What chain lube?

[FishFright]

Ah ha, and according to the documents the difference in friction between best and worst lube is about 1.7W for your casual cyclist. Not going to be noticeable. Plus the error in longevity is +/- 2000km.

The data doesn't suit my riding either so that proves it's invalid.

 

[Peter Salt]

How does a baseline chain fair say 5w30 engine oil or 3in1 oil.

Then we could see if these lubes are any better than average oil.

Engine oil is a lubricant, but designed to operate optimally in high-temperature, closed environment - the exact opposite of your bicycle drivetrain. New or used, will attract an extraordinary amount of particles which will stay to your chain, penetrate the rollers and create a grinding paste.

3-in-1 - it's basically mineral oil, with small amounts of other toxic additives. Will attract dirt a less than engine oil but a lot more than modern chain lubes - even bad ones.

Ah ha, and according to the documents the difference in friction between best and worst lube is about 1.7W for your casual cyclist. Not going to be noticeable. Plus the error in longevity is +/- 2000km.

Apparently I need to take spare chains for my multi day audaxes, to save those watts!

You do realise that across this entire thread, you're the only one who appears to be looking for some sort of massive watt savings, right? You've somehow convinced yourself that the only reason why the 'kids' do it is because of watt gains - completely ignoring everything else, trying to prove that you were always right and experts know nothing. Even adding a wonderfully silly 'Ah ha!' - when a topic went over your head - priceless.

Longevity estimate is based on component wear throughout the protocol. If you have a closer look at the raw data, you may notice that on many occasions, they don't last throughout the whole thing - a handful of lubes didn't make it past block 2. To me, that means that some results will require extrapolation and increase the margin of error. I'm not trying to change anyone's mind here - I don't care how quickly you go through your components - it's not my money. Stick to whatever your using - even if its the whale oil that the other stand-up comedian suggested.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

You do realise that across this entire thread, you're the only one who appears to be looking for some sort of massive watt savings, right?

Which post do I say I’m looking for massive watt savings?

Why mention efficiency savings if they are so small as to be not worth considering then? You are the one who brought it up.

 

[Peter Salt]

Why mention efficiency savings if they are so small as to be not worth considering then? You are the one who brought it up.

It was in a context of technical terms. Lubricants reduce friction, increased friction reduces efficiency, efficiency can be measured easily by comparing power losses while measuring friction itself is far more complicated.

Do also take into account that the differences you mentioned are between newly applied lubricants. If one said lubricant wears your components by 3% over 1000km while the other, over the same distance, causes a 20% degradation - that changes the situation quite dramatically.

I think I've exceeded my pro bono consultancy hours for the year. Price on application.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

the whale oil that the other stand-up comedian suggested.

What! Not taking things seriously in an online forum??

 

[Ming the Merciless]

It was in a context of technical terms. Lubricants reduce friction, increased friction reduces efficiency, efficiency can be measured easily by comparing power losses while measuring friction itself is far more complicated.

Do also take into account that the differences you mentioned are between newly applied lubricants. If one said lubricant wears your components by 3% over 1000km while the other, over the same distance, causes a 20% degradation - that changes the situation quite dramatically.

I think I've exceeded my pro bono consultancy hours for the year. Price on application.

Where did I mention I am wanting massive watts savings?

 

[Sallar55]

For me its Rock&Roll lube, its the easiest to one to clean off your hands. Always take a bottle of the blue stuff on tour.
https://thecycleclinic.co.uk/collections/chain-lubrication-and-greases

 

[Dogtrousers]

(For most mortals, merely anything is better than nothing, and the gradations between different ones are moot)

This is the an important point. The difference between doing nothing and doing something is vast. Between something and something else, not so much. Good enough is good enough.

But it's all grist to the Cyclechat argument mill for people who like that kind of thing.

