So, this might have happened... NBD - 2016 Fuji Touring workhorse

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Vantage

Carbon fibre... LMAO!!!
Personally I wouldn't do anything to the Brooks other than rub a bit of the provided cream into it.
Soaking the thing in oils/other concoctions can pretty much destroy it. Many a Brooks fan will no doubt back me up on this, specially as modern Brooks saddles seem to made with softer leather than previous generations.
You'll find that after about 500 or so miles it'll start sagging to the rough shape of your arse (quicker if you take it out on a wet rainy ride) whereupon it'll keep that shape for many a year*. A tension tweak every so often may or may not be needed.
* so I've heard. Mines only 3 years old.
Nose up/down for me a comfort thing. If the saddle is level I find the weight on my arms is very heavy. Nose up keeps things balanced between arse and hands.
I've yet to see a Brooks saddle perfectly straight other than when new. Tension has nothing to do with it except in extreme cases. The leather stretches with use. The top will sag while the sides remain taught so using the spanner to straighten it won't work. It'll just bugger up the saddle.
 
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wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
Personally I wouldn't do anything to the Brooks other than rub a bit of the provided cream into it.
Soaking the thing in oils/other concoctions can pretty much destroy it. Many a Brooks fan will no doubt back me up on this, specially as modern Brooks saddles seem to made with softer leather than previous generations.
You'll find that after about 500 or so miles it'll start sagging to the rough shape of your arse (quicker if you take it out on a wet rainy ride) whereupon it'll keep that shape for many a year*. A tension tweak every so often may or may not be needed.
* so I've heard. Mines only 3 years old.
Nose up/down for me a comfort thing. If the saddle is level I find the weight on my arms is very heavy. Nose up keeps things balanced between arse and hands.
I've yet to see a Brooks saddle perfectly straight other than when new. Tension has nothing to do with it except in extreme cases. The leather stretches with use. The top will sag while the sides remain taught so using the spanner to straighten it won't work. It'll just bugger up the saddle.

Thanks - I've come to broadly the same conclusions re. treatment; if you dig a little deeper pretty much every touted softener / treatment is said by some to degrade the leather over time. It seems that (from researching leather garment care) mink oil is the gold standard, although I imgine that doesn't come from happy mink that once roamed wild, so I'll give that a miss.

I understand that the saddle will naturally sag as it conforms to my arse, however I think this is probably going to be exacerbated by lack of nose tension. Mine has basically zero tension on it and when squeezing the sides in (which straightens out the line along the top) the bearing surface of the bracket at the front squares up to the tensioning nut; suggesting that winding this in will pull it a bit straighter; but that remains to be seen!

I wonder if you setting yours nose up is allowing you to move back in the saddle a bit more to a more comfortable position?


I couldn't resist having a go at the saddle today; being an impatient sod.

It was pretty dirty so the first port of call was a warm wash in the shower with some mild detergent, which yielded lots of brown water and bits. Once wet it became very pliable so I pulled the two wings on the sides inwards and secured them by wedging the handle of a scalpel (the nearest appropriate flat thing) against the rails (hard to explain but nobody probably cares anyway :laugh:).

I left it out in the sun for a bit to dry (should probably have left it longer tbh) then applied some wax leather treatment to all accessible surfaces, however really the product was too dried out to be of any use. In the hope of getting it to soak in a bit more I applied some heat with a hairdryer, but that just made it dry out more; the lumpy excess eventually requiring removal with a bit of white spirit :rolleyes:

Next I broke out the good stuff and slapped on some Granger's G-wax (intended for hiking boots etc), again with some heat to keep it liquid, while moving it around so that the areas of the saddle soaking it up faster got more. Once cool and dry I buffed off the excess on the top and left the underside alone.

Once the scalpel was removed the sides stayed put, as did the upper profile which has become a fair bit straighter - the static deflection in the middle between the high points at each end falling from 16mm to 8.

It's now back on the bike awaiting a nose-tweak once the tool arrives. I might chuck on a bit of Brooks' own treatment too just for the crack, although some sources on the net proclaim it to be not much more than shoe polish, so I'm not expecting miracles.

It looks a lot better than it did however still a bit tatty; but I guess that's part of the charm..

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The seatpost clamp, which appears to be identical to that on my Genesis (branding notwithstanding). IMO one of the better ones I've used with precise angle adjustment thanks to the clamping bolt arrangement..

