Zwift Chat

[bridgy]

It feels like a strange turn in events when I’m actually finding excuses for people rather than condemning for them. But... I did notice you went out and did a 5 mile run the day before. I assume you’d be feeling that a bit I know I would.

I've been trying to include a bit of running in my exercise recently - probably not ideal for peak performances on the bike at the moment but hopefully a price worth paying in the longer term (for overall health and convenience of being able to run for exercise when cycling is logistically harder). I joined a gym about 6 weeks ago and have been doing 5-6km runs on Mondays and Wednesdays on the treadmill, and recently added slightly longer outdoor runs at the weekend to that. To be honest it was a lot worse when I first started but my legs are getting used to it a bit more now so I do tend to recover quicker. And most importantly I'm enjoying the new challenge!

So no excuse - my choice! And looking at my watts for that ride - 300w for the climb and 290 overall, that's about my limit I think. I could maybe squeeze 5 watts or so more on a really good day but that's about it and I think you'd have still beaten me then anyway!

Annoyingly, one thing that has NOT been a result of this extra exercise is any weight loss at all so it's not even helping me in that way either

 

[bridgy]

sorry, it was training plan, and yes it does but only on zwift rides. I don’t have it linked to SF.

You riding metrics include :
- your accumulated T-score 152.0
- your peak 3 sec power 640 W
- your peak 1 min power 349 W
- your peak 3 min power 294 W
- your peak 5 min power 282 W
- your peak 20 min power 265 W
- your peak 20 min heart rate 166 BPM
- your max heart rate 190 BPM

I've really noticed that my HR is a fair bit lower in races than it used to be when I first started doing this. I used to nearly always exceed 170bpm average and hit about 185 max, now it's about 5bpm lower for both these. Is this likely to be increased fitness/conditioning for this specific activity or just an age thing?

Edit: Or maybe I'm just not trying as hard as I used to. I mean, my watts were much higher back in those Bkool days.... 🤔

 

[gbrown]

I may be dead-peak hr hit 190 this week according to Training Peaks. Highest previously was 184.

I've really noticed that my HR is a fair bit lower in races than it used to be when I first started doing this. I used to nearly always exceed 170bpm average and hit about 185 max, now it's about 5bpm lower for both these. Is this likely to be increased fitness/conditioning for this specific activity or just an age thing?

As I understand it, your max heart rate is whatever you manage to achieve, and is generally a sign of cardio vascular fitness, although heart rate varies considerably between people so is not directly comparable.

Once over 40 or so it will decline as you get older. Over something like a 5 year period I would expect this to be noticeable.

Whether it is a good idea to push to your max heart rate is another question? I heard a podcast a few years ago about a marathon runner who had a heart attack. It said that as you age your blood vessels get deposits of plaque and high heart rates (and high blood pressure) can dislodge these, which can in turn cause bleeding and clots leading to possible heart attacks and strokes. This is why very fit people can sometimes have one or the other during or after exercising. But not exercising is likely to lead to higher blood pressure all the time, so I guess you have to find a balance.

Speaking of cardio vascular fitness, do people pay much attention to their VO2 Max figures? My Garmin gives me a figure, it says using my heart rate, power meter and GPS. If I ride a bit more, especially on up and down terrain where I can interleave short efforts and rests, it can improve considerably.

It says I'm currently top 20% for my age and gender, which makes me wonder why I am so slow on climbs (I'm around 73 Kg), but I suppose riding at a heart rate limit is bound to slow you down without reducing your fitness. I'd be curious what kind of VO2 Max figures you fast boys are getting?

Geoff

 

[bridgy]

As I understand it, your max heart rate is whatever you manage to achieve, and is generally a sign of cardio vascular fitness, although heart rate varies considerably between people so is not directly comparable.

Once over 40 or so it will decline as you get older. Over something like a 5 year period I would expect this to be noticeable.

Whether it is a good idea to push to your max heart rate is another question? I heard a podcast a few years ago about a marathon runner who had a heart attack. It said that as you age your blood vessels get deposits of plaque and high heart rates (and high blood pressure) can dislodge these, which can in turn cause bleeding and clots leading to possible heart attacks and strokes. This is why very fit people can sometimes have one or the other during or after exercising. But not exercising is likely to lead to higher blood pressure all the time, so I guess you have to find a balance.

Speaking of cardio vascular fitness, do people pay much attention to their VO2 Max figures? My Garmin gives me a figure, it says using my heart rate, power meter and GPS. If I ride a bit more, especially on up and down terrain where I can interleave short efforts and rests, it can improve considerably.

It says I'm currently top 20% for my age and gender, which makes me wonder why I am so slow on climbs (I'm around 73 Kg), but I suppose riding at a heart rate limit is bound to slow you down without reducing your fitness. I'd be curious what kind of VO2 Max figures you fast boys are getting?