 

[Jameshow]

Engine oil is a lubricant, but designed to operate optimally in high-temperature, closed environment - the exact opposite of your bicycle drivetrain. New or used, will attract an extraordinary amount of particles which will stay to your chain, penetrate the rollers and create a grinding paste.

3-in-1 - it's basically mineral oil, with small amounts of other toxic additives. Will attract dirt a less than engine oil but a lot more than modern chain lubes - even bad ones.


You do realise that across this entire thread, you're the only one who appears to be looking for some sort of massive watt savings, right? You've somehow convinced yourself that the only reason why the 'kids' do it is because of watt gains - completely ignoring everything else, trying to prove that you were always right and experts know nothing. Even adding a wonderfully silly 'Ah ha!' - when a topic went over your head - priceless.

Longevity estimate is based on component wear throughout the protocol. If you have a closer look at the raw data, you may notice that on many occasions, they don't last throughout the whole thing - a handful of lubes didn't make it past block 2. To me, that means that some results will require extrapolation and increase the margin of error. I'm not trying to change anyone's mind here - I don't care how quickly you go through your components - it's not my money. Stick to whatever your using - even if its the whale oil that the other stand-up comedian suggested.

Engine oil is Mineral oil or a semi synthetic modification.

I don't find my chain gets very grimy, dry yes, grimy no, I don't regularly do green lanes bridleway or towpaths ..

 

[Jameshow]

For me its Rock&Roll lube, its the easiest to one to clean off your hands. Always take a bottle of the blue stuff on tour.
https://thecycleclinic.co.uk/collections/chain-lubrication-and-greases

Wow that's well written marketing speak!!

 

[raleighnut]

Chainsaw chain oil here

 

[T4tomo]

I enjoy this sort of conversation. What I don't enjoy is half a sentence as a reply, by people who have no professional knowledge of the subject.

As for your bullet points:

• 'Most' is a very broad term. You mean more than half? Probably correct. That said, according to some independent testing, 1000km with no lubricant and no contamination at all wears the chain to about 90%. There are lubes out there that reduce that to only about 70% while the best ones get to single digits and the very best to fractions. Taking that into account, saying 'just use anything' is counterproductive.
• Any colour variations would come from amount of active ingredients of said lubes, whether they're organic or synthetic and type of contamination. Cleaner lube doesn't mean better lube - it may mean fewer chainring tattoos though.
• A rag will only clean the chain from the outside. Your main enemy is contamination getting into the rollers.

But at the end of the day - everyone can do what they want. Talking chain lubes, especially immersive waxing, often feels like having a conversation about smoking. The technical and practical evidence is clear - just because your grandma lived to 90 smoking 2 packs a day is irrelevant. As a mechanical engineer I can only show you the evidence and give best possible advice - but can't force anyone to follow it.

Is a concise list of bullets half a sentence, or is it much more than a sentence?

Btw I don't doubt your expertise, but my other point is these single digit / fractions lubes are (and I'm happy to be shown otherwise) a lot more expensive than my bottle of Squirt (plus some GT85 for a bit of cleaning flushing of the 'inside' / rollers.)
Taking a step back from the data, a chain costs £15-20, so it's a question of how much £, or time in the case of immersive waxing, is it worth spending to eke out more mile / time from a consumable. It isn't worth consuming more of one consumable to save another.

Like Fab Foodie, I often sling on a new chain in the spring anyway.

 

[biggs682]

Anything is better than nothing as long as it's applied.

 

[Drago]

It's getting feisty. I predict the first blows (well, slaps) by 11am.

 

[november4]

I like finish line dry, it works and easy to clean off with rags and a little car shampoo in bucket of water to leave brand new chain then reapply..... The Bs designed the bottle to splurge out too much so I put some in a different bottle to apply. I avoid rain though.

I do tend to clean my chain a lot as get blown sand from coastal roads, so oil based not really worth the hassle

Waxing looks easy and good but how many times can you reuse a kmc quick link? Might give squirt a go next instead.