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Back on the bike..

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Since being "reset" the wings / sides of the saddle sit much further inboard (maybe 1/2" each side at their rear) making the nose a lot skinner where the saddle starts to widen.. This is welcome as I was aware of the sides of the saddle previously when pedalling. I imagine they'll splay out a bit again one my bulk's perched on top, but hopefully not as much as previously once the nose has had some tension added.

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:smile:
 
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wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
After a pretty miserable day I was looking forward to a bit more work on the Fuji following the arrival of some more bits.

Things got off to a crap start with the saddle adjustment. Opening the box for the Brooks "care kit" revealed a poorly finished, stamped, chromed spanner that looks like a piece of cheap tat out of a cracker, a tiny 25ml tin of "proofide" leather treatment and a cloth. I've found preferable ways to spend twelve quid..

12x8_IMG_5608a.jpg



I gently wound some tension onto the nose adjustor on the saddle (which started off loose), and as @Vantage suggested, this did little to affect the saddle's shape. At this point I also noticed that the front end of the saddle's frame hasn't been fitted onto the leather centrally / squarely, and one of the rivets is pished. All in all my experience of this revered saddle maker isn't shaping up too favourably :rolleyes:

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The new chain also arrived yesterday. KMC chains are supplied with a very minimal, sticky grease - which is probably good for both corrosion protection and wear prevention (since it's not going to allow grit to migrate into the links) however it's horrible to handle and I know from that fitted to my CdF is an absolute magnet for contamination.

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After comparison with / checking of the existing chain, one link pair was removed from the new one and it was slung in the wax pan.


Once the chain had been fitted it was pretty much dark, but I cracked out the lights and set out on a test ride around the village. With things initially feeling good, I pushed out the distance - finding the conditions pretty good (barring the odd bit of drizzle) and figuring I could do with a mental health boost.

Things started to fall apart a couple of villages out when I got out of the saddle to attack a hill; the extra load on the cassette causing the rear wheel to skew in the dropouts and bind against the LH chainstay. What little speed I had rapidly disappeared and I spent a very long second trying to get my foot out of the toe cage before I accepted my fate and keeled over onto the road :rolleyes:

While arguably this was a situation of my own making for not tightening the rear QR sufficiently, judging by the total lack of paint on the chainstays in the proximity of the tyre this isn't the first time this has happened..

QR done up brutally tight I continued on my way, growing increasingly irritated by the clicking / creaking that continues to eminate from the seatpost assy; despite the liberal amounts of grease added to the clamp area when the saddle was refitted. Increasingly uncompromising amounts of torque were metered out to the clamp screws, but again nothing worked.

While lovely and quiet the new chain appears to have done sod all to address the ghost-shifting issue, which took me by surprise on a couple of occasions - pinging back and fourth between sprockets as I tried to put some power through them :rolleyes:

I've visually checked the RD again and everything appears straight; I'm wondering if could be due to frame flex (although somewhat unlikely given how bloody heavy it is) or maybe a problem with the short cable runs - will try to pay more attention to steering input next time it happens.

After an infuriating and disappointing ride, the final insult came on a gravel path in the nearest town where my ever-dimming headlight (and now-dead crappy USB front light) failed to illuminate a large rut; putting me on my arse again and making a mess of my knee / the saddle / shifter :rolleyes:

The bike remains infuriating and disappointing to ride, and I'm increasingly feeling like putting a disc cutter through the hateful contraption tbh..
 
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Vantage

Carbon fibre... LMAO!!!
After a pretty miserable day I was looking forward to a bit more work on the Fuji following the arrival of some more bits.

Things got off to a crap start with the saddle adjustment. Opening the box for the Brooks "care kit" revealed a poorly finished, stamped, chromed spanner that looks like a piece of cheap tat out of a cracker, a tiny 25ml tin of "proofide" leather treatment and a cloth. I've found preferable ways to spend twelve quid..

View attachment 657792


I gently wound some tension onto the nose adjustor on the saddle (which started off loose), and as @Vantage suggested, this did little to affect the saddle's shape. At this point I also noticed that the front end of the saddle's frame hasn't been fitted onto the leather centrally / squarely, and one of the rivets is pished. All in all my experience of this revered saddle maker isn't shaping up too favourably :rolleyes:

View attachment 657793


The new chain also arrived yesterday. KMC chains are supplied with a very minimal, sticky grease - which is probably good for both corrosion protection and wear prevention (since it's not going to allow grit to migrate into the links) however it's horrible to handle and I know from that fitted to my CdF is an absolute magnet for contamination.