Geoff

Thanks Geoff (good to hear from you by the way!) - that does make some sense about the age thing and was what I was suspecting. I don't pay much/any attention to VO2 max although I have recently realised that my Fitbit does make an estimation of it automatically - I have no idea how accurate this is (I can't imagine it will be hugely accurate) but for what its worth it says 48 which I think is OK for my age (47)

 

[Norry1]

As I understand it, your max heart rate is whatever you manage to achieve, and is generally a sign of cardio vascular fitness, although heart rate varies considerably between people so is not directly comparable.

Once over 40 or so it will decline as you get older. Over something like a 5 year period I would expect this to be noticeable.

Whether it is a good idea to push to your max heart rate is another question? I heard a podcast a few years ago about a marathon runner who had a heart attack. It said that as you age your blood vessels get deposits of plaque and high heart rates (and high blood pressure) can dislodge these, which can in turn cause bleeding and clots leading to possible heart attacks and strokes. This is why very fit people can sometimes have one or the other during or after exercising. But not exercising is likely to lead to higher blood pressure all the time, so I guess you have to find a balance.

Speaking of cardio vascular fitness, do people pay much attention to their VO2 Max figures? My Garmin gives me a figure, it says using my heart rate, power meter and GPS. If I ride a bit more, especially on up and down terrain where I can interleave short efforts and rests, it can improve considerably.

It says I'm currently top 20% for my age and gender, which makes me wonder why I am so slow on climbs (I'm around 73 Kg), but I suppose riding at a heart rate limit is bound to slow you down without reducing your fitness. I'd be curious what kind of VO2 Max figures you fast boys are getting?

Geoff

My Garmin says 68 but I have no idea how accurate or good/bad that is.

 

[bobinski]

Hi Geoff
Great to hear from you.
you make some important points. I take my heart health very seriously. I am the only male in my family who doesn’t have angina or worse. Then again I am the only active one and also perhaps overdoing it battling whatever genetic component predisposes the family to heart problems.
I have read a lot around it and bear in mind the recent research into high level endurance based activity on heart health. Leonard Zinn, the cyclist, experience made difficult reading.
I also use a hrm now as much to monitor recovery post effort and how quickly hr eases. So far (touches wood) so good. I absolutely don't need to hit high hr numbers- it proves nothing. My resting HR on waking last Thursday was 33. I have low BP. I worry more about that!
Would be great if you could join us sometime- if not online then one of our real life meet ups.

 

[CXRAndy]

Im on statins, have been for 5+ yrs. They are supposed as well as reducing cholesterol, smooth the linings of blood vessels, reducing chance of plaque dislodging- here's hoping

 

[bridgy]

My Garmin says 68 but I have no idea how accurate or good/bad that is.

I was quite happy with 48 until you said that . 68 is off the scale good for your age (well for any age actually)

 

[gbrown]

My Garmin says 68 but I have no idea how accurate or good/bad that is.

Wow, unless you are about 18 years old that is amazing.

Froome is supposedly between 80 and 88.

My Garmin says I'm between 41 and 44 at the moment, which at 58 yrs old is good enough for me!

Maximal oxygen uptake norms for men (ml/kg/min)

rating	18-25	26-35	36-45	46-55	56-65	65+
	Age (years)
excellent	> 60	> 56	> 51	> 45	> 41	> 37
good	52-60	49-56	43-51	39-45	36-41	33-37
above average	47-51	43-48	39-42	36-38	32-35	29-32
average	42-46	40-42	35-38	32-35	30-31	26-28
below average	37-41	35-39	31-34	29-31	26-29	22-25
poor	30-36	30-34	26-30	25-28	22-25	20-21
very poor	< 30	< 30	< 26	< 25	< 22	< 20

 

[CXRAndy]

Martins TOC performance points to an excellent fitness level- whether its correct or not, he must have a decent VO2 max.

I understand there is only so much you can do to lift the number, and thats down to genetics. Lowering weight, alters the ratio but doesnt really effect the VO2 number

 

[<Tommy>]

How are you guys working out vo2 max? I thought it was quite complicated for some reason.

 

[JuhaL]

I haven't done nothing special for Vo2 max, just normal ride on variated terrains. Last time when i did outdoor ride Garmin says my maximal oxygen uptake was 46, which is pretty good for my age (55). Not used my Garmin computer on indoor rides so don't know what it is now.

 

[mjd1988]

How are you guys working out vo2 max? I thought it was quite complicated for some reason.

The proper test is pretty horrendous looking, running on a treadmill with a Darth vader facemask on measuring what you are breathing in and out, but most fitness apps can do a surprisingly decent estimate based on resting and max heart rate

 

[CXRAndy]

Dont know my number, short HIT is supposed to lift it.

 

[bridgy]

How are you guys working out vo2 max? I thought it was quite complicated for some reason.

Fitness trackers work it out for you from things like HR data etc. Presumably they have access to a load of data from people whose VO2 max has been measured accurately, which they use to create an algorithm into which they feed your data to reverse engineer a VO2 max score - I don't know how accurate it is, but I guess there is a fair bit of variance depending on the quality of data fed into the algorithm and how well you personally fit into the standard models. Similar principle as the estimated power figures from Strava I suppose.