Rotational head injuries

[Mark_Robson]

I wanted to be polite and let you go first!

Touche

Actually I have to say that putting a pointy end on the back of a helmet isn't the most sensible design concept imaginable. I would rather that manufacturers omitted it and decreased the chance of a rotational injury, however miniscule the likelihood of a rotational injury is.

 

[ufkacbln]

We've agreed!

 

[totallyfixed]

My understanding Chris would be in the supposed event of your head hitting the road that the helmet 'could' cause your head to 'rotate' causing possibly more injury that had you not been wearing a helmet.

I say 'supposed' because i dont buy it. In some circumstances i suppose it is possible, but i wouldnt let that stop me wearing or buying one. Co-incidentally, i'm an occasional helmet wearer, mainly for city commuting, dark or poor weather. I dont have an axe to grind one way or the other.
Personally, i think its a ruse overused by the anti wearing brigade to justify not wearing.

As a rule I don't get involved in helmet debates and you are of course entitled to your opinion even if it is ill informed and illogical. I will never wear a helmet on the road precisely because of a real fear of a rotational head injury. I have some distressing experience of this injury and it is not a "ruse" as you put it.

 

[Norm]

I don't recall there being any worries expressed by motorcyclists about rotational head injuries caused by helmets.

That's because...

Rotational injuries are a problem (or not) attributed to the design of helmets.

THe theory goes that instead of sliding and shedding momentum, these points can snag and arrest movement causing the helmet to rotate th head, and cause injury with the abrupt stop (diffuse axonal injury). In some cases this may even cause the helmet to eject and come off the head.

... motorbike helmets are either smooth on the outside or they have pointy bits (vents, brows etc) which will be torn off if you are sliding.

Cycling helmets, though, (BMX-style aside) are usually a plastic lattice-work. This seems to be designed to catch and snag on anything from a kerb stone to a tree-branch - the latter having caused me a shock when I got caught up going through a tree whose branches were a few feet lower than usual in a rain storm a few weeks ago.

 

[henshaw11]

>I don't recall there being any worries expressed by motorcyclists about rotational head injuries caused by helmets.

Probably 'cos they're more worried about non-rotional head injuries from simply hitting something else at (a usually more considerable) speed.

That said, this appeared in the press back in feb:
http://www.bikeradar...-injuries-25081
-seems there's two manufacturers using it - one cycling, one motorcycling.

 

[snorri]

On another forum I saw reference to 'rotational head injuries caused by helmets.'

I think the reference should have been to neck injury due to head rotation, rather than head injury.

 

[ufkacbln]

I don't recall there being any worries expressed by motorcyclists about rotational head injuries caused by helmets.

I think the reference should have been to neck injury due to head rotation, rather than head injury.

They were (and still are) - Google Diffuse Axonal Injury.........

DAI and concussion caused by movement of the brain within the skull (and a function of the mechanism by which the head is arrested) are both something you need to be aware of, and in some papers claimed to be as much as 40% of admitted head injuries.

They are worsened where the impact is oblique - exactly the type of impact where the snag points are goig to cause rotation and decellaration.

Neck injuries occur as well, and arguably caused by the same mechanisms

 

[xpc316e]

I don't recall there being any worries expressed by motorcyclists about rotational head injuries caused by helmets.

That's not quite the case: years ago helmets had to have a completley smooth outer surface so as not to snag when sliding down the road and cause a head to rotate. There were certain excellent helemts that did not meet British Standards because of this issue. These days helemts are covered in vents, cathces to open them, etc., and little or no notice seems to have paid to rotational injuries. I am not aware of any changes to standards, but fashion has definitely changed.

 

[gbb]

As a rule I don't get involved in helmet debates and you are of course entitled to your opinion even if it is ill informed and illogical. I will never wear a helmet on the road precisely because of a real fear of a rotational head injury. I have some distressing experience of this injury and it is not a "ruse" as you put it.

Perhaps i havnt put it well...
A 'ruse' should perhaps be rewritten as an 'overstatement' made by the anti wearing brigade. Even the term anti helmet brigade is unintentionally inflammatory, they're entitled to their opinion...its the overstatement of ONE aspect of wearing i don't like.
.
I dont think of it as illogical or ill informed. As stated, i dont really have an opinion one way or the other...i'm sure it is possible to cause rotational injuries...albeit in a very few cases.

Like everything in life, there are pros and cons. I wear a helmet occasionally dependant on circumstances (poor weather/city commuting)...but certainly wouldnt NOT wear one for fear of the (IMO) small chances of rotational injury.

I work on the principle that IF i were in an accident, i'd rather be wearing a helmet and risk the small (IMO again) chance of rotational injury than smacking my unprotected head against the floor.
Nothing in life is guaranteed...you pays yer money, you take your chance.

I guess the gist of it is that to focus on one potentially bad aspect of helmet wearing is at best 'illogical or ill informed'. You have to see the bigger picture. (not you personally TFixed...but cyclists in general).