View attachment 657794

View attachment 657795

After comparison with / checking of the existing chain, one link pair was removed from the new one and it was slung in the wax pan.


Once the chain had been fitted it was pretty much dark, but I cracked out the lights and set out on a test ride around the village. With things initially feeling good, I pushed out the distance - finding the conditions pretty good (barring the odd bit of drizzle) and figuring I could do with a mental health boost.

Things started to fall apart a couple of villages out when I got out of the saddle to attack a hill; the extra load on the cassette causing the rear wheel to skew in the dropouts and bind against the LH chainstay. What little speed I had rapidly disappeared and I spent a very long second trying to get my foot out of the toe cage before I accepted my fate and keeled over onto the road :rolleyes:

While arguably this was a situation of my own making for not tightening the rear QR sufficiently, judging by the total lack of paint on the chainstays in the proximity of the tyre this isn't the first time this has happened..

QR done up brutally tight I continued on my way, growing increasingly irritated by the clicking / creaking that continues to eminate from the seatpost assy; despite the liberal amounts of grease added to the clamp area when the saddle was refitted. Increasingly uncompromising amounts of torque were metered out to the clamp screws, but again nothing worked.

While lovely and quiet the new chain appears to have done sod all to address the ghost-shifting issue, which took me by surprise on a couple of occasions - pinging back and fourth between sprockets as I tried to put some power through them :rolleyes:

I've visually checked the RD again and everything appears straight; I'm wondering if could be due to frame flex (although somewhat unlikely given how bloody heavy it is) or maybe a problem with the short cable runs - will try to pay more attention to steering input next time it happens.

After an infuriating and disappointing ride, the final insult came on a gravel path in the nearest town where my ever-dimming headlight (and now-dead crappy USB front light) failed to illuminate a large rut; putting me on my arse again and making a mess of my knee / the saddle / shifter :rolleyes:

The bike remains infuriating and disappointing to ride, and I'm increasingly feeling more and more like putting a disc cutter through the hateful contraption tbh..

I came to the conclusion some time ago that certain bikes are just plain awkward t***s hell bent on causing as much grief as mechanically possible.
My Dawes Vantage was a blessing. Nothing ever went wrong with it and any time I needed to adjust something it was plain sailing.
The current Spa Wayfarer is just a complete and utter bas***d in every way possible. Constant issues and even the simplest of adjustments turns into a 2 hour long battle using every swear word ever conceived.
I can guess which category your new toy falls into :laugh:^_^
 

freiston

Veteran
Location
Coventry
I've visually checked the RD again and everything appears straight; I'm wondering if could be due to frame flex (although somewhat unlikely given how bloody heavy it is) or maybe a problem with the short cable runs - will try to pay more attention to steering input next time it happens.

I would not be able to confirm a gear hanger to be straight just by looking at it (though I would probably be able to tell if it was really bent). I use a home-made gear hanger adjuster (basically a length of square section steel with a bolt through it that screws into the hanger) and measure the gap between the tool and the rim top & bottom, left & right (keeping the valve in the same position as the tool lest the wheel be out of true). I reckon I can get it within <5mm at the rim.
 
OP
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wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
I came to the conclusion some time ago that certain bikes are just plain awkward t***s hell bent on causing as much grief as mechanically possible.
My Dawes Vantage was a blessing. Nothing ever went wrong with it and any time I needed to adjust something it was plain sailing.
The current Spa Wayfarer is just a complete and utter bas***d in every way possible. Constant issues and even the simplest of adjustments turns into a 2 hour long battle using every swear word ever conceived.
I can guess which category your new toy falls into :laugh:^_^
lol - yeah, it certainly seems that way; glad I'm not the only one!

My Routier's a bit like that too, mainly because of tight clearances at the back and lack of QR wheels, which makes any work that requires rear wheel removal "fun". I've kind of made a rod for my own back with this one though, as part of that is down to (really too large) tyre choice.

While design and quality differences obviously play a part, I think there's a lot to be said for going through a bike top to bottom and making sure everything is sound so that it's less likely to present a problem down the line.

