Just how bad are drivers, in general?

[Andy in Germany]

Our local school is experiencing similar problems: the main road through the village is closed, so traffic from elsewhere is supposed to go another way, and 'local' traffic has a diversion along an unsuitable road, and the school is there, with a crossing in front of the gate.

Of course, much of the 'local' traffic isn't. I'm not making that up; numberplates are issued by the county, so an out of region plate is obvious, and you would be entirely unamazed how many drivers feel entitled to drive past two separate barriers if it means getting somewhere a few seconds faster.

In response to many problems, the police have announced they'll be on hand every Wednesday morning, which is great, but even the thickest motorists quickly realised this meant they would be unlikely to have any problems on any other day, so of course they drive around on Wednesday, and then it's business as usual.

This is in addition to the drivers who feel even more entitled and drive past two more barriers and through a very narrow residential street because that is a tiny bit faster than the usual diversion. This street has a 7km/h (4mph) speed limit. Do you think the majority take any notice of this?

I have noticed that truck drivers follow the rules much more carefully, because the consequences if caught and/or reported would be much higher, which says it all really.

 

[Fastpedaller]

In Norwich (outer ring road) motorists were taking a short-cut through a cemetery (I kid ye not). I think action had been taken to prevent it.

 

[HMS_Dave]

In Norwich (outer ring road) motorists were taking a short-cut through a cemetery (I kid ye not). I think action had been taken to prevent it.

I think a couple of challenger 2 tanks locked and loaded is where I'd start.

 

[Slick]

Our local school is experiencing similar problems: the main road through the village is closed, so traffic from elsewhere is supposed to go another way, and 'local' traffic has a diversion along an unsuitable road, and the school is there, with a crossing in front of the gate.

Of course, much of the 'local' traffic isn't. I'm not making that up; numberplates are issued by the county, so an out of region plate is obvious, and you would be entirely unamazed how many drivers feel entitled to drive past two separate barriers if it means getting somewhere a few seconds faster.

In response to many problems, the police have announced they'll be on hand every Wednesday morning, which is great, but even the thickest motorists quickly realised this meant they would be unlikely to have any problems on any other day, so of course they drive around on Wednesday, and then it's business as usual.

This is in addition to the drivers who feel even more entitled and drive past two more barriers and through a very narrow residential street because that is a tiny bit faster than the usual diversion. This street has a 7km/h (4mph) speed limit. Do you think the majority take any notice of this?

I have noticed that truck drivers follow the rules much more carefully, because the consequences if caught and/or reported would be much higher, which says it all really.

Whilst it is true that the consequences for truckers could be worse, so is the consequences for everyone around that truck and whilst not all are brilliant, they are professional drivers and as such are much more likely to follow the rules of the road. Time behind the wheel is another matter.

 

[mjr]

In Norwich (outer ring road) motorists were taking a short-cut through a cemetery (I kid ye not). I think action had been taken to prevent it.

Norwich's "outer" (for now, as the council wants to complete a third, because the first two clearly worked(!)) ring road is a shortcut through Earlham cemetary! Farrow Road is maybe the second-worst example of motorist entitlement and disrespect for the dead in Norfolk. Our politicians kowtow to drivers and the dead don't vote.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

The city is close to grid-lock with average speeds lower than it was twenty years ago - 12 mph

What you’ve described is an average speed of no more than 7.5mph. I think your 12 mph is somewhat optimistic.

 

[Andy in Germany]

Whilst it is true that the consequences for truckers could be worse, so is the consequences for everyone around that truck and whilst not all are brilliant, they are professional drivers and as such are much more likely to follow the rules of the road. Time behind the wheel is another matter.

From my interactions with truckers in Germany I'd agree with that; 99% of them are indeed highly professional, courteous and very aware of bicycles. This is probably partly because increasingly, truckers have a three-year apprenticeship behind them, and have to re take their test every five years with an annual first aid test.

 

[Electric_Andy]

I've just had to post this now because it's becoming so common. On my (car) route to drop my son off at school, there are 6 zebra crossings. On the way out of my village, it's not so bad. But there is one in the city centre which I see car drivers shoot over at least once a week when someone is waiting to cross. This morning it was a plonker in a blacked out Merc (surprise). I had stopped, he was in the lane to my right and he blasted straight through, luckily as the lad crossing was barely in front of my car. I sounded the horn loudly, the lad jumped a bit and stopped, but of course the Merc accelerated away up the hill. I then landed along side him at the next set of lights and tried to make eye contact, but he was staring straight ahead. I pretended to speak into my collar like I was some sort of special FBI agent, hoping that if he sh*t himself it might make him think next time. It is getting far worse, and it's not only young/new drivers. I think people have just got more entitled, and stupid and couldn't care less about safety

 

[Slick]

From my interactions with truckers in Germany I'd agree with that; 99% of them are indeed highly professional, courteous and very aware of bicycles. This is probably partly because increasingly, truckers have a three-year apprenticeship behind them, and have to re take their test every five years with an annual first aid test.

