Motorsports Thread

[Reynard]

If it was a couple of races ago, I assume they will be talking about the damper placed towards the front of the floor


View: https://www.reddit.com/r/F1Technical/comments/tah0sv/does_haas_have_a_sprung_floortea_tray_what_could/

Well, my mental picture isn't so far off, Although I'm thinking the whole floor, not just the front of the cat. That damper there changes the frequency of the oscillations, moving them well away from resonance. Which is, quite possibly, what the problem is for some teams.

Maybe it is linked to the chassis flex further down?

You *really* don't want a chassis that flexes. Particularly in torsion. The handling would be all over the place, as every time the driver accelerates or decelerates the engine applies a torque to the structure. That's because the engine-gearbox assembly is a stressed member, and takes all the rear suspension pick-ups.

The Brabham BT55 was very prone to this, partly as a result of its low-line design. It went like sh*t off a shovel in a straight line, but point it at a corner and it was all over the place.

This is completely different to a family car, where the engine sits on rubber mounts precisely to avoid this issue - and increase passenger comfort.

 

[Jody]

He was saying it ran the entire length of the car, for those that were using it. A sprung floor, seperate from the main floor.

I'd love to know how that works.

Suppose it will all come clear in the next few weeks.

 

[Jody]

Well, my mental picture isn't so far off, Although I'm thinking the whole floor, not just the front of the cat. That damper there changes the frequency of the oscillations, moving them well away from resonance. Which is, quite possibly, what the problem is for some teams.


You *really* don't want a chassis that flexes. Particularly in torsion. The handling would be all over the place, as every time the driver accelerates or decelerates the engine applies a torque to the structure. That's because the engine-gearbox assembly is a stressed member, and takes all the rear suspension pick-ups.

The Brabham BT55 was very prone to this, partly as a result of its low-line design. It went like sh*t off a shovel in a straight line, but point it at a corner and it was all over the place.

This is completely different to a family car, where the engine sits on rubber mounts precisely to avoid this issue - and increase passenger comfort.

I get torsional stiffness is needed but I'm confused over the wording of what they are doing.

Some teams have up to 6mm deflection in the floor when only 2 is allowed. But it's further back down the chassis. CH's statement on it reads like there is a decent amount of performance gained or to be lost in this design.

So we'll see how much it reduces the lap time for affected teams.

 

[Reynard]

I get torsional stiffness is needed but I'm confused over the wording of what they are doing.

Some teams have up to 6mm deflection in the floor when only 2 is allowed. But it's further back down the chassis. CH's statement on it reads like there is a decent amount of performance gained or to be lost in this design.

So we'll see how much it reduces the lap time for affected teams.

They're basically changing the shape of the venturi under the car to accelerate the airflow more and thus increase the downforce*. The springs also serve to damp out the resonant frequencies that causes the unwanted vertical up-and-down movement.

As I said, Lotus 88 territory.

* this generation of car is much more reliant on downforce compared to mechanical grip

 

[Illaveago]

They're basically changing the shape of the venturi under the car to accelerate the airflow more and thus increase the downforce*. The springs also serve to damp out the resonant frequencies that causes the unwanted vertical up-and-down movement.

As I said, Lotus 88 territory.

* this generation of car is much more reliant on downforce compared to mechanical grip

Is it a bit like one of those Octopus mattress things ?

 

[Deleted member 26715]

Hamilton is speaking out about the cheering of the Max fans when he crashed on Friday, although I agree, it would have more credence had he spoken out about the booing at Silverstone.

 

[cosmicbike]

Hamilton is speaking out about the cheering of the Max fans when he crashed on Friday, although I agree, it would have more credence had he spoken out about the booing at Silverstone.

Indeed, last year too....

 

[Reynard]

Hmmm... Motor racing has always been quite partisan...

I remember the scenes at Monza in 1988 when Senna tripped over Jean-Louis Schlesser* in the Williams resulting in a Ferrari 1-2. Berger won from Alboreto, with Eddie Cheever and Derek Warwick 3rd and 4th respectively in the Arrows. It was the only race McLaren didn't win that season, so you can well imagine...

* Schlesser was subbing for Mansell, who had somehow managed to catch chickenpox.

 

[gbb]

Never had any love (or hate tbf) for Ferrari cars....but isnt their F1 car a beauty this year. It just occured to me watching the GP

 

[Deleted member 26715]

Never had any love (or hate tbf) for Ferrari cars....but isnt their F1 car a beauty this year. It just occured to me watching the GP

It certainly made a nice BBQ today

 

[Jody]

It certainly made a nice BBQ today

Shouldn't laugh though. Carlos was in a predicament with the flames getting bigger and the car rolling back. Good job he got out.

 

[Deleted member 26715]

Shouldn't laugh though. Carlos was in a predicament with the flames getting bigger and the car rolling back. Good job he got out.

Yes I could see him baling & the car still on fire rolling back down the hill & onto the track.

 

[cosmicbike]

Never had any love (or hate tbf) for Ferrari cars....but isnt their F1 car a beauty this year. It just occured to me watching the GP

Certainly one of the better looking interpretations of the revised rules. Was a decent race today, nice to see the top 10 mixed up a bit too.

 

[Reynard]

It certainly made a nice BBQ today

i was waiting for someone to come out with the giant marshmallows...

 

[Deleted member 26715]

So I've been sat here musing it's a bit warm for that work mullarkey

Sainz leaves the track at turn 1, gets a far better exit as he's cranked less steering on & uses it to catapult past Russell, had that been kitty litter he wouldn't have been able to do it. Now I'm 100% sure even if he'd have pulled in behind Russell then it would have only been a matter of time before he went past, but should it have been a penalty, or as I think it was dealt with as a first lap incident. We saw Alonso actively practising this at 1 GP.

Perez gets punted into the kitty litter after he goes around the outside of turn 4 when Russell with full lock on slides into his rear wheel