My Genesis has been (largely) great in this regard, but then I guess it's not fair to compare a brand new bike of that price with much older, neglected examples.

Sorry to hear about the Spa - they seem very well regarded it seems.. what's wrong with it?


I would not be able to confirm a gear hanger to be straight just by looking at it (though I would probably be able to tell if it was really bent). I use a home-made gear hanger adjuster (basically a length of square section steel with a bolt through it that screws into the hanger) and measure the gap between the tool and the rim top & bottom, left & right (keeping the valve in the same position as the tool lest the wheel be out of true). I reckon I can get it within <5mm at the rim.
Thanks - you're probably right but I figured eyeballing it to make sure it's not horribly out of line was a start. I could probably do with a tool as you describe, however it's one of those that I'm likely to use so rarely and would probably take up a fair bit of space.. would be a nice thing to have though, just to be sure!


Yet again the Fuji has consumed a large chunk of my day. Chasing the various noises I've had the seatpost out; thoroughly cleaned and greased it again.. achieving nothing. I've stripped, cleaned and re-lubed the seatpost clamp, again achieving nothing (although I do need to properly torque it up yet).

The clicking was at the same point on the pedal stroke each time (DS crank at around 6 O'clock), was present regardless of chainring selected and went away if I put a lot of load through the pedals.

After I got nowhere with the seatposy assy I took a look at the BB. Thanks to last week's work the crank came out beautifully and I found the DS BB bearing cup required very little torque to remove, while it was incorrectly lubed with what looked like moly grease. After some cleaning with a toothbrush and paraffin the threads showed a reasonable amount of corrosion and fretting... at this point I was pretty sure I'd found the source of the noise...

The NDS cup seemed much better fitted; requiring more force to remove, apparently retaining its original lubrication and showing no signs of damage to the threads. As such I didn't go to town cleaning it.

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Unfortunately I found the plastic guard inside to be broken; perhaps because it's been squashed between the two cups.. the "68mm" shell on the bike measured 67.7mm so is slightly under-size; not sure what sort of tolerances these parts requre..

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The toothbrush and paraffin made light work of the inside of the bottom bracket shell and all looked good, barring some light corrosion on the DS. These threads and those on the DS cup were further cleaned out with a wire brush and refitted with some of this - which miraculously turned up on the back of the car recently :becool:

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I only tightened the BB cups to their minimum value (35Nm) and went out for a test ride; confident that I'd nailed the problem.. except I hadn't and the click remained.

The crankset came off again and the cups wound up to their full torque value of 50Nm, but this did nothing to sort the noise either. Next stop were the NDS crank arm bolts, again wound up to their full value of 14Nm with no change. I also checked the chainring bolts, which were all tight.

On one subsequent test ride I tried to narrow down where the noise was coming from and I reckoned I could feel it through the LH pedal. Once back both pedals were removed; proving to be loose, dirty, poorly lubricated and showing evidence of fretting / transferred material from the crank arms on the threads of one..

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The threads were cleaned up using the usual method, then the pedals refitted with copper grease and the spanner given a smack with a mallet to nip them up. A quick test ride confirmed these were indeed the culprit - the ride now gloriously quiet (apart from the incessant creaking from the saddle area :whistle:).

Tbh I'm tempted to replace the pedals as they appear to be MTB items so are a bit out of keeping with the bike, while the bearings in them sound rough, there's a fair bit of slop and the toe cages are really too long; positioning my feel well forwards. I certainly don't want to chuck any more money at the bike currently, although will keep an eye out for used offerings.


Finally, I think I've sorted the last piece of the "irritating noise" puzzle - the saddle has been re-fitted with pasty-wax on the clamp-to-rail surfaces and not a lot appears to be moving in this area, while I traced a loud and disctinctive creak / click during pedalling to two touching sections of the saddle's frame near the nose, that want to move relative to each other under torsional loading but are in hard contact so it takes a bit of force to make this happen and when it does they creak. A bit of 3-in-1 dribbled into the affected area seems to ahve made the saddle silent!


Just the crappy gears and all the other bits left to do now, then...
 
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wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
What I hope for you, @wafter , reading this, is that you are sorting out years of neglect and that this bike will run pretty sweetly hereafter. Rather like my car, although massively less expensive...
Thanks - I hope so too. Happy to put the work in to give it a fair crack of the whip; won't be happy if it keeps causing me grief though!

