The heretics guide to Brompton use - Part two - it is not a premium product!

[Time Waster]

I put Marathons on mine as I did need the tread. Back then I had to ride into an industrial estate that had potholes big enough to take a bulk carrier truck. When a contruction bulk carrier goes slowly to get through the pothole I think there is a very good reason to have treaded tyres!!! The gravel was ok but it was the fist sized rocks hidden by the nearly hub deep water I had to go through after heavy rain that was a bigger issue!!!!

BTW I did need a folding bike as the train guard I often encountered was a battle axe who had no issues stopping cyclists from taking their bikes on trains if a little packed. With all the cancelled trains back then it was always packed but my Brompton was a bike she could not turn away. SO I made the best of the bike with a more tready Marathon tyre. It came with racers. The front one got a cut in it when I hit a big pothole, sharp edge straight on. That was a week into using it and I got my pilots licence on the back of the time spent in the air after that!! It was a nothing pothole too!!

 

[wafter]

Oddly the lack of stainless fasteners can only be part of the greed thing, but my newer Bromptons don't seem to have these rust issues, did they change the specification in 2016 or thereabouts?

Mine's a 2021 model with a lot of rusty little bits - brake fixings and springs, jockey wheel inserts - and not so little bits (frame and rear triangle internally ).

That's after about 18 months / 4.5k miles of use in all weathers but kept in the dry. It's pretty bloody poor IMO.

 

[Andy in Germany]

Oddly, I'm finding this all fairly liberating: if Bromptons have room for improvement (and I'm certainly seeing the issues described here) it gives ma a licence to start improving mine and make it into an excellent bike.

I do appreciate that option isn't open to everyone.

Now, I've heard mention of after sales parts being available: can anyone give me any recommendations?

 

[Time Waster]

Oh you have a lot to learn!! There are so many things you can do.

 

[Regular.Cyclist]

I bought a 6 speed Brompton back in 2017. Just has a look at the website now and am astonished at the price of them now.

I never didn’t think it was worth the price back in 2017 but they are having a laugh now. I was able to sell mile for good money a couple of years later, so they do hold their worth better than most, but I’ve recently bought a Btwin folding bike, brand new, for £200. Ok it doesn't fold quite as small as a Brompton but it is very much better value for money.

Brompton due charge a premium price but it’s far from being a premium product.

 

[Time Waster]

Suspension Blocks
Hinge clamps
Eassy wheels
Handlebars
Saddles

Seriously, this only part of your options from one retailer alone. There is a Brompton afternmarkets shop called Brilliant Bikes in the UK but for serious modifiers IIRC Netherlands has a better shop for such things. Can't remember the name. I think there are a few in London too.

The other source of Brompton pimpin components is I think Japan and Singapore. My advice is to just google Brompton modification. I think you can spend thousands of pounds modding Brompton. Kinetics in Glasgow for reall har core modding such as to fit 20" wheels or to take disc brakes I thing. They do forks and rear triangle setups to do this. Then there is Eerder Metaal in Netherlands too.

Seriously, if you want to pimp your Brompton then it is up to your imagination what you can do!!

 

[Time Waster]

There are superlights about £2.5k I think. For that you could get a R&M Birdy with front and rear suspension, a fold that is almost as small and as good, plus pretty much any standard drive train option. Standard deraileur gear setup, belt drive, alfine and other hub gears with more gears. They even have a pinion option too. Obviously the more complex or niche the drive train is the more the price. I think for the price of the superlight Brompton you could get a Birdy with more gears and just as lighr with front and rear suspension.

I think there are Bromptons for as low as £850 direct as back when I got mine in 2020. however the M6 R type like mine is about the same price as I spent at £1350 I think when I last looked. BTW back when I got mine they were very rare as the factory stopped producing for so long and retailers were rationed with new ones. You had to pay more for used ones than RRP was.

 

[Gunk]

There is a Brompton afternmarkets shop called Brilliant Bikes in the UK

it’s not an aftermarket shop, it’s a main dealer.

 

[wafter]

Oddly, I'm finding this all fairly liberating: if Bromptons have room for improvement (and I'm certainly seeing the issues described here) it gives ma a licence to start improving mine and make it into an excellent bike.

I do appreciate that option isn't open to everyone.

Now, I've heard mention of after sales parts being available: can anyone give me any recommendations?

Unfortunately IMO the worst problems are with the largest, most fundamental parts of the bike - i.e. the crap hinges and seatpost clamp setup, along with the frame's propensity towards rusting from the inside and near-total absence of abrasion protection from the factory.

While the last two can be sorted with cavity wax and frame tape / plates, you're pretty much stuck with the frame's significant design issues.

Broad strokes I don't think there's a whole lot wrong (in functional terms) with most of the bits you can easily replace... unless you're going to go all out with a disc brake conversion the latest spec calipers are fine, gearing's quirky but largely fit for purpose while it seems most of the mods are flawed in some way unless you pay big money for a Rohloff..

Some areas do benefit from off-the-shelf upgrades (EZ wheels for one) but there's also a lot of cheapo / pointless tat on offer. There's quite a lot of Ti stuff; Chinese bits of dubious quality and better quality gear that's eye-wateringly expensive and arguably poor value for the mass saving.

Ironically there's a lot of room for improvement in the mudguards / flaps, but nobody seems to make meaningfully better replacements.

While I'm all for improvements mine's seen very little in the way of off-the-shelf bolt-ons.

