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Location
España
I'm not allowed in the local recycling centre! Cars only!
That happened me in NL (of all places) when I was clearing out my home. We had a chat and given that I was loaded (4 panniers on bike, 2 on trailer and stuff on front & back racks) we all agreed that I was as good as a car or small van. I had several trips to do and ne'er a problem afterwards.
There, the system was to drive to the appropriate, designated skip, unload and move on to the next. Very little walking. Bugger of a ramp, though!

A polite letter to the people in charge might help.
Failing that, a few people on bikes with stuff to recycle and a photograph of refusal might embarrass them into action.

You spend a not insubstantial amount for a motor and keeping it legal for those rare "just in case" moments.
That's very true.

People have different tolerances to their "needs"
Exactly. Judging other people's needs rarely ends well.
 

Tenkaykev

Guru
Location
Poole
I'm not allowed in the local recycling centre! Cars only!
I pointed this out to our local Council and it was changed ( probably not because of my email, I'm sure lots more people pointed out the issue )
This is now on the Council website:

" Pedestrians (on foot or on a bicycle) are allowed to bring waste to the site but must report at the security gate and provide the appropriate evidence of BCP Council residency. Pedestrians must follow the guidance of site staff at all times. Pedestrians cannot bring waste onto the site that they cannot carry themselves and must be no larger than a bin bag or rucksack."
 

Drago

Legendary Member
We've covered this recently elsewhere, but there is nothing in the legislation thet gives them the power to demand proof of residency before discharging their legal obligation to provide a tip/recycling centre/whatever trendy name they can think or this week, for your use. Were you to decline to provide such evidence and they refused entry they would be acting unlawfully.
 
Train works at the weekend are causing some issues ATM If my normal line was open Sundays I could travel for £10 (advance) but on the line that is open* its double that, and I have to travel with Transpennine instead on my preferred Northern. Works are only temporary though and should give improvements overall.

* I should count myself lucky I have 2 lines to choose from though!
 

annedonnelly

Girl from the North Country
I pointed this out to our local Council and it was changed ( probably not because of my email, I'm sure lots more people pointed out the issue )
This is now on the Council website:

" Pedestrians (on foot or on a bicycle) are allowed to bring waste to the site but must report at the security gate and provide the appropriate evidence of BCP Council residency. Pedestrians must follow the guidance of site staff at all times. Pedestrians cannot bring waste onto the site that they cannot carry themselves and must be no larger than a bin bag or rucksack."

I should make an effort and complain to ours. I did raise it as an issue when they were doing webinars relating to climate change during Covid but not in an official way.

When I do go to the tip there is often a bike parked up outside the office so presumably one of the staff cycles to work.
 

Alex321

Guru
Location
South Wales
We've covered this recently elsewhere, but there is nothing in the legislation thet gives them the power to demand proof of residency before discharging their legal obligation to provide a tip/recycling centre/whatever trendy name they can think or this week, for your use. Were you to decline to provide such evidence and they refused entry they would be acting unlawfully.

The legislation only gives them the legal obligation to provide the service for residents of that council area. They are entitled to ask for proof of residency, since they have no obligation to provide the service to anybody else.
 

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
The legislation only gives them the legal obligation to provide the service for residents of that council area. They are entitled to ask for proof of residency, since they have no obligation to provide the service to anybody else.
This is true and anyone can see the "resident" restriction at 51(1)(b) of https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1990/43/section/51

However, there is no power to limit the service to motorists.
 

Drago

Legendary Member
The legislation only gives them the legal obligation to provide the service for residents of that council area. They are entitled to ask for proof of residency, since they have no obligation to provide the service to anybody else.

The legislation allows them to refuse entry to non residents, but it does not grant them any legal power to demand proof of residency. One does not follow the other as a matter of lawful course.

It's like the child seat legislation. Children have to be a certain. Height, age, etc before not travelling in one, but the police have no power to demand proof of age or measure them.

Powers required legislation in order to be enacted, they cannot be assumed.

So yes, they can refuse the service to non residents, but no, they have no lawful power to demand proof of residency. The chicken does not automatically begat the egg - you're getting the two matters confused.
 