When I had interesting cars I used to take the same approach.. ensure the shell was sound and do anything mechanical well, knowing that it probably wouldn't need doing again afterwards - what are you running, just out of interest?
 

freiston

Veteran
Location
Coventry
I could probably do with a tool as you describe, however it's one of those that I'm likely to use so rarely and would probably take up a fair bit of space.. would be a nice thing to have though, just to be sure!
I think it's a tool that is quite useful especially with a steel gear hanger that's part of the drop-out. They do bend relatively easy and if the bike falls over onto its drive side, that can be enough to cause problems. It's reassuring to give the hanger a check when you've got the rear mech off the bike for whatever reason too (or even to remove the mech to give it a quick check). It's easy and cheap to make a functional one (hardest part is taking accurate measurements from the tool to the rim) - make sure you've got enough clearance to rotate the bar without fouling the wheel nut or mudguard/rack fixings - and they take up about as much room as a hammer. You could even use it open-ended as a lever when you're struggling to loosen something with a spanner - dual purpose. As well as the square section steel pipe (donated by a neighbour), I used a 10mm bolt with 1mm thread pitch, some nuts to match and some washers. The nuts can also be used to allow setting of wheel bearing preload with the QR lever closed (I find it easier that way than backing off the cone to allow for the axle compression). Here's my cheap, easy, make-do gear hanger tool.

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Vantage

Carbon fibre... LMAO!!!
Sorry to hear about the Spa - they seem very well regarded it seems.. what's wrong with it?

My Spa is a self build. Everything right down to the wheels was done by muggins here.
The problems I have with it are down to the frame design.
A stand absolutely cannot be used on this bike as the chainstay bridge is positioned right where the clamp and bolt would go. The position of the rear disc caliper mounts prevent a stand being fitted there either.
The seat stay bridge was drilled vertically instead of horizontally so fitting a mudguard has to be done right first time as any adjustments in height require making the drill hole in the mudguard elongated which makes that point more prone to slipping/breaking.
The seat tube bottle cage mounts were drilled too high up and required a topeak bottle cage thingybob to make it useable.
For a tourer, it sucks at having front loads. The shimmy caused by front panniers is ridiculous. No amount of adjustment on the rack or bags/loading seems to stop this.
The front dropouts face forwards instead of vertical so the bike needs to be upright on its wheels before the skewer for the wheel can be tightened. A small issue but bloody annoying.
I cannot for the life of me figure out how to get comfy on this bike. I've had it three years and I've yet to take enough weight off my arms to prevent discomfort on my hands and when I do manage that, the weight is transferred to my arse or I'm stretched out too much. Never had that problem with any other bike in 35+ years of cycling.
Other things not related to the frame also seem to be a bigger pain in the ass to sort out than any other bike prior to this. I swear the damn thing is cursed.
The day I have enough money to replace the wretched thing can't come quickly enough. I miss my Dawes Vantage.
 
OP
OP
wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
I think it's a tool that is quite useful especially with a steel gear hanger that's part of the drop-out. They do bend relatively easy and if the bike falls over onto its drive side, that can be enough to cause problems. It's reassuring to give the hanger a check when you've got the rear mech off the bike for whatever reason too (or even to remove the mech to give it a quick check). It's easy and cheap to make a functional one (hardest part is taking accurate measurements from the tool to the rim) - make sure you've got enough clearance to rotate the bar without fouling the wheel nut or mudguard/rack fixings - and they take up about as much room as a hammer. You could even use it open-ended as a lever when you're struggling to loosen something with a spanner - dual purpose. As well as the square section steel pipe (donated by a neighbour), I used a 10mm bolt with 1mm thread pitch, some nuts to match and some washers. The nuts can also be used to allow setting of wheel bearing preload with the QR lever closed (I find it easier that way than backing off the cone to allow for the axle compression). Here's my cheap, easy, make-do gear hanger tool.

View attachment 657882
Thanks - looks like a great piece of work! I assume you can use it for tweaking the hanger a bit as necessary too..?

I'm still not 100% convinced that the problem originates at the RD hanger but it'd be good to check and rule it out. I'll certainly keep my eye out for a bit of box section on my travels though; I guess the most difficult bits to source are the fine-pitch fixings.