 

[Time Waster]

I disagree with the gearing being fit for purpose. The hub gear is widely spaced and It is likely that you need to change the chainring to get the gear range more user friendly. The 6 speed, which I have, I found that to smoothly go up and down the gearing you often have to switch between plus and minus 2 speed gears in between the 3 hub gearing. I think otherwise the jumps are a bit too much IMO. Then you have the two speed gears that you need to pedal like any other derailleur gear setup and the hub that you need to not pedal mostly (it will change with pedalling if you get it right). So if you are going uphill, better change down on the hub gears before you hit it and spin out until it bites on the hill. Otherwise when you stop the pedalling to change the hub gear you slow quickly and lose momentum.

So this all makes the gearing less than smooth in actual operation. I think it is barely useable on the steep hills I used to commute on. It would be nice if Brompton innovated a bit and developed a proper derailleur based gearing for their bikes. Perhaps even with market standard specs. I don't think it is possible with the bike construction though it would be good I reckon. Birdy manage a wide range of gearing and driivetrain options I believe.

 

[brommieinkorea]

Hmmm don't have a problem with the gearing, but it could be lower (mine already have the 44 t chainring). I hate derailleurs, nothing more glitchy and requiring constant fiddling (rim brakes aside), the gearing is reminiscent of the old "10 speed" configuration without the redundant gears, likely designed to compete directly with it ...1975 and all....
Birdy, great bike no doubt, but a full 6" longer folded which brings it way over max airline dimensions so a non-starter for many.
Dahon entered the fray with the Curl, and blew it. If they had eliminated the sh*ty brakes, and built it out of stainless with all of the Bromptons good attributes etc... and not tried to market an alluminum clone for the same price ! They had an opportunity to build it better, and dropped the ball.
The "premium product" shtick is allowing the cloners to make one for a tenth the investment then sell it for half the price of a Brompton, so the buyer can slap a Brompton sticker on it ,voila part of the club. No idea if a Mobot could outlast or out perform a Brompton, but it would be nice to find that the case.

 

[wafter]

I disagree with the gearing being fit for purpose. The hub gear is widely spaced and It is likely that you need to change the chainring to get the gear range more user friendly. The 6 speed, which I have, I found that to smoothly go up and down the gearing you often have to switch between plus and minus 2 speed gears in between the 3 hub gearing. I think otherwise the jumps are a bit too much IMO.

That's how it's intended to be used; from the lowest to the highest ratios the order should be: 1-, 1+, 2-, 2+, 3-, 3+.

Using it in this way the spacing is still pretty wide but even, while I find the overall range pretty accommodating and comparable to other more conventional bikes.

In practice I start off in 2- and flick between this and 2+ during most riding while 3- gets used fairly regularly. 3+ only sees use when I'm absolultely hammering it and the hub's lowest setting rarely sees any action because my commute is pretty flat.

Fair point about the two different systems shifting preferences; however in practice I find the hub shifts fine when pedalling as long as it's not under load - i.e. back your cadence off so you're effectively coasting; still turning the pedals but not really applying any force.

 

[Andy in Germany]

unless you pay big money for a Rohloff..

Hmm... we have some old Rohloff hubs lurking in the wheel store; it would certainly remove all my current gearing issues although it'd probably not do much for the weight...

 

[Time Waster]

That's how it's intended to be used; from the lowest to the highest ratios the order should be: 1-, 1+, 2-, 2+, 3-, 3+.

Using it in this way the spacing is still pretty wide but even, while I find the overall range pretty accommodating and comparable to other more conventional bikes.

In practice I start off in 2- and flick between this and 2+ during most riding while 3- gets used fairly regularly. 3+ only sees use when I'm absolultely hammering it and the hub's lowest setting rarely sees any action because my commute is pretty flat.

Fair point about the two different systems shifting preferences; however in practice I find the hub shifts fine when pedalling as long as it's not under load - i.e. back your cadence off so you're effectively coasting; still turning the pedals but not really applying any force.

Yes I know but it is a clunky system. It is not user friendly and the faff of switching from one type of shift to another. So you pedal to change the +/- then stop for the hub then pedal to switch the +/- then stop pedalling... I know it is easy to do each but lets be honest this is a crap system to get even spread of gearing. Then there are the situations when you need to shift two or more gears at once. You have to think a bit more about that I reckon. A good system uses one mechanism of change whether that is derailleur only or larger spread hub gear only. It would be nice to get an alfine on a Brompton for example.

 

[Time Waster]

That's how it's intended to be used; from the lowest to the highest ratios the order should be: 1-, 1+, 2-, 2+, 3-, 3+.

Using it in this way the spacing is still pretty wide but even, while I find the overall range pretty accommodating and comparable to other more conventional bikes.

In practice I start off in 2- and flick between this and 2+ during most riding while 3- gets used fairly regularly. 3+ only sees use when I'm absolultely hammering it and the hub's lowest setting rarely sees any action because my commute is pretty flat.

Fair point about the two different systems shifting preferences; however in practice I find the hub shifts fine when pedalling as long as it's not under load - i.e. back your cadence off so you're effectively coasting; still turning the pedals but not really applying any force.

This also loses momentum if you are on a hill. Which goes back to selecting the gear before the hill to spin out until up the hill a bit. I live near some very steep hills and used to commute over one. It was that way or double the journey time, but that hill sometimes beat me on the Brommie. Usually if I got the gears wrong before the steep part. I got sick of having to push my brommie up that hill when I first got it until I worked the best gear out and how / when to go into it to push on ok.