Wheel Bearing, Grease and Cup & Cone adjustment

[Profpointy]

Maybe not in cycling terms but in maintenance and reliability terms some greases are better than others and that was my main concern when looking for the mentioned grease.
I once used butter on the chain as an emergency ride home after I got caught in the rain. I was well aware that another bit of rain and the chain would be without any lubrication again but I got lucky.

Thanks for all the comments.

a pal of mine bust the sump on his jag based kit car driving it up a blatantly unsuitable track in the arse-end of nowhere. After removing and replacing the sump, having re-lined it with plastic bags, he refilled the engines with the dregs of engine oil he had left, supplemented by various cooking oils in his food box. Got him back to civilisation and a proper repair, and indeed proper engine oil.

 

[slowmotion]

a pal of mine bust the sump on his jag based kit car driving it up a blatantly unsuitable track in the arse-end of nowhere. After removing and replacing the sump, having re-lined it with plastic bags, he refilled the engines with the dregs of engine oil he had left, supplemented by various cooking oils in his food box. Got him back to civilisation and a proper repair, and indeed proper engine oil.

Excellent! Bush engineering on the cutting edge.

 

[mybike]

Depends on the bearing, most bicycle wheel bearings aren't sealed all that well and any excess grease will simply be displaced into the surrounding area.

I'm not so sure it's a good idea to have grease forcing itself out of a bearing. Certainly any sealing will be impaired & there are some places you don't want it to go.

 

[slowmotion]

I'm not so sure it's a good idea to have grease forcing itself out of a bearing. Certainly any sealing will be impaired & there are some places you don't want it to go.

I wouldn't want grease on my brake rims or my immaculate (ahem..) white bar tape, but I am entirely happy to have it elsewhere. Rather grease than water.

 

[sittingbull]

There are reasons for the array of different grease specifications. Just because one type appears to do the job of providing smooth lubrication dosn't mean it's suitable for the chosen application.My MTB has rubber O-rings on the headset to allow excess grease to ooze out when fresh is applied through the grease nipples. Similarly many wheel bearings have rubber seals and incompatible grease will lead to softening and swelling of the rubber.

Automotive oils/greases are typically designed for high speed/temperature applications which may make them less effectiive on a bike. I'd never use my motorcycle chain lube on my Spesh Allez chain, it's simply way too viscous and the absence of heat generated by the bicycle chain would limit the flow of lube into the links.

One of my lecturers (many moons ago ) managed to run a car engine on Coca-Cola (with additives).

 

[Spoked Wheels]

There are reasons for the array of different grease specifications. Just because one type appears to do the job of providing smooth lubrication dosn't mean it's suitable for the chosen application.My MTB has rubber O-rings on the headset to allow excess grease to ooze out when fresh is applied through the grease nipples. Similarly many wheel bearings have rubber seals and incompatible grease will lead to softening and swelling of the rubber.

Automotive oils/greases are typically designed for high speed/temperature applications which may make them less effectiive on a bike. I'd never use my motorcycle chain lube on my Spesh Allez chain, it's simply way too viscous and the absence of heat generated by the bicycle chain would limit the flow of lube into the links.

One of my lecturers (many moons ago ) managed to run a car engine on Coca-Cola (with additives).

This reminded me of somebody that fixed the brakes on his pick up truck maybe 40 years ago. He was in the middle of nowhere and one of the brake hose broke and he lost the brake fluid, He ended up manufacturing some rubber washers out of his wellies and using beer for brake fluid he bled the brakes and then he managed to make it to a garage even though he had plenty of obstacles on his way through the mountains.

 

[slowmotion]

One of my lecturers (many moons ago ) managed to run a car engine on Coca-Cola (with additives).[/QUOTE}

Did all the teeth on the cogs in the gearbox dissolve when soaked overnight?

 

[Gravity Aided]

I've used marine bearing grease, it wears in and works well. Lower viscosity, but better staying power. Does not seem to affect speed in the least.

 

[Spoked Wheels]

Here is a different situation:

Shimano are rather stingy with the amount of grease they pack the bearings in some new hubs. Would you top up with different grease or simply remove the existing grease and add new grease so all of the grease is of the same type?

@Gravity Aided Yes, marine grease keeps coming up as a good grease to use. The one I'm using also protects against salty water, etc.

