Zwift Chat

[alex_cycles]

I don’t do much racing on Zwift and I can see how fastest sprint rather than first across line includes more people and opens racing that must be good but also I guess it leaves the system open for abuse for people to do little to no work majority of a race , blast for 15 seconds and claim a glorious victory
If enough people do that then I bet it’s an exciting 15 seconds but will lead to people having artificially low av w/kg when all the data would show massive 15sec , 1 min and poss 5min power
I would think that someone with a huge 5min power should be able to tone it down and tweak to a 20min very good power but we are all different I guess
I know I couldn’t keep my measily 5min power up for 20 mins , but tone it down a bit and I can go a bit further

I bought a turbo because I got fed up with the crap weather. Hated it for the first few months.
I didn't enjoy Zwift at all until I started treating it like a video game with a really expensive controller and until I tweaked the trainer difficulty to make it more realistic ride feel.
Thereafter it became an altogether different thing and the racing side of it has become quite addictive.

If you can think of it as a game - cartoon bike racing - which has some overlap, but is a different thing from real bike racing - it kind of puts it in perspective a bit more. Helps keep me fit and I'm still getting better and still enjoying it. I quite enjoy all the data-driven analysis and tactical side of it too. Also discovered, as with any video game, there are some skills that come with lots of practice e.g. drafting well, anticipating when to put in a dig so as not to get dropped on rolling terrain or hills, coping with time lag, surfing through a group to take FTS etc.

 

[alex_cycles]

You lucky so&so

500-600W to start and in the ZRL can be 400W for nearly a minute.

Obvs your numbers will be sightly higher, but could you get in the pens as soon as the prompt arrives (30 mins before race)
That would help a little bit, but you don't want to stay on the front for more than a couple of seconds.
Just checked video. Tuesday's ZRL I started at the front 300-400W and within 18s of the clock starting was under 200W for my first micro-rest, allowing myself to slip back a couple of rows for a better draft.

 

[<Tommy>]

The segments competition in ZRL races is starting to grow on me! So many "standard" races now follow the same old format of: start hard, settle down, sit in the pack, bit of a push if there's a hill, sit in the draft, sprint finish. At least the segments spices that up a bit and rewards riders with different strengths within your team. Also this last season I enjoyed the use of some new tactics on the segments which can be really rewarding if you get it right - eg on that New Yourk course I (accidentally!) worked out exactly where to attack the sprint segment and got a couple of FALs during the race by timing it just right (very rare for me to get FAL on a sprint!); and in the last race we got those FTS points by dropping off the back of the pack as a team and sprinting back on as the segment started. In short, it made it more fun and interesting to race. The one thing I don't like is how ZRL weights the points - that could definitely be improved IMO.

Yeah I mean it’s obviously just going to come down to personal preference. But series’ that divide between the two options. Or series that don’t have primes, would be nice for people who’d like more choice.

And like you say, I definitely agree the points are a bit skewed. The season before last was a good example.

 

[CXRAndy]

Obvs your numbers will be sightly higher, but could you get in the pens as soon as the prompt arrives (30 mins before race)
That would help a little bit, but you don't want to stay on the front for more than a couple of seconds.
Just checked video. Tuesday's ZRL I started at the front 300-400W and within 18s of the clock starting was under 200W for my first micro-rest, allowing myself to slip back a couple of rows for a better draft.

Last ZRL race was quite a bit tamer at the start, I did launch as usual, but I was able to drop into the 200s for power quite early. That hasn't been the norm for most ZRL. Last seasons Paris event. I was redlining going up to and around the Arc on lap 1. Maybe I'm a little stronger this season, so don't feel as stressed whilst making the same power.

 

[bridgy]

You lucky so&so

500-600W to start and in the ZRL can be 400W for nearly a minute.

Go back and look at the videos of the starts of your races in this season's ZRL- I don't think you'll find that's actually the case

 

[Joffey]

Go back and look at the videos of the starts of your races in this season's ZRL- I don't think you'll find that's actually the case

It is for me... this fat arse needs some serious watts to be put down to get it moving and up to speed

 

[bridgy]

It is for me... this fat arse needs some serious watts to be put down to get it moving and up to speed

You do over 400w for a minute at the start of a ZRL race?

