Zwift Chat

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Joffey

Big Dosser
Location
Yorkshire
Can people say if they prefer people to start in groups of 5 or at 20 second intervals.

So far, @IrishAl and @BurningLegs favour going off at intervals. I don't mind either way. And @Aleman posted a sad face! 😢

I'll go with the majority!

As a compromise, if intervals win, I'll let @Aleman be the only rider allowed to wear the Bike and Beer jersey! :biggrin:

I haven't worked out what the reverse compromise is if groups of 5 wins? :wacko:

Groups as it is less hassle. The more complicated we make it the more messed up it will get!! :laugh:
 
We can, in fact I suggested the same thing in the past. But other people made a good point that the time is only on the screen for a few seconds. So there’s every chance that not everyone will remember to make a note of their time if they’re hunched over their bars. Even if a couple of people forget it messes up the results. So in that sense it’s a bit flawed.

Not to over emphasis the point I hope but basically the only way of recording the time for the entire distance of race and to guarantee you gather accurate times is to use an official race.
You can see your time in companion app after the meet-up. 😊

I agree that it’s not as accurate. Typos, people recalling the wrong figures, or worse...
 

Whorty

Gets free watts from the Atom ;)
Location
Wiltshire
You can see your time in companion app after the meet-up. 😊

I agree that it’s not as accurate. Typos, people recalling the wrong figures, or worse...
Didn't realise this, but 100% spot on ... the meetup time from spawn is on the companion app, although I assume we would have to quit the ride as we cross the finish arch to get an accurate time :okay:
 

Aleman

Knees are FUBAR but I don't like to mention it
Location
Blackpool UK
Looking for a long ride today, as tandem IRL ride on Frankenbike, so picked the Kiss @ Race 100 Americas at 2:15 this afternoon ... lap and 2/3rds of Big Foot Hills. First event as a "Just About" C rider, any Chatters about for a solo TT effort :cry::cry::cry:

90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! :laugh:
Pain is just weakness leaving the body ... SHUT UP legs!!
 

Whorty

Gets free watts from the Atom ;)
Location
Wiltshire
Looking for a long ride today, as tandem IRL ride on Frankenbike, so picked the Kiss @ Race 100 Americas at 2:15 this afternoon ... lap and 2/3rds of Big Foot Hills. First event as a "Just About" C rider, any Chatters about for a solo TT effort :cry::cry::cry:

90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! 90% head, 10% legs! :laugh:
Pain is just weakness leaving the body ... SHUT UP legs!!
Would love to but legs are tired from a (virtual) Mt Ventoux climb yesterday which brought back painful memories of your BRVR league last year :cry:
 

Del C

Veteran
Location
Horley
Just caught up with all the replies and I think my brain hurts! :wacko:

Let's go with @IrishAl 's Google doc spreadsheet to capture times. That's a great idea and allows everyone to enter their time regardless of when they do it.

Then, let me explain why I initially suggested using a Meet Up to set the handicaps, and then I'll suggest an alternative approach. People can then choose.

Firstly, I thought it might be a bit more fun to do it as a Meet Up, rather than just going off and riding by ourselves, and I thought that adding groups might just add a bit of extra competition and motivation. However, it's true that the 2.5km lead-in undermines the group start, so we may as well go with a mass start. That's what we used to do on my road club TT.

Secondly, I thought if we do it on TT bikes in a Meet Up there's no drafting and its a level playing field. And if we used a Meet Up its more like race conditions, as we can all see the other CC riders and I thought the motivation to ride hard would be greater.

I thought these 2 things would ensure the handicaps were as accurate as could be. The point was made that for the first event how do we cover the fact that the first 2.5kms isn't included in the Strava segment. Well there are 2 options. Either ignore the 2.5kms and just take the handicaps from the 2 laps of the Strava segment. Or, just extrapolate the time to cover the extra 2.5kms. The segment is 10.49 miles or 16.88 kms. 2 laps is 33.76 kms. So the formula for this would be Time for 2 laps + 2.5/33.76 (Time for 2 laps) = Adjusted Handicap.

An example for this. Say it took 50 minutes to complete 2 laps of the segment, then the adjusted time is 50 + 2.5/33.76 (50) = 53.7 minutes

We could even put the formula for that into the spreadsheet, which would make huge numbers of people very happy!:laugh::laugh:

I didn't suggest using the Companion App time because we've discussed that before and rejected it. We thought using a Strava segment was more accurate and less subject to variability than relying on timing from Zwift. But if people now want to take the timing from the Companion App we can do that instead?

What's the alternative approach?

If we stay with doing CC events every 2 weeks, our next Meet Up event will be July 10, so we've got nearly 2 weeks to collect handicaps before then.

We all take responsibility to set up a Meet Up using a TT bike, so that it's a level playing field. Those that want to ride alone can do so (but remember you'll still have to invite someone or else the Meet Up doesn't work). Those who want to ride with others, can invite others or post up here if they want company. Whatever option you choose, it just has to be completed before July 10 and entered in the spreadsheet.

I think on balance, based on the replies here I'm tempted to go with this alternative. Everyone can set a time when it suits them and then July 10 is a proper handicap race.

So, in summary:

1. Can we all agree to use Al's spreadsheet. I can't see any downside to this.

2. Do we agree to set our own handicaps before July 10, in our own time or with others, and then make July 10 a proper handicap race?

3. Do we all agree to use the Meet Up function and a TT bike then when setting our handicap so that it's a level playing field?

4. Are we using the Strava segment of Companion App timing to set the handicaps? I'm assuming here that the Companion App time is the same as the on screen time? I don't know what happens if you keep on riding? Does that become another ride or does that time get tacked on to the on screen Meet Up time?
 