09 Merc C220 CDI estate. I think it's ok now, but incredibly difficult to work on yourself when you've no space...And not easy to work on anyjow. Example: to replace the air filter, you have to unbolt and disconnect the entire engine management system...
Cool - tbh I don't envy you working on that! Seems that from maybe the mid-late '90s stuff started getting really silly to work on, especially the more prestige end of the market. Fingers' crossed you've replaced enough to make it reliable :tongue:

My Spa is a self build. Everything right down to the wheels was done by muggins here.
The problems I have with it are down to the frame design.
A stand absolutely cannot be used on this bike as the chainstay bridge is positioned right where the clamp and bolt would go. The position of the rear disc caliper mounts prevent a stand being fitted there either.
The seat stay bridge was drilled vertically instead of horizontally so fitting a mudguard has to be done right first time as any adjustments in height require making the drill hole in the mudguard elongated which makes that point more prone to slipping/breaking.
The seat tube bottle cage mounts were drilled too high up and required a topeak bottle cage thingybob to make it useable.
For a tourer, it sucks at having front loads. The shimmy caused by front panniers is ridiculous. No amount of adjustment on the rack or bags/loading seems to stop this.
The front dropouts face forwards instead of vertical so the bike needs to be upright on its wheels before the skewer for the wheel can be tightened. A small issue but bloody annoying.
I cannot for the life of me figure out how to get comfy on this bike. I've had it three years and I've yet to take enough weight off my arms to prevent discomfort on my hands and when I do manage that, the weight is transferred to my arse or I'm stretched out too much. Never had that problem with any other bike in 35+ years of cycling.
Other things not related to the frame also seem to be a bigger pain in the ass to sort out than any other bike prior to this. I swear the damn thing is cursed.
The day I have enough money to replace the wretched thing can't come quickly enough. I miss my Dawes Vantage.
Sorry to hear about all those problems - I've heard some good stuff about Spa in the past so I'm surprised by some of the seemingly unforgiveably basic issues you've had and bizarre design choices... That must be really disappointing, especially considering it sounds like you went into it as a labour of love :sad:

Have you had a word with them about it? What are you looking to replace it with?


"Progress" with the Fuji has been even more glacial over recent weeks; the critical path being disrupted by issues relating to the sourcing of mudguards.

On top of this having done some more reading I decided to investigate the RD cable in the hope that this might shed some light on the shifting problem. I found the inner to be heavily kinked inside the outer, thanks to the previous damage it had sustained when the outer skewed in the barrel adjustor. This was causing a lot of drag and when it came out it brought with it several chunks of the liner that it had presumably eroded away.

I thought I'd give it a chance by straightening the inner with some heat (which may have eventually led to its failure; not sure what sort of heat treatment state they're usually in) but nothing ventured and all that. I got it nicely straight, however through a combination of the damage to the outer and frayed cable couldn't get it all back together again.. so a new cable it is.

While I'm at it I'm considering doing the brake cables too as the pull is bloody awful (heavy and draggy) compared to the Tiagra / 105 setup on my boardman; which apparently has the same cables. The choice of cables is bewildering; which coupled with a busy week still means I've not ordered any :whistle:


Yesterday my mudguards finally arrived; another set of SKS Longboards as already proven on my CdF. I'd planned to spend the day throwing woodworm treatment at various bits of the house, however as the motivation waned and malaise descended, it was all I could do to hopefully prod at the pile of new bits for the bike; one thing led to another and I ended up getting them fitted.

As anyone with any experience will no doubt attest fitting these mudguards is a feat of commitment and endurance; however once done they're great. Typically it took the best part of a day to get them on.. and that wasn't the end of the story as I then found out that the Pannier rack wouldn't fit; which was supposed to be my big reward at the end of the night :rolleyes:


This morning I looked at it with fresh eyes and managed to reach a workable solution, so the rack's now on, although the bike remains un-useable due to the cable situation and some areas of the recent work still need tweaking / sorting.

Anyway, as it stands (minus a few vaguely important bits):

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I was concerned about mudguard clearance issues before fitting; turns out they're fine in all the areas I was worried about and crap in the one area I'd not considered (at the rack). Up front clearance with the V-brakes is absolutey fine, even with the mudguard as high up as it'll go.

All the fixings that came with the guards are M5 and BZP finished alloy steel capheads. As with the CdF I've replaced all of these with stainless button heads in the interests of corrosion resistance and aesthetics. Despite the lack of M6 fixings in the kit I think the front and rear brackets are intended to take this larger size which will also fit the fork and seatstay bridge; so I'll probably swap these in time as it should help to centralise the brackets a bit.

