E-scooters to be allowed on public roads

[captain nemo1701]

I am pretty sur ethese "trial" scooters can be identified easily by the company that runs them

If they mounted a camera and detector on routes where people complained then they would easily catch the culprits

but that, of course, would affect profits

They do have wee licence numbers that would challenge the resolution of the James Webb 'scope. To record them would need Ultra 8k HD cameras and AI software. The only time you can hear them coming is when the horseshoe-shaped stand underneath the front is loose and scrapes along the asphalt. The other irritation is that they just get dumped ever where when hirers are done with 'em..on cycle paths, roads, in hedgerows etc. Legal fly tipping....and its the same with ebikes.

 

[Drago]

Every week now in the local chip wrapper the court results show at least one escooter rider being knocked off for document offences so it would seem local dibble are digging into it.

 

[Dogtrousers]

Has the new govt expressed any opinion on this? IIRC under the previous administration there was a bill to legalise them a few years ago but it kept getting kicked down the road with "trials" being repeatedly extended.

 

[Drago]

Has the new govt expressed any opinion on this?

I'm sure they'd be happy to accept some free ones.

 

[vickster]

Has the new govt expressed any opinion on this? IIRC under the previous administration there was a bill to legalise them a few years ago but it kept getting kicked down the road with "trials" being repeatedly extended.

Musings here
https://electricrideoncars.co.uk/e-...likely,current patchwork of local regulations.

 

[Bristolian]

Musings here
https://electricrideoncars.co.uk/e-scooter-laws-in-the-uk-what-the-future-holds-under-a-potential-labour-government/#:~:text=Comprehensive Legislation: Labour is likely,current patchwork of local regulations.

Just left this comment for them:

"I don't understand how you think the law on e-scooters and e-bikes is "notably vague". Legally, all privately owned e-scooters are illegal on any part of the highway (that includes the pavement) and in public places. You'd have to be pretty stupid or deliberately obtuse not to understand that.

With regards to e-bikes the law is equally clear; those that conform to EAPC regulations are legal for use on cycle paths and anywhere else that a pedal cycle is permitted. Any electrically power bicycle that doesn't meet EAPC is automatically classed as an electric motorcycle or moped which means it must be taxed and insured and the rider must have a driving license and wear a crash helmet. Nothing remotely vague about any of that, unless you want it to be vague and are trying to muddy the waters so that you can sell more illegal scooters and bikes. Not that I'm suggesting you are, of course."

HA! Just had this pop up on my screen:

 

[Drago]

I've just tried to copy and paste your comment on there and got the same result. Now there's a thing.

 

[Bristolian]

IF I was cynical I'd think it was deliberate. I might try a comment that aligns with their article and see what happens.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Just tried a slightly different worded comment and got the same

hmmmm

Edit - tried again qith a short more supportive comment - same thing
probably web site fault

 

[a.twiddler]

Just left this comment for them:

"I don't understand how you think the law on e-scooters and e-bikes is "notably vague". Legally, all privately owned e-scooters are illegal on any part of the highway (that includes the pavement) and in public places. You'd have to be pretty stupid or deliberately obtuse not to understand that.

With regards to e-bikes the law is equally clear; those that conform to EAPC regulations are legal for use on cycle paths and anywhere else that a pedal cycle is permitted. Any electrically power bicycle that doesn't meet EAPC is automatically classed as an electric motorcycle or moped which means it must be taxed and insured and the rider must have a driving license and wear a crash helmet. Nothing remotely vague about any of that, unless you want it to be vague and are trying to muddy the waters so that you can sell more illegal scooters and bikes. Not that I'm suggesting you are, of course."

HA! Just had this pop up on my screen:
View attachment 747490

My thoughts exactly. Nothing vague there. Also why do e-scooters and e-bikes get lumped together? Compliant e-bikes are effectively bicycles, e-scooters are a category of powered vehicle. I certainly hope the inability to leave comments is just a temporary glitch.

 

[Alex321]

My thoughts exactly. Nothing vague there.

Actually, there is quite a lot of vagueness. It isn't clear just how the 250W power is defined. The rukes regardling what can legally be sold by retailers and what can legally be ridden are significantly different.

 

[Drago]

Actually, there is quite a lot of vagueness. It isn't clear just how the 250W power is defined.

By physics.

250W is 250W regardless of the form of energy.

 

[Alex321]

By physics.

250W is 250W regardless of the form of energy.

Yes, but the law doesn't actually mean that the motor must have a maximum output of 250W, which is why it is vague.

And the regulations define how it is measured by reference to other regulations, including others which aren't specifically defined
5—(1) For the purposes of regulation 4(c)(i), “maximum continuous rated power” has the same meaning as in Regulation (EU) No 168/2013(4) of the European Parliament and of the Council of 15th January 2013 on the approval and market surveillance of two- or three-wheel vehicles and quadricycles(5).

(2) Notwithstanding paragraph (1), maximum continuous rated power may be determined in accordance with—

(a)any relevant standard or code of practice of a national standards body or equivalent body of any EEA State or the Republic of Turkey,

(b)any relevant international standard recognised for use in any EEA State or the Republic of Turkey, or

(c)any relevant technical regulation with mandatory or de facto mandatory application for marketing or use in any EEA State or in the Republic of Turkey,

in so far as the standard, code of practice or technical regulation in question enables maximum continuous rated power to be determined in a manner equivalent to that prescribed by Regulation (EU) No 168/2013.”.

 

[lazybloke]

By physics.

250W is 250W regardless of the form of energy.

I'm confused that the 250 watt limit of an ebike is often described as 'absolute' but sometimes only as a maximum continuous power.


We're talking physics, so an unambiguous definition should be possible, but is the law clear?

In practice, it's the seller that makes that determination and provides the appropriate markings/documentation. So as a consumer the situation shouldn't be vague at all.

 

[Drago]

The law says 250W.

Physics defines what 250W is, and that is unambiguous.

The law does not need to clarify physics.