 

[Yellow Saddle]

Here is a different situation:

Shimano are rather stingy with the amount of grease they pack the bearings in some new hubs. Would you top up with different grease or simply remove the existing grease and add new grease so all of the grease is of the same type?.

Neither. Leave it as it is. Shimano understands greasing and their automated machines inject the right amount of grease into the wheels.

 

[Yellow Saddle]

I'm not so sure it's a good idea to have grease forcing itself out of a bearing. Certainly any sealing will be impaired & there are some places you don't want it to go.

Not so. Why would it impair the seal?
Also, I can't think of a single place where the grease would go that would matter.
Have a look at my explanation here how seals work.
In engineering we say that a seal that does not leak, leaks. This comes from the fact that a dry wiper seal quickly abrades away and then inevitably leaks. Thus, it has to leak a bit of grease to lubricate itself. This grease is supplied by internal grease pressure that comes from ball churn.

I described it here: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/question-about-dodgy-wheel-bearings.175056/page-2

 

[Dirk]

[QUOTE 3551458, member: 9609"].......
is 'oused' a real word ? as in squeezed out, can't find it on the interweb (lot of weird words in my head)[/QUOTE]

Oozed.

 

[Spoked Wheels]

Neither. Leave it as it is. Shimano understands greasing and their automated machines inject the right amount of grease into the wheels.

OK, will do. I read some reviews as to why is not a good idea to mix different types of grease. Makes sense.

I read the bit about tightening a QR. I remember reading somewhere the bit about tightening till the white mark but I don't go that far, precisely for fear of damaging the ball bearings.
I do adjust the cone so that it feels slightly loose but the play disappears when he QR is tight. I'm reluctant to go too tight at this point, besides, I don't get a rubbing wheel...

The new Shimano Dura Ace has a new system that is adjusted much more easily but that is not the point I'd like to make. Shimano claims that with these new hubs is not longer necessary to leave a tiny little play. I'm not too sure about it and my hubs are new and yet to be fully built wheels so I have no means to test them but I read I guy that put the hubs to the test.... he adjusted the hubs and left a little play but when the QR was fully tightened the play disappeared.

Any knowledge on that?

 

[mybike]

Not so. Why would it impair the seal?
Also, I can't think of a single place where the grease would go that would matter.
Have a look at my explanation here how seals work.
In engineering we say that a seal that does not leak, leaks. This comes from the fact that a dry wiper seal quickly abrades away and then inevitably leaks. Thus, it has to leak a bit of grease to lubricate itself. This grease is supplied by internal grease pressure that comes from ball churn.

I described it here: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/question-about-dodgy-wheel-bearings.175056/page-2

It will damage the seal when solid grease, as opposed to an 'oil' film forces its way past it. It is the oily component of grease that lubricates, hence the melting point of the grease should be appropriate for the generated heat in the bearing. I used to work on electrical motors & grease in the wrong place was certainly a problem! And grease in the wrong places will certainly attract dirt/grit.

 

[Yellow Saddle]

OK, will do. I read some reviews as to why is not a good idea to mix different types of grease. Makes sense.

I read the bit about tightening a QR. I remember reading somewhere the bit about tightening till the white mark but I don't go that far, precisely for fear of damaging the ball bearings.
I do adjust the cone so that it feels slightly loose but the play disappears when he QR is tight. I'm reluctant to go too tight at this point, besides, I don't get a rubbing wheel...

The new Shimano Dura Ace has a new system that is adjusted much more easily but that is not the point I'd like to make. Shimano claims that with these new hubs is not longer necessary to leave a tiny little play. I'm not too sure about it and my hubs are new and yet to be fully built wheels so I have no means to test them but I read I guy that put the hubs to the test.... he adjusted the hubs and left a little play but when the QR was fully tightened the play disappeared.

Any knowledge on that?

Those are Shimano's new "digital" bearings. They appeared about two years ago and after I've left the trade, so I've never seen them in the flesh. I've done the Shimano online course on adjusting them though but to be honest, I can't get my mind around it until I've seen them, seen them fail/not fail etc.

Shimano has a dilemma. It's bearings are the second-best in the industry and its products are the industry's most prolific. However, cup-and-cone bearings have a bad rap for all the wrong reasons, adjustment tricks included. I think "digital" is a noble attempt to eliminate that problem and get the rap right. Rather that than go for the inferior system of cartridge bearings.