Coronavirus outbreak

[PK99]

The measures taken in England appear to be a complete shambles. Boris has consistently failed to take strong enough measures, he has consistently failed to make them easy to understand, has consistently failed to make them enforceable. And as for the Manchester debacle, I am appalled that they have treated public health measures like some sort of commercial negotiation. I can’t see any realistic prospect of Sturgeon being able to close the border but hopefully with the onset of winter the number of holidaymakers from England won’t be such an issue.

We and the people we know in the real world have no difficulty understanding the rules as they apply to us.

In all the online/newspaper quizzes I score 100% - in one yesterday I scored only 7/10 - failing on questions about granny looking after kids (we do no have grandkids), student visiting parents (long past that stage), and large family groups - we do not have an extended family. All the questions about what I can do here and travelling between tiers were correct.

With regard to enforceable, my two daughters in Vancouver report that shops and people in general take more precautions than mandated.

Enforcement should not be an issue.

 

[Pat "5mph"]

Mod Note (take 2!)
Please quote reputable sources on making statements on this thread, as previously asked - Cheers!

Mod note:

Folks, it's come to our notice that some posts on here are sounding like conspiracy theories. Please don't do that - the internet is full of places to share this stuff but we'd like CycleChat not to be one of them.

If you are going to make claims about the way the crisis is going please back them up with reputable sources for your information. As has been stated before, Twitter, Facebook and Youtube don't count as such unless they are also backed up by reputable sources.

Thanks

 

[tom73]

Confused already by the tiers ? Government has a plan make it even more confusing with tier 3 1/2 or tier 4 a local only temporary lockdown.
https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/coronavirus-latest-plans-tier-4-restrictions-second-wave-736607

 

[Flick of the Elbow]

I would'nt bank on lower numbers judging by the present numbers arriving but as I have 2 trips to Oban this coming week I should get a better impression.

Apparently it’s half term in England this week (and next ? I don’t know) so hopefully their numbers will dwindle after that.

 

[oldwheels]

Apparently it’s half term in England this week (and next ? I don’t know) so hopefully their numbers will dwindle after that.

In the fairly recent past after the madness of the car racing in 2nd weekend of October most places shut. Those coming to my wife's funeral from the mainland {which had to be postponed due to the aforementioned car event} had difficulty getting accommodation. Mind you there were quite a lot came from afar.

 

[Bazzer]

To be honest, tho i have no medical expertise, i see wearing masks in the street as generally pointless. With regards to enforcement (or lack of) i was referring to actually on buses, trains, not in stations/transport hubs. Yes, the vast vast majority of folks in london are complying, though some folks outside london seem to think otherwise.

In terms of the infection in general spreading, so do I. But personally, I think it shows an element of public spiritedness and it should have been mandatory, (subject to medical exemption), anywhere in public.
This half arsed system we currently have is absurd. No spectators can go to Old Trafford, which seats over 70,000 and has ample room for social distancing, yet a car boot sale a few miles from me, is jammed every Sunday and from the little I have seen of it, social distancing is not part of the lexicography. However, were the same people at the car boot sale to go to a shopping warehouse such as Costco, they would have to wear masks.

 

[Blue Hills]

In terms of the infection in general spreading, so do I. But personally, I think it shows an element of public spiritedness and it should have been mandatory, (subject to medical exemption), anywhere in public.
.

Sorry, to impose something, presumably backed by at least theoretical sanctions and fines, for something you say is essentially useless is I think madness. Folk are suffering enough as it is. That's no way to build consent. People need to see good reasons. And are entitled to them.

I agree of course with masks inside and maintaining social distance.

 

[tom73]

In terms of the infection in general spreading, so do I. But personally, I think it shows an element of public spiritedness and it should have been mandatory, (subject to medical exemption), anywhere in public.
This half arsed system we currently have is absurd. No spectators can go to Old Trafford, which seats over 70,000 and has ample room for social distancing, yet a car boot sale a few miles from me, is jammed every Sunday and from the little I have seen of it, social distancing is not part of the lexicography. However, were the same people at the car boot sale to go to a shopping warehouse such as Costco, they would have to wear masks.

It would cut out any confusion and be a lot more simple all round for me the medical exemption is too wide and open to miss use.
Spectators in sport grounds as with pubs and other placers saying what's the problem we are covid secure is only part of the picture.
However much you try you can't control groups mixing at some point or meeting up with others on the way and from theses events or venues
We needed clear public messaging around the risk and methods of transmissions from the start. None of which we are getting leading to more confusion and miss-understanding. Most if not all the guidelines are why too wide open to misuse or all out clear bending of them.
Take football you can't watch the match but nothing to stop a club using a room in the ground. Allowing supporters to watch the the game live on TV. Even if it's a home match as long as the windows facing the pitch are covered. That's allowed one club did it.

