's simply requesting the verification of the validity/accuracy of the posted factually presented information on behalf of our other members.
The original Mods post contained what we think is the official state of affairs in England up to the included date from an already accepted source perspective for clarity on behalf of our members. It is not an attempt to enter the debate - apologies if it comes across that way.
As an aside; one of the things we have debated as a team is the presentation of information as fact or opinion. It's an unfinished debate but the current view would be that content presented as facts should continue to be supplied with the appropriate links or reference to source material. In the case of opinions maybe the posting member should make clear that this is purely personal opinion within the post?
Perhaps if anyone has any ideas that would help they could send us a Contact Us message - please do not do this from in-thread.
A poster once asked where I got my information from and I answered honestly, I was first pointed to Dr Daniels by a doctor and it led from there..... The censorship of some alarmed me, they were being censored for offering a different opinion.
ONS stats, below normal spring due to light flu and late arriving virus, back to normal since June. Might stay below normal till week 52? Might not, but I think a lot of people who would now be entering hospital for "last days" died in spring and the covid arrivals appear to be far more robust than then. The death excess (% per population) is not likely for 2020 to stand out as an unusual year if this pattern continues.
ONS stats, below normal spring due to light flu and late arriving virus, back to normal since June. Might stay below normal till week 52? Might not, but I think a lot of people who would now be entering hospital for "last days" died in spring and the covid arrivals appear to be far more robust than then. The death excess (% per population) is not likely for 2020 to stand out as an unusual year if this pattern continues.
matticus
Guru
" The overall death rate for England from 1 January to 31 July 2020 was the highest since 2009 "
https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3348
... so although Mark's graph above looks like really bad figures, it might be fair to say that in a long-term context, 2020 is no record-breaking year.
p.s. anyone know why week 35-36 is such a safe period?? I might plan my skydiving lessons around that ...
- Location
- London
an honest thoughtful answer - thanks.
Jury maybe out on sweden's approach.
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
Well can you find it in a search? I didn't.
Elsewhere, I did find this graph of UK excess deaths. I think I can see 1958's Asian Flu pandemic, 1962's Big Freeze (and a particularly deadly London smog, the last before "clean air" laws) and 1969's Hong Kong Flu pandemic, among others. (edited because I got my flus backwards)
A pandemic would have to be as-lethal-as-possible and completely mishandled by governments to overcome the whole-society improvements in general health, advances in healthcare and better homes compared to 100 years ago.
The summer Bank Holiday and generally schools restarting, when lots of people stop summer travels and any killer heatwave is usually long gone? Maybe you'd get hospital space more easily then, but I guess it depends how hard your skydiving fails. Maybe you'd get mortuary space more readily too!
Jury's still out on all approaches, really. Sweden hasn't done well so far, compared to its neighbours. But I echo the thanks to @MarkF for his answers, even if I think he's still incomplete and listening to people who have been very wrong and not acknowledged that AFAIK.
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matticus
Guru
Oh sure - but I've quoted a comparison with 2009 (I didn't have a graph for all years, sorry). I don't think long-term healthcare improvements will impact on those variations.
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
Sorry: I was commenting on it not being record-breaking "in a long-term context". To break a long-term excess deaths record now would probably require something like a disaster rendering thousands of homes uninhabitable.
matticus
Guru
Indeedy.
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
144 cases from 333 tests at a third meat packery in mid-Norfolk. Rest of workers now to be tested. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-54694174
- Location
- Somewhere wet & hilly in NW England.
Communications in the coronavirus crisis: lessons for the second wave.
Interesting article re the challenges faced in disseminating key information to the UK population.
Includes views re decline in trust in Gov' and Media communications, public receptiveness to information, information inequality etc. Report is based on data up until mid-August:
https://reutersinstitute.politics.ox.ac.uk/communications-coronavirus-crisis-lessons-second-wave
Interesting article re the challenges faced in disseminating key information to the UK population.
Includes views re decline in trust in Gov' and Media communications, public receptiveness to information, information inequality etc. Report is based on data up until mid-August:
https://reutersinstitute.politics.ox.ac.uk/communications-coronavirus-crisis-lessons-second-wave