Alex321

Guru
Location
South Wales
The legislation allows them to refuse entry to non residents, but it does not grant them any legal power to demand proof of residency. One does not follow the other as a matter of lawful course.

It's like the child seat legislation. Children have to be a certain. Height, age, etc before not travelling in one, but the police have no power to demand proof of age or measure them.

Powers required legislation in order to be enacted, they cannot be assumed.

So yes, they can refuse the service to non residents, but no, they have no lawful power to demand proof of residency. The chicken does not automatically begat the egg - you're getting the two matters confused.

Sorry, but that just makes no sense at all.

They can refuse entry to non-residents, but they are not allowed any way to be sure whether somebody is a resident or not.

I know logic is not always the strongest part of our legislators work, but that really makes no sense at all.

And I think you are wrong in the basic premise there. If any service is limited to certain people, then those providing the service must have a right to ensure only those eligible are served. This isn't the same as things like seatbelt law, where no service is being provided.
 

classic33

Leg End Member
I pointed this out to our local Council and it was changed ( probably not because of my email, I'm sure lots more people pointed out the issue )
This is now on the Council website:

" Pedestrians (on foot or on a bicycle) are allowed to bring waste to the site but must report at the security gate and provide the appropriate evidence of BCP Council residency. Pedestrians must follow the guidance of site staff at all times. Pedestrians cannot bring waste onto the site that they cannot carry themselves and must be no larger than a bin bag or rucksack."
You're not a pedestrian on a bicycle though. Even my local council had to conced that part.

Who's doing the bins round your area?
 
Location
España
Sage words indeed, although when it comes to genuinely assessing  need the typical motorist has a very skewed view of things in order to justify and perpetuate the status quo and thus prevent them having to expend effort.

That's just a polite way of saying that the typical car driver is lazy. And telling me I'm talking crap.

The point I was attempting to make is that if there is to be change it's generally not a good idea to start from the position of being insulting about the "other", no matter how polite. That attitude leaks out, gets picked up on and there aren't too many people who change their mind by being insulted.

Nobody likes change. Or at least, very, very few. If we want to convince people to change we need to listen to them, understand them, and show them where we think they're in error, demonstrate the things they're missing out on, encourage them to question their own ideas and notions.
We don't operate in a vacuum. I grew up up thinking all I wanted was a Golf GTi. Cars are presented as giving us freedom. Very aspirational.

That's why threads like this leave me so bemused. There is very little of "that's a great idea! Let's try to make this work/improve it/spread it around". There's invariably a "that'll never work because......." which descends quickly into insulting the "other". Venting appears to trump progress.
Vent at me and I'm likely to vent back. It's a zero sum game.

I'm car free and I'm the laziest bugger I know!
I know a family of two working parents, 2 kids and two cars. They're not lazy. She's training for a half marathon, he's a triathlete, they do a couple of crazy weekend challenges every year. Grandparents need particular care, of late one or the other some emergency care, one of the kids in University is busy chasing down work and experience that wouldn't be possible depending on public transport, one of the cars is used twice weekly to ferry young lads to various sportsgrounds around the county (clubs no longer run buses - too expensive).
Their youngest is gutted after moving to "big school" - despite E-books his teachers are insisting on the paper copies for each class so he can no longer carry his schoolbag on his bike to school - it's too heavy. There's no public transport, it's too far to walk so a car it is. (At least the local parents take turns so only 1 car makes the run).
They're not lazy. But they'll tell you they need their cars. And they do.

The things that would reduce their need to zero are outside an individual's control.
  • Public transport.
  • Joined up thinking (a la school books and the amusing fact that around the schools is the most dangerous place for bikes with cars dashing in and out, double and triple parking)
  • Proper funding for sports clubs etc.
And none of those will reduce the worry of receiving a call in the middle of the night about an ailing parent or the worry of children on busy roads.

But there are things we can participate in and encourage that will reduce the need and open people up to new experiences.
Bike chains are a great way of getting kids to school on bikes.
Encouraging car sharing/ride sharing reduces the cars on the road.
And politics. But I'm not going there.

Start small. Finish big. And try not to insult my friends along the way.
 
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