 

[classic33]

It would cut out any confusion and be a lot more simple all round for me the medical exemption is too wide and open to miss us.
Spectators in sport grounds as with pubs and other placers saying what's the problem we are covid secure is only part of the picture.
However much you try you can't control groups mixing at some point or meeting up with others on the way and from theses events or venues
We needed clear public messaging around the risk and methods of transmissions from the start. None of which we are getting leading to more confusion and miss-understanding. Most if not all the guidelines are why too wide open to misuse or all out clear bending of them.
Take football you can't watch the match but nothing to stop a club using a room in the ground. Allowing supporters to watch the the game live on TV. Even if it's a home match as long as the windows facing the pitch are covered. That's allowed one club did it.

I for one, refuse to go round wearing a piece of card on a lanyard which tells everyone I've a condition(disability).

Challenged on Saturday as to why I wasn't wearing this lanyard/card combination. Then challenged as to what "allowed me to be exempt". I've the proof on me, but not on public display.

 

[tom73]

I for one, refuse to go round wearing a piece of card on a lanyard which tells everyone I've a condition(disability).

Challenged on Saturday as to why I wasn't wearing this lanyard/card combination. Then challenged as to what "allowed me to be exempt". I've the proof on me, but not on public display.

I agree with you the wide spread miss-use that the guidelines create is making you and others. Who really need understanding ,acceptance of your right to do what everyone else can do every the more harder. I should have phased it better what I meant was just listing things in such a vague way without even excluding mild form of conditions. Has just lead to many thinking it's say x I have it though it's never an issue so I won't bother. When you see many who could easily not wear one making an effort and other's not willing to as the list say's I don't have to. You do start to think the list need's a bit of work to beef it up to cover ones who can't be bothered and beefed up to fully support ones like you who really can't. Not to forgetting many like you have been willing to at least try.
For what's it worth I could given the wooly guidelines not wear one. But I'm not willing to exploit things when wearing one is no way a problem for me.

 

[classic33]

I agree with you the wide spread miss-use that the guidelines create is making you and others. Who really need understanding ,acceptance of your right to do what everyone else can do every the more harder. I should have phased it better what I meant was just listing things in such a vague way without even excluding mild form of conditions. Has just lead to many thinking it's say x I have it though it's never an issue so I won't bother. When you see many who could easily not wear one making an effort and other's not willing to as the list say's I don't have to. You do start to think the list need's a bit of work to beef it up to cover ones who can't be bothered and beefed up to fully support ones like you who really can't. Not to forgetting many like you have been willing to at least try.
For what's it worth I could given the wooly guidelines not wear one. But I'm not willing to exploit things when wearing one is no way a problem for me.

It's not a one off, but it's becoming more commonplace, "Where's your lanyard/card?" It's never been "Where's your mask?", just this piece on public display that some demand be worn.

As for misuse of the system, it's tighter now than when it was first introduced. Split into two tiers, as opposed to the one.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

How deadly is Covid?

But I think (deep down) we know this.

The post is nonsense, claiming (1)50% of Swedes have had the disease and (2)Sweden has herd immunity, and that this demonstrates an IFR of 0.12% (3)

(1) Serology studies in Sweden show infection rates at or below 10%.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31672-X/fulltext

(2) Case numbers in Sweden are currently rising rapidly which immediately falsified any claim of herd immunity.

(3) Reputable studies of IFR are typically in the range 0.5-1%.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971220321809
There are numerous regions with higher *population* fatality rates (Bergamo, NYC) than 0.12%!

Once again, you're posting demonstrably false claims.

But I think (deep down) you know this

 

[Bazzer]

Sorry, to impose something, presumably backed by at least theoretical sanctions and fines, for something you say is essentially useless is I think madness. Folk are suffering enough as it is. That's no way to build consent. People need to see good reasons. And are entitled to them.

I agree of course with masks inside and maintaining social distance.

I see the world very much black or white, so it seems to me to draw a clear line. (Although I appreciate for the likes of some, such as @classic33 there can be everyday problems). But there are many who look at the current rules and their "grey" edge and look to use it to their advantage,or benefit, either without thinking or caring about, the impact on the wider population. But I am told by Mrs B to try understand others do not see the world the same way.

 

[classic33]

I see the world very much black or white, so it seems to me to draw a clear line. (Although I appreciate for the likes of some, such as @classic33 there can be everyday problems). But there are many who look at the current rules and their "grey" edge and look to use it to their advantage,or benefit, either without thinking or caring about, the impact on the wider population. But I am told by Mrs B to try understand others do not see the world the same way.

You can view it in black and white, there's no issue with that. A set of conditions have been listed as valid reasons for not having to wear a mask, and I along with a load of others, meet those requirements. I'd rather not meet them, then there'd be fewer willing to feel like they have the right to pull me up in the street for not wearing a lanyard/card displaying that I have a disability.

 

[qigong chimp]

Mod note:

Folks, it's come to our notice that some posts on here are sounding like conspiracy theories. Please don't do that - the internet is full of places to share this stuff but we'd like CycleChat not to be one of them.

If you are going to make claims about the way the crisis is going please back them up with reputable sources for your information. As has been stated before, Twitter, Facebook and Youtube don't count as such unless they are also backed up by reputable sources.

Thanks

Oh no! The Mods have been nobbled by the lizard people, just as David Messiah Icke foretold...