We have apprentice drivers here as well but retaking their test every 5 years is a great idea, and first aid should be mandatory for every driver regardless of class of licence. We do have a requirement of 40 hours CPD training here, but not too sure how effective it is, but at least there is some evidence of driver training for UK drivers anyway.

 

[PedallingNowhereSlowly]

I think people have just got more entitled, and stupid and couldn't care less about safety

I wonder if these social attitudes are attributable to the guff the media outlets are secreting. We don't have many zebra crossings in these parts. There are some outside a supermarket. Or at least, a raised crossing without the lollipops in a supermarket car park. I was stood in the pouring rain watching car after car go by on Sunday, as the drivers left the supermarket.

The day prior I saw a cyclist using a facility try and cross the road on approach to a roundabout. I slowed down on approach, ready to let the cyclist cross if he reached the central reservation before me - but as I was proceeding away roundabout he still hadn't been allowed to cross.

Sadly I don't think the highway code affords cyclists any consideration in that situation - but it does pedestrians.

 

[mjr]

I wonder if these social attitudes are attributable to the guff the media outlets are secreting.

Especially social media. Even some cycling groups have motorists claiming that every motorist deliberately breaks laws. It's not true but it helps make criminal driving be seen as normal. If anyone dares challenge these criminal cheerleaders, then they're called "snowflake", "Karen" or worse.

The day prior I saw a cyclist using a facility try and cross the road on approach to a roundabout. I slowed down on approach, ready to let the cyclist cross if he reached the central reservation before me - but as I was proceeding away roundabout he still hadn't been allowed to cross.

Sadly I don't think the highway code affords cyclists any consideration in that situation - but it does pedestrians.

Yes, it does, and has done for over 2 years. Rule H3 about not cutting across the path of cyclists explicitly applies to "a facility" (do you mean a cycle lane or track?) at any junction or even direction change: "You should not cut across cyclists, horse riders or horse drawn vehicles going ahead when you are turning into or out of a junction or changing direction or lane, just as you would not turn across the path of another motor vehicle. This applies whether they are using a cycle lane, a cycle track, or riding ahead on the road and you should give way to them."

 

[PedallingNowhereSlowly]

I'm familiar with H3.

This is a cycle track that crosses an approach/exit road from a roundabout. H3 gives cyclists priority at junctions. And a roundabout is technically a junction, but the wording of the last section which specifically mentions roundabouts in context of cyclists, horse riders and horse drawn vehicles going straight ahead suggests there's distinction between junctions and roundabouts.

My natural inclination when driving is to allow the cyclist to cross, irrespective of what the Highway Code says. It's just courtesy.

 

[mjr]

I'm familiar with H3.

This is a cycle track that crosses an approach/exit road from a roundabout. H3 gives cyclists priority at junctions. And a roundabout is technically a junction, but the wording of the last section which specifically mentions roundabouts in context of cyclists, horse riders and horse drawn vehicles going straight ahead suggests there's distinction between junctions and roundabouts.

I disagree with any bizarre interpretation that concludes that roundabouts are not junctions, but I also note it says "You should stop and wait for a safe gap in the flow of cyclists if necessary. This includes when cyclists are: [...] travelling around a roundabout." Using a cycle track to cross an approach/exit is obviously travelling around the roundabout (it's certainly not travelling across it or through it!) so drivers should stop and wait.

My natural inclination when driving is to allow the cyclist to cross, irrespective of what the Highway Code says. It's just courtesy.

In this instance, doing so would be fully respecting what the code says. I wish more did and, until then, I wish there was some policing to encourage them.

 

[annedonnelly]

I've just had to post this now because it's becoming so common. On my (car) route to drop my son off at school, there are 6 zebra crossings. On the way out of my village, it's not so bad. But there is one in the city centre which I see car drivers shoot over at least once a week when someone is waiting to cross. This morning it was a plonker in a blacked out Merc (surprise). I had stopped, he was in the lane to my right and he blasted straight through, luckily as the lad crossing was barely in front of my car. I sounded the horn loudly, the lad jumped a bit and stopped, but of course the Merc accelerated away up the hill. I then landed along side him at the next set of lights and tried to make eye contact, but he was staring straight ahead. I pretended to speak into my collar like I was some sort of special FBI agent, hoping that if he sh*t himself it might make him think next time. It is getting far worse, and it's not only young/new drivers. I think people have just got more entitled, and stupid and couldn't care less about safety

My friend is a lollipop lady outside a primary school. Her crossing is a light-controlled pedestrian crossing in a 30mph zone. The number of drivers she has jumping the red lights is scary. She, and some of the kids, have come very close to being hit. Her employers, the county council, are planning to provide all their lollipop people with body cams.

 

[Gunk]

The number of drivers she has jumping the red lights is scary

I noticed this over the last couple of years, the amount of “Red Jumpers” is really scary, you can’t assume if the lights are green that it’s safe to go.