<Tommy>

Illegitimi non carborundum
Location
Camden, London
Just caught up with all the replies and I think my brain hurts! :wacko:

Let's go with @IrishAl 's Google doc spreadsheet to capture times. That's a great idea and allows everyone to enter their time regardless of when they do it.

Then, let me explain why I initially suggested using a Meet Up to set the handicaps, and then I'll suggest an alternative approach. People can then choose.

Firstly, I thought it might be a bit more fun to do it as a Meet Up, rather than just going off and riding by ourselves, and I thought that adding groups might just add a bit of extra competition and motivation. However, it's true that the 2.5km lead-in undermines the group start, so we may as well go with a mass start. That's what we used to do on my road club TT.

Secondly, I thought if we do it on TT bikes in a Meet Up there's no drafting and its a level playing field. And if we used a Meet Up its more like race conditions, as we can all see the other CC riders and I thought the motivation to ride hard would be greater.

I thought these 2 things would ensure the handicaps were as accurate as could be. The point was made that for the first event how do we cover the fact that the first 2.5kms isn't included in the Strava segment. Well there are 2 options. Either ignore the 2.5kms and just take the handicaps from the 2 laps of the Strava segment. Or, just extrapolate the time to cover the extra 2.5kms. The segment is 10.49 miles or 16.88 kms. 2 laps is 33.76 kms. So the formula for this would be Time for 2 laps + 2.5/33.76 (Time for 2 laps) = Adjusted Handicap.

An example for this. Say it took 50 minutes to complete 2 laps of the segment, then the adjusted time is 50 + 2.5/33.76 (50) = 53.7 minutes

We could even put the formula for that into the spreadsheet, which would make huge numbers of people very happy!:laugh::laugh:

I didn't suggest using the Companion App time because we've discussed that before and rejected it. We thought using a Strava segment was more accurate and less subject to variability than relying on timing from Zwift. But if people now want to take the timing from the Companion App we can do that instead?

What's the alternative approach?

If we stay with doing CC events every 2 weeks, our next Meet Up event will be July 10, so we've got nearly 2 weeks to collect handicaps before then.

We all take responsibility to set up a Meet Up using a TT bike, so that it's a level playing field. Those that want to ride alone can do so (but remember you'll still have to invite someone or else the Meet Up doesn't work). Those who want to ride with others, can invite others or post up here if they want company. Whatever option you choose, it just has to be completed before July 10 and entered in the spreadsheet.

I think on balance, based on the replies here I'm tempted to go with this alternative. Everyone can set a time when it suits them and then July 10 is a proper handicap race.

So, in summary:

1. Can we all agree to use Al's spreadsheet. I can't see any downside to this.

2. Do we agree to set our own handicaps before July 10, in our own time or with others, and then make July 10 a proper handicap race?

3. Do we all agree to use the Meet Up function and a TT bike then when setting our handicap so that it's a level playing field?

4. Are we using the Strava segment of Companion App timing to set the handicaps? I'm assuming here that the Companion App time is the same as the on screen time? I don't know what happens if you keep on riding? Does that become another ride or does that time get tacked on to the on screen Meet Up time?

Having read that I still don’t get why we can’t just jump on to an organised race and have a proper start and finish banner and an accurate time at the end. Maybe it’s just me. Whorty has pointed out that you have to stop right after the finish so you don’t record extra time. You have to do a math equation to allow for the lead in? Honestly none of this stuff is going to keep me up tonight and I’ll go with the flow. But we have a way of recording a race from start to finish without any math or chance of human error and we’re not using it. Maybe I’m missing something.
 

<Tommy>

Illegitimi non carborundum
Location
Camden, London
@<Tommy> - joining an organised event was explored but don’t think the times were appropriate.

Im not sure what time you guys are thinking. But I’ve just looked very briefly and there’s at least 5 races between 7 and 8 pm on Wednesday that we could piggy back onto. One of them is a TT.

I’d really like zwift to sort out the meet up function. Having the option of disappearing al the other riders is a good start. But isn’t it a bit of a non starter trying to race these things while there isn’t a start / finish banner?
 

steverob

Guru
Location
Buckinghamshire
@<Tommy> - joining an organised event was explored but don’t think the times were appropriate.
Yeah, while doing an event would make it a lot easier administratively, you can't really choose your course first. We'd have to pick a time and date and then look through the events at that time and hope that there's a suitable course being used by one of them, which is no guarantee.
 

<Tommy>

Illegitimi non carborundum
Location
Camden, London
Yeah, while doing an event would make it a lot easier administratively, you can't really choose your course first. We'd have to pick a time and date and then look through the events at that time and hope that there's a suitable course being used by one of them, which is no guarantee.

This is just me maybe Steve. But I don’t have problem with that. If anything doesn’t it add variation? We’ve just done the same course 4 times (?) in a row. There are so many races on zwift it’s not going to be hard to find one. If it is we can revert back to a meet up for that day. But at the moment we haven’t even tried it this way. For what it’s worth it’s the system they use on the ttt races on Thursdays and it works well.

You could argue it makes it harder to pick handicaps and I think that’s true. But the handicaps are a stab in the dark anyway to be honest. So why not at least race a proper race.
 

steverob

Guru
Location
Buckinghamshire
I don't disagree - I'd quite like to do it as a race. It's just on this occasion I think everyone's already gone so far with the planning of using Tick Tock, that it's going to be a much tougher sell to bin it now and pick a different route. Future races however, I'm up for having our course chosen for us (or at least the options narrowed down by) what's available on the events calendar.

On that note however, I didn't get a chance to get outdoors on my bike today, so it looks like I'm going to be Zwifting instead. It might just be that I could do my two laps of Tick Tock this afternoon/evening if anyone wants to join me...
 
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