Just to reiterate...i dont have an opinion either way...wear if you want to, dont if you dont. The above is just my opinion.

 

[Ravenbait]

I've suffered rotational injury and as a result I don't wear a helmet unless riding off-road or required to by race regulations.

I've fallen off my bike both while wearing a helmet and when not wearing one. After falling at relatively high speed when not wearing one I ended up in hospital with a massive impact wound. To my elbow. My head didn't touch the ground. I was back on the bike a week later and have a lovely scar I sometimes pretend was caused by a shark. After falling at relatively low speed while wearing one I ended up seeing a physio for more than a year to sort out the disc injury in my neck. I didn't catch any pointy bits -- just the side of the helmet.

These experiences have informed my opinion about the relative usefulness of helmets, however they are anecdotes, not science.

Sam

 

[jimboalee]

PS - when do you loase the 'newbie' tag around here?

When you can change a set of brake blocks.

 

[Keith Oates]

I do not have any hard opinion on whether people should or should not wear a helmet but having said that I almost always wear one. I don’t
think that wearing a helmet will always protect your head from injury and I also don’t think that wearing one will always give you an injury such as the
one mentioned above by Sam. However I’m not sitting on the fence with this because I do think that pros of wearing one outweighs the cons and would
generally say to anyone that asks that buying and wearing a helmet is the sensible course of action to take.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ColinJ]

There will be situations where a helmet protects you from injury and others where one makes injuries worse. 

It is up to the individual whether to wear a helmet or not and the law shouldn't get involved.

I choose to wear a helmet for every ride.

I've had completely unpredictable things happen to me and have gone down fast and hard, whacking my head on the road as a result. For example, under heavy braking on a steep hill, my tyre crept round and ripped the valve out of my front tube. I had absolutely no chance of controlling the bike. My head was not injured despite effectively head-butting the road at about 10 mph.

On a mountain bike ride, my friend's semi-slick tyres provided woefully inadequate grip on slick wet Yorkshire stone. She was descending in front of me when I saw her front wheel slide out from under her. I got a very good view of the side of her head slamming against a huge chunk of rock. She suffered no head injury - a gory battered elbow, yes!

Think about this: You are in mid air having been launched off your bike by some catastrophic event. I have frozen time and offer you this choice - Helmet on or helmet off? You are not allowed to calculate your trajectory to work out what part of you will hit what hard object. You cannot put your arms into a defensive position. You have to respond instinctively - helmet/no helmet?

If you would choose the helmet in that scenario, then wear one. If you wouldn't, then don't. I think some people don't wear helmets because they think they won't ever fall off their bike. That's the wrong reason not to wear a helmet. It doesn't matter how experienced you are, or how careful you are, the risk is always there. Don't decide not to wear one because you think it will never happen to you!

 

[Ravenbait]

Think about this: You are in mid air having been launched off your bike by some catastrophic event. I have frozen time and offer you this choice - Helmet on or helmet off? You are not allowed to calculate your trajectory to work out what part of you will hit what hard object. You cannot put your arms into a defensive position. You have to respond instinctively - helmet/no helmet?

Why not?

Other than the emphasised section that is basically what happened to me. I was launched -- well, I launched myself, to be fair -- into the air when a small child appeared unexpectedly in front of me and it was impossible to go around. I was not wearing a helmet. I landed on my bike, on my elbow, picked myself up and rode to work (only then discovering the extent of the injury).

I don't really mind what choice people make regarding what to wear or not to wear on their heads, but if you are going to present them with a method of coming to a decision, at least make it a realistic one. I don't recall any occasion in which my hands have been superglued to the bars and my body has generally been pretty good at instinctively breaking my fall. We didn't evolve wearing helmets, after all.

Sam

 

[ColinJ]

Why not?

Other than the emphasised section that is basically what happened to me. I was launched -- well, I launched myself, to be fair -- into the air when a small child appeared unexpectedly in front of me and it was impossible to go around. I was not wearing a helmet. I landed on my bike, on my elbow, picked myself up and rode to work (only then discovering the extent of the injury).

I don't really mind what choice people make regarding what to wear or not to wear on their heads, but if you are going to present them with a method of coming to a decision, at least make it a realistic one. I don't recall any occasion in which my hands have been superglued to the bars and my body has generally been pretty good at instinctively breaking my fall. We didn't evolve wearing helmets, after all.

Sam

Actually, you are right about the launching over the bars thing so I take that back. On the occasions that I have gone over the bars, I have had time to react and as you point out, it is instinctive. It's why so many cyclists end up with broken collar bones - because the arms and shoulders are sacrificed in the protection of the head.

Okay: Your front wheel has suddenly slid out from under you. I have frozen time....

I have had 3 accidents where my front wheel went from under me and I never even managed to get my hands off the bars let alone defend my head. The bars actually pinched my hand against the road on one of those crashes - my hand was still holding on tight when I hit the deck. My MTB pal mentioned above didn't get her hands off the bars either.