TrollExactly - this is where the zwift guys are spotting the technique in use. It's glaringly obvious on Strava so I do wonder why people employ it .. but then, some people will do anything to win
p.s. Did i tell you all that my weight loss is going well, and I'm down to 65kg .... honest
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Brusgaard
Über Guru
- Location
- Skive, Denmark
Sawtooth it is. There is a lag in Ant+ data so for a few seconds of no effort after a spin up the power hangs high
Depends a lot on the power source. I did use this technique in some races in my early Zwift days, without even knowing it was a bug or something that not everyone could/would do. I just thought that was the Zwift draft effect coming into play.
Then the Zwift Police told me that it was illegal, and I was not allowed to coast after making an effort to catch a group. Thankfully, this is allowed in the real world.
My Direto (V1) was "good" in this regard, as it kept the watts for quite a few seconds if coasting. The NEO2 however is faster in dropping the watts to zero, but my Assiomas DUOs is a bit slower than the NEO2, but still much faster than the Direto.
Now if only I could get rid of the drop outs from the Assiomas. Happened at least twice yesterday and cost me quite a few placings in the TdZ race as having your watts/RPMs at 0 for 5-10 seconds gets you dropped from the bunch pretty quickly!
Luckily one of them was slightly downhill, so my avatar just coasted until it picked up the signal again...Never (?) had these total drop outs with the NEO2 as power source, and will probably switch back to that again and then record the Assiomas output on the Garmin Edge instead...
The power does go back down, but you do get a few seconds of residual speed from the high power. I think people just rest briefly and repeat the fast cadence to get the power high again and repeat - keeps the speed and power artificially high for longer. At least that's how it worked in Bkool so I assume the same in Zwift. Another example of how far virtual racing has to go to be a fair/level playing field
<Tommy>
Illegitimi non carborundum
- Location
- Camden, London
I guess if someone is so desperate to win they'll use whatever cheats are out there ... don't see the point personally, but then for us on CC we ride to get/stay fit, the racing is just an added bonus to the training
What makes you so sure?
berty bassett
Legendary Member
- Location
- I'boro
Cos we are all so lovely 😊
steverob
Guru
- Location
- Buckinghamshire
I'd like to be clever enough to use a tactic like that!It just reminded me when SteveRob mentioned about being unable to find a rhythm on a climb. Ive seen a few competitors live where their W/kg would go up and down but would stretch a lead on me
No, my issue was purely down to my legs not wanting to co-operate with my brain. I'd lose concentration on the climb for a few seconds then suddenly find myself spinning at a ridiculously high cadence and low watts, so would shift gears, only to now find myself pushing a level of watts that was unsustainable (for more than 20 seconds anyway), but having to grind the pedals in order to do so. Then I'd change back and find myself in the first situation again, as I just couldn't seem to get back into my usual rhythm. Eventually I would get everything back into some sort of equilibrium for a minute or so, but then lose concentration once more and start the whole cycle again.
By the time the second lap rolled round, everything was a lot better, so I just think my mind was wandering too much early on in the ride and letting my legs do their own thing.
JuhaL
Guru
I have read about those lags but never heard about using different pedaling technic like sawtooth as a "loophole" for those lags. I haven't noticed much lag with my Drivo2 because i have never though about it but obviously there is. It's probably different thing but when i think about workout i need to adjust power smoothing value to avoid huge lag of resistance unit, just thinking is this somehow connected to ant+ lag as well. Like @Brusgaard said it probably depends lot of power source.
If it was all about the racing peeps would be racing IRL and/or in many of the other Zwift races. Most of us only race in the CC league or the odd Zwift race and (i could be wrong) only Martin is racing IRL at the moment. most (not all) of us spend more time doing workouts, or zone 2 rides, than we do racing. Just my view
. Maybe sticky draft is justified after all 
<Tommy>
Illegitimi non carborundum
- Location
- Camden, London
If it was all about the racing peeps would be racing IRL and/or in many of the other Zwift races. Most of us only race in the CC league or the odd Zwift race and (i could be wrong) only Martin is racing IRL at the moment. most (not all) of us spend more time doing workouts, or zone 2 rides, than we do racing. Just my view
It doesn’t have to be “all about the racing” for people to cheat. People race in the leagues. They have the opportunity to cheat. Some people will choose to cheat. That is some people’s natural nature. That is life. I wouldn’t make assumptions that it doesn’t happen here just because of our motives for racing.
BurningLegs
Guru
I've never used ANT+ so not sure if I've experienced this saw tooth effect.
I have only ever used bluetooth and there is a second or so of lag for any power change. I don't consider it an advantage because when I start an effort it takes a second before my watts increase on screen, then when I end the effort I get the second back.
Doesn't it all even out in the end?? Or is there something different about ANT+?
I have only ever used bluetooth and there is a second or so of lag for any power change. I don't consider it an advantage because when I start an effort it takes a second before my watts increase on screen, then when I end the effort I get the second back.
Doesn't it all even out in the end?? Or is there something different about ANT+?
<Tommy>
Illegitimi non carborundum
- Location
- Camden, London
I don’t know. I guess not though. I was in a race a few months back when bob made rapid gains on me and Lars. The whole time he was gaining I could see his power going from 0 w/kg to 4+w/kg. He eventually caught us.
For the record I’m not for a moment suggesting bob was doing it on purpose. I trust him implicitly and I spoke to him about it after the race wheee he just explained he was peeling in bursts because it was all he could muster. But I did wonder if there was an inadvertent advantage in it. I asked the question on zwift power but I didn’t get a response.
<Tommy>
Illegitimi non carborundum
- Location
- Camden, London
Also Carl sorry I know my last post sounded so terse I didn’t mean it to. I’m a little fed up of various little angles I’ve seen being played out recently and I just want it to be known that we are not protected from cheating in our little group. Which i know is generally full of people with good intentions.
Fair enough - I assume that CCers don't knowingly cheat (weight dope, Ant+ bug, electric drill
) but across Zwift there is a lot going on. Tbh, I don't care if someone cheats - I race those around me. How they end up riding in the same group as me is up to them .... I ride and race to get fit/lose weight, the competition is a bonus and motivator. Anything that makes me work harder than if I was on my own is an added benefit I'd love to ride outside more, join you guys on group rides, but I can't so I have to mostly limit myself to Zwift and it's quirks.