 

[alex_cycles]

It is for me... this fat arse needs some serious watts to be put down to get it moving and up to speed

Try using a cattle prod instead of a turbo trainer. I'm guessing 50 Watts would be plenty

 

[berty bassett]

Looking forward to this ! Don’t know if I will contribute many points - but sweat will be flying 😁

 

[<Tommy>]

Try using a cattle prod instead of a turbo trainer. I'm guessing 50 Watts would be plenty

I’m no expert but 5000 watts feels like a safer bet.

 

[Peter Salt]

Looking forward to this ! Don’t know if I will contribute many points - but sweat will be flying 😁

What time slot are you doing?

 

[Whorty]

Watch out Berty, there are some uber powerful 2-5 mins C cats, capable of long anaerobic levels of power

 

[Whorty]

I don’t do much racing on Zwift and I can see how fastest sprint rather than first across line includes more people and opens racing that must be good but also I guess it leaves the system open for abuse for people to do little to no work majority of a race , blast for 15 seconds and claim a glorious victory
If enough people do that then I bet it’s an exciting 15 seconds but will lead to people having artificially low av w/kg when all the data would show massive 15sec , 1 min and poss 5min power

Probably not going to surprise anyone that I don't agree with this .... a 'normal' zwift race is like this yes. Cruise for 50 minutes, sit in draft, the odd punch, then sprint to glory. But the WTRL races are totally different - yes you can draft between primes, that's race craft, but with the various primes in the race there is no hiding and little rest. No one wins a WTRL race by doing no work - even if you don't get prime points, you need to attack them as if you will else you get dropped easily.

I guess that's why the 'cruisers', endurance, riders who have good top cat numbers don't max the points on WTRL, as the WTRL is definitely the race for punchers (except the bloody climbs where we all get dropped). But that makes it fun and exciting as anyone can get dropped in any race - in Paris I was dropped the end of lap 3 (of 5) and if it wasn't for Alex and an Italian chap dragging me round I'd have finished much worse than the 20 odd place that i was, and in the end a few seconds ahead of Andy and a chasing group.

I would think that someone with a huge 5min power should be able to tone it down and tweak to a 20min very good power but we are all different I guess
I know I couldn’t keep my measily 5min power up for 20 mins , but tone it down a bit and I can go a bit further

I think you're missing the point here ... that's like saying to Bolt ... you have a great 20 seconds power, but why not tone it down a bit and you'd be able to last for 1500 metres or longer and compete with Farah. Not everyone wants to be an endurance cyclist, some of us like to have a big 1-5 minute power, after which we are totally toast. This suits our riding style, build, love of cake ... if we were all the same wouldn't life be a bit dull?

I respect your endurance and climbing ability. It's amazing. I wish I could do that and sprint, but I can't. So I choose to focus on my core strengths which is 1-5 minutes and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. I like the mad sprints and the tactics needed to get points in the primes. I like going totally in the red, having nothing left but knowing I still have to somehow get to the end of the race to secure the points I've made ... bloody hard to do that by the way, when there is still 10km to go, you're having an asthma attack, the legs are jelly, and you've lost the pack and you're praying that you can latch on to any rider that catches you.

Good luck on the Flamme Rouge racing ... totally aimed at your style of riding. You'll do well and I, as I'm sure others on CC, will look forward to seeing you smash up those climbs.

 

[Whorty]

Obvs your numbers will be sightly higher, but could you get in the pens as soon as the prompt arrives (30 mins before race)
That would help a little bit, but you don't want to stay on the front for more than a couple of seconds.
Just checked video. Tuesday's ZRL I started at the front 300-400W and within 18s of the clock starting was under 200W for my first micro-rest, allowing myself to slip back a couple of rows for a better draft.

I'm noticing this too now in C ... I work hard the first maybe 20-30 seconds then it settles down really fast. It used to be that the first 1-2 minutes were crazy (still are in the Tiny races ... or is that the first 7 minutes, right up to the sprint

 

[Whorty]

Yeah I mean it’s obviously just going to come down to personal preference. But series’ that divide between the two options. Or series that don’t have primes, would be nice for people who’d like more choice.

And like you say, I definitely agree the points are a bit skewed. The season before last was a good example.

I think it's the FTS that needs addressing .. getting 20 points for an FTS, but on a lap race (like Paris) being able to potentially get multiple FTS seems very skewed. Putting the FTS at the same points as FAL would make more sense, plus only using a rider's best time in each prime for FTS.

But the rules are what they are unless WTRL decide to change them.