12x8_IMG_5800a.jpg



I ended up packing the guard away from the chainstay bridge by around 4mm with some washers to aid clearance between the mudguard and arm of the FD. Given the tubular nature of the chainstay bridge this all looks like a bit of a lash-up - I looked for concave washers to no avail and considered attacking a couple of the SKS spacers with the rotary tool to make some up; but with motivation as it was this was all I could manage. Perhaps a job for the future depending on how much it irritates me.

The mudguard struggled to fit between the chainstays and had to be squashed a bit to get the nut started on the bolt. I put a couple of bits of electrical tape on the contact surfaces with the insides of the chainstay in an effort to reduce the potential for rubbing / damage.

With this setup as it stands there's just enough room to allow the rear wheel to be removed from the forward-angled dropouts; with the 32mm tyres fitting very nearly inside the guard. I think this will be as large as I can go as anything bigger will likely hang up on the trailing / inner edges of the guard's front section during attempted removal.

12x8_IMG_5801a.jpg



Clearance at the FD is minimal but present. There is a bit of movement in the mudguard so I'll keep an eye on it once the bike's actually been ridden for a reasonable distance.

12x8_IMG_5811a.jpg



Thankfully there's plenty of clearance with the rear brakes too. Again, due to the round seatstay bridge the interface with the guard's bracket here is a bit sketchy, but it is what it is. If I could be bothered to knock up some concave washers..

12x8_IMG_5814a.jpg



After attempting to trial-fit the rack with the mudguards in place I was resigned to acceptance that it wouldn't fit without severely butchering something. In the end I managed to get it all fitted by releasing the two front / upper-most guard stays from the guard and running them through the rack from the outside to the inside, since there was insufficient clearance at the bottom of the rack to allow the stays to run inside.

This is all good, however does complicate things should the rack need to be removed. To reduce the amount of bending stress on the guard stays I packed them away from the frame using one of the 5mm plastic spacers that came with the kit.. not aesthetically ideal but for now it'll do.

The rack mount is spaced away from the frame with a small washer since there was evidently fouling at the frontal edge in the past. I also found that the RHS threaded boss on the dropout for the rack had apparently been welded on on't pish - not much I can do about that and it doesn't affect its use..


12x8_IMG_5809a.jpg



There's still contact between the stay and rack near its bottom, but this is light and depending on how things go I could separate the two parts with a bit of electical tape. Adding more deflection to the stays effectively made them shorter, however being of an anxious disposition I'd already cut them about as long as I could get away with so this didn't prove a problem.


12x8_IMG_5810a.jpg



So there we go - tantalisingly close but it's not going anywhere until I've sorted some cables, which is it's own can of worms. I think I know where I'm going with pannier bags and that only leaves a few small jobs remaining until I can hopefully get out and actually start using it for wholesome utility purposes :becool:
 
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freiston

Veteran
Location
Coventry
I assume you can use it for tweaking the hanger a bit as necessary too..?
Yeah - that's how the shop-bought ones work too - you measure the gap between the rim and the tool at 12, 6, 3 & 9 o'clock to see if the hanger is out and if it is, give the tool a bit of a flex to bend the hanger, then measure again, repeat as required. When measuring the gap, always do it from the same point on the rim (e.g. where the valve is) - so you rotate the wheel with the tool - this way you rule out error due to the wheel being laterally untrue.
 
OP
OP
wafter

wafter

I like steel bikes and I cannot lie..
Location
Oxford
Yeah - that's how the shop-bought ones work too - you measure the gap between the rim and the tool at 12, 6, 3 & 9 o'clock to see if the hanger is out and if it is, give the tool a bit of a flex to bend the hanger, then measure again, repeat as required. When measuring the gap, always do it from the same point on the rim (e.g. where the valve is) - so you rotate the wheel with the tool - this way you rule out error due to the wheel being laterally untrue.
Thanks - good point about rotating the wheel with the tool. I guess one needs to make sure it's dead straight in the dropouts too!

Ideally the stays should be behind the pannier rack
Indeed, however this isn't going to happen without significantly bending the stays; something I'm reluctant to do in case I cock it up / run out of length.. I'm all ears if you have any ideas ;)
 
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