Deaths when not using helmet

[Red Light]

Yes, but this isn't Snell's own study, merely one agreeable to them...

Which bit of

Summary Report of Harborview Helmet Studies
Sponsored by the Snell Memorial Foundation
at the top of the page in big letters did you not understand?

 

[tigger]

If anyone's interested, I can show a large positive correlation between numbers of people drowning and sales of Cornettos...

(Handy Hint - correlation does not equal causation)

Nice one - I bet thats 100% true and accurate!

 

[tigger]

Which bit of

Summary Report of Harborview Helmet Studies
Sponsored by the Snell Memorial Foundation
at the top of the page in big letters did you not understand?

No I noted it, for sure it means it will only be published by them if the findings are in favour of their agenda. Doesn't mean it doesn't have value... provided they just didn't make it all up!

 

[benb]

Thats a fair point, no the studies on cyclehelmets.org have credibility in the same way as the one on snell's does. What I mean is we can't view cyclehelmets.org per se as a complete authority as it only has studies which support its agenda, in the same way as studies on pro helmet ot whatver sites will only support their agendas.

I don't think even Red Light suggested that we should only go to cyclehelmets.org for our evidence.

 

[benb]

No I noted it, for sure it means it will only be published by them if the findings are in favour of their agenda. Doesn't mean it doesn't have value... provided they just didn't make it all up!

As I said, I can't find anything in that paper that shows how they came to their conclusions.
Maybe it's there and I'm being thick, but it's not obvious.

 

[Angelfishsolo]

No it isn't and I've supervised a few PhDs in my time. A PhD is training in the methods of research. The thesis is a demonstration that they have achieved a competency in that together with a piece of original research work in the field. PhD theses are rarely referenced because they are not published as such. What is referenced are the published papers resulting from the research.

I have worked for a while in academia and have seen some Dr's and Profs with such myopic view points it was unbelievable.

A joke to clarify.

A Mathematician and a Physicist are set a challenge.


At a given point in front of them is a cheque for £1M. In order to reach it they must walk towards it but each step must be half the length of the previous.

The mathematician (using maths) works out he wikll never reach the cheque as you can never half to nothing.

The physicist (using common sense) follows the instructions until he is close enough to lean forward and pick up the cheque.

 

[Red Light]

I have worked for a while in academia and have seen some Dr's and Profs with such myopic view points it was unbelievable.

What has that got to do with the content and purpose of PhD's?

 

[Angelfishsolo]

What has that got to do with the content and purpose of PhD's?

If you can't work out what it means I am sorry for you.

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting one in a fruit salad.

 

[Red Light]

No I noted it, for sure it means it will only be published by them if the findings are in favour of their agenda. Doesn't mean it doesn't have value... provided they just didn't make it all up!

No, it means that the Snell Memorial Foundation paid the Harbourview Medical Centre to do the research. One might therefore treat it with the same heightened level of scepticism that one might treat a paper on the benefits of smoking sponsored by British American Tobacco.

 

[Angelfishsolo]

Once again I will state that this is like a Science v Faith debate. The only people who can see both sides are those who hold no beliefs.

 

[tigger]

No, it means that the Snell Memorial Foundation paid the Harbourview Medical Centre to do the research. One might therefore treat it with the same heightened level of scepticism that one might treat a paper on the benefits of smoking sponsored by British American Tobacco.

I didn't know Snell made helmets

 

[Red Light]

If you can't work out what it means I am sorry for you.

No I can't work out what the personality traits of some individuals in academia has to do with the general purpose of a PhD. Perhaps you can humour me and explain it. Otherwise it just seems like what is called in the vernacular "changing the subject"

 

[Angelfishsolo]

No I can't work out what the personality traits of some individuals in academia has to do with the general purpose of a PhD. Perhaps you can humour me and explain it. Otherwise it just seems like what is called in the vernacular "changing the subject"

It was a general comment about those in academia rather than the purpose of a PhD. Knowledge does not equate to wisdom.

Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting one in a fruit salad.

 

[Angelfishsolo]

I didn't know Snell made helmets

Why allow that to spoil the analogy? It seems RL has a monopoly on knowing what stats and reports are valid and which aren't. It is pure co-incidence they back up his personal beliefs I am sure.

 

[ufkacbln]

The two camps are not exclusive

The American Bicycle Helmet Safety Institute is certainly pro helmet

They are however not afraid of pointing out limitations, snag points, problems with modern design and decreasing protection