Doping in other sports

[Ganymede]

Not really. Thailand would not have had any competitors in skiing otherwise, and the absolute numbers are not limited in that way. I'm not saying what she did was right, but she certainly isn't the first Olympian to have got there by money and connections (that was once practically the only way anyone got to the Olympics after all...), and she won't be the last.

I thought that initially but then gathered that the ski-offs involved other nationalities: http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/nov/11/vanessa-mae-violinist-banned-skiing-four-years.
VM wasn't the only cheater either and Italian and Slovenian coaches have been sanctioned too.

 

[oldroadman]

Where potential careers and ego are concerned, some will resort to whatever it takes. As is well known in most sports.

 

[rich p]

I feel its a step to far, the athletes are punished/sanctioned when caught, that should be enough...sending someone to jail for cheating which at best is aganist the rules and morally wrong but a crime, No....

In Italy it is sporting fraud, IIRC.
The doper is essentially defrauding the clean rider out of potential earnings. If this acts as more of a deterrent then I don't see anything wrong with it. The minefield could be with the lack of clear cut doping these days. Blood passport infringements might not be covered.

 

[rich p]

I thought your objection was that they were being punished twice rather than that it was ineffective as a deterrent.
There's no way of knowing how effective it is though since we don't know if the riders who are clean, in Italy, were deterred!
The German law looks like it would be more severe too.

 

[Hont]

There were some raids on NFL teams this weekend, due to this...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-27492202

A very strong argument against those who say you should just legalise doping.

 

[Ganymede]

There were some raids on NFL teams this weekend, due to this...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-27492202

A very strong argument against those who say you should just legalise doping.

Yikes!

 

[Dogtrousers]

On a similar subject it's worth reading Shontayne Hape on the subject of concussion in Rugby Union here

To sum up: RU players take a pre-season cognition test, when they take a bang to the head they have to re-take this test to see if they are concussed. They deliberately "cheat" on the baseline test by scoring low, to avoid the chance of being stood down due to concussion. Add on to this the pressure - direct and indirect - to get out there and play, and an unwillingness by the clubs to stand down expensive (but concussed) players and you have a situation not unlike the coercion of players to take harmful substances.

 

[Hont]

Somebody needs to tell them about second impact syndrome...

http://www.brainandspinalcord.org/traumatic-brain-injury-types/second-impact-syndrome/index.html

I'm sure there'll be a massive scandal when a player dies. Until then, they'll probably keep doing it.

 

[smutchin]

I'm sure there'll be a massive scandal when a player dies. Until then, they'll probably keep doing it.

Deaths from head injuries in rugby are actually quite common (relatively). Certainly far more common than in cycling, and yet no one tells rugby players to wear a helmet. Yeah, some of them wear scrum caps, but they're to prevent damage to the ears and certainly aren't designed to absorb much force in an impact.

My son suffered concussion while playing in a tournament a couple of years ago. I was there as a spectator but I didn't realise at the time what had happened. He seemed to recover pretty quickly and although he sat out the rest of that game, he came back and played in the following game. No one pressurised him to play, but nor did the coaches stop suggest he shouldn't play. Me, being ignorant, assumed the coaches would be well informed about this kind of thing. Only the next day when he woke up feeling very groggy did I begin to realise that it was actually a pretty serious matter. Makes me feel a bit sick to think what might have happened.

Subsequently, I've been far more vigilant about any head injuries and on one occasion insisted he be removed from play after a knock, then banned him from playing for a few weeks afterwards, much to his disappointment. The players need protecting from themselves.

 

[Pro Tour Punditry]

Rugby, specifically, French Rugby - a Paul Kimmage article:
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rug...to-face-up-to-its-growing-pains-30766512.html

 

[oldroadman]

A look at the UKAD website makes interesting reading. Plenty of rugby sanctions, but no top level teams or players, so presumably the problem is all at the lower levels where they aspire to get bigger and better. Obviously this must be correct as no-one at the top levels has picked up a non-negative, so all the size and speed can be attributed to full time training, professional support, more gym time, and so on, must it not? That must be clear. Perhaps Mr Kimmage might take a look just to assure us all.

 

[Hont]

Perhaps Mr Kimmage might take a look just to assure us all.

I remember reading an interview with David Walsh where he was very keen to have a look at Rugby. Now that the Lance gravy train will be drying up maybe we'll see a couple of books on Rugby from him.

 

[Crackle]

A look at the UKAD website makes interesting reading. Plenty of rugby sanctions, but no top level teams or players, so presumably the problem is all at the lower levels where they aspire to get bigger and better. Obviously this must be correct as no-one at the top levels has picked up a non-negative, so all the size and speed can be attributed to full time training, professional support, more gym time, and so on, must it not? That must be clear. Perhaps Mr Kimmage might take a look just to assure us all.

Is this nuance different to positive?

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Is this nuance different to positive?

Tested positive for irony, I reckon.

 

[Dogtrousers]

Naive question (to which there is probably no simple answer):
With blood vector doping, like transfusions or EPO I'm guessing the body will eventually wash the stuff out so the dope needs to be maintained in the body to be effective. Is this also true of bulking-up? Could a player go on a doped training binge to illegally build bulk and then cut out the dope and maintain that bulk fully legally?