The CycleChat Helmet Debate Thread

[mjr]

Under the heading:
What is not Covered? Significant Exclusions or Limitations.
It reads:
An Accident resulting in a head injury If You were not wearing approved protective headgear manufactured to BS EN 1078 Snell certified, at the time of the Accident.

Hang on a minute! That's even worse: they refuse to cover the entire Accident and not only the head injury!

It also seems a bit obnoxious: Snell certified is different to EN 1078. EN 1078 is the bog standard for helmets. Snell is a bit tougher and Wiggle currently do not sell any Snell certified helmets (I checked when querying Wiggle sportive terms which also require a Snell certified helmet).

I recently slagged off www.bikmoplus.com insurance because it has an awkward definition of "immovable object" and refuses to cover non-violent-entry burglaries, but its personal accident section says nothing about helmets.

What a stroke of luck that the people selling the insurance that calls for cycle helmets also sell cycle helmets. What are the chances of that eh?

And if you buy a helmet from them, it leaves you at risk of not getting a payout - talk about protecting their revenue, eh?

 

[Absinthe Minded]

@mjray I agree with everything you say. I did query them on exactly what certification the helmet needed to be and they said that either one would do.

 

[srw]

Keen to find out which Insurance company. Circa 2011/2012 there was a case where the court ruled that compensation amount for a cyclist with brain damage was reduced because he did not wear a helmet even though it was not compulsory. There was anticipation at that time that Insurance companies will move to cover their exposure but I don't think it came to pass unless this was a recently introduced condition.

Not quite - and not relevant to this, which is personal accident not third party cover. I'm not the person to give details and I'm on a phone.

https://cycleinsurance.wiggle.co.uk/

That's the link to the Wiggle insurance site. You can judge for yourself if the benefits are valuable. Red Sands are a Gibraltar company and Wiggle their UK Appointed Rep. There are bits of the FAQ wording which make my eyebrows twitch.

 

[ufkacbln]

The insurance company do realise that EN 1078 and Snell certification are different?

If the do really mean Snell, then they exclude most major manufacturers including Giro, Met, Kask and POC who do not have Snell certifications

Clever move as they are on a real winner because they will be able to exclude your claim if you do not have the correct helmet either

We should be boycotting these absurd policies

 

[ufkacbln]

Wiggle have a habit of excluding the inferior EN1078 helmets

If you read the conditions for their events:

It is mandatory that all riders wear a safety approved cycling helmet complying with latest ANSI Z90/4 or SNELL standards. Any rider not wearing a helmet will not be covered by the event insurance and will be disqualified from the event and could be liable for damages if involved in an accident on that basis. The rider must accept this as a condition of entry. UK Cycling Events reserve the right to refuse entry to the event to anyone with inappropriate equipment or clothing.

Perhaps one should suggest they only sell helmets that they would insure and allow on their own events, then see just which ones they are deeming inadequate for use, yet still selling to the ill-informed public

 

[ufkacbln]

A quick look suggests that if they are requiring Snell certification, then Wiggle are stating that the vast majority of helmets they sell are so inadequate they will not accept them for insurance purpose

Events are slightly better, but even the Kask Mojito (as above) is excluded from a Wiggle a Sportive..... as it only lists EN1078, and not ANSI certification

 

[Absinthe Minded]

The policy says you can use any of the following certified helmets:

...protective headgear manufactured to BS EN 1078 Snell certified...

The insurance company do realise that EN 1078 and Snell certification are different?

Yes, they do.

If the do really mean Snell, then they exclude most major manufacturers including Giro, Met, Kask and POC who do not have Snell certifications

No, they don't.

 

[ufkacbln]

The policy says you can use any of the following certified helmets:

Yes, they do.No, they don't.

Care to post the paragraphs that confirm this?

In none of the 20 pages of the Polcy Wording does it list helmets, it would be interesting to see the actual statement that gives lists of certified helmets

 

[Absinthe Minded]

Care to post the paragraphs that confirm this?

I already have:

It's with Wiggle - well, I should say it's through Wiggle - they use Red Sands Insurance Company. Let me dig out the wording and I'll edit this post...

EDIT:
Under the heading:
What is not Covered? Significant Exclusions or Limitations.
It reads:
An Accident resulting in a head injury If You were not wearing approved protective headgear manufactured to BS EN 1078 Snell certified, at the time of the Accident.

 

[ufkacbln]

I already have:

That is the same unclear paragraph that does not in any way constitute your claimed statement;

The policy says you can use any of the following certified helmets:

This appears to suggest a list, and it now appears that there is no such paragraph or list

 

[MontyVeda]

That is the same unclear paragraph that does not in any way constitute your claimed statement;


This appears to suggest a list, and it now appears that there is no such paragraph or list

it also appears to suggest BS EN1078 or SNELL certification... guess it depends on how picky you want to be.

 

[Profpointy]

does personal injury insurance specifically for cycling really make much sense? I don't have tripping on the pavement insurance, diy accident insurance, or struck by lightening insurance, piano falling on my head insurance. All bar one of those has nearly caused me injury.

Fine to have personal accident insurance, but a special one just for cyling - not so.much

 

[ufkacbln]

it also appears to suggest BS EN1078 or SNELL certification... guess it depends on how picky you want to be.

Therein lies the issue - very bad wording, it is not clear whether it is EN1078 OR Snell, EN1078 AND Snell the two have very different implications and it also leaves the question of whether CPSC, ANSI, or other helmets are valid. Despite claims otherwise there is nothing on the site to clarify this or state which helmets are covered by the policy

If I was going to pay for a policy that was unclear whether it was going to cover me - VERY picky indeed.

 

[Absinthe Minded]

That is the same unclear paragraph that does not in any way constitute your claimed statement;

What do you want then, a copy of my policy? I can send you one if you like, but I am just copying and pasting from my policy wording.

This appears to suggest a list, and it now appears that there is no such paragraph or list

There is a list, and I have already given you that:

...protective headgear manufactured to BS EN 1078 Snell certified...

 

[Absinthe Minded]

Therein lies the issue - very bad wording, it is not clear whether it is EN1078 OR Snell, EN1078 AND Snell the two have very different implications and it also leaves the question of whether CPSC, ANSI, or other helmets are valid. Despite claims otherwise there is nothing on the site to clarify this or state which helmets are covered by the policy

If I was going to pay for a policy that was unclear whether it was going to cover me - VERY picky indeed.

Why would you be unclear about it covering you? You just pick one of their 'supported' certifications and that's it. If you've already got a helmet that isn't one of those then you just email them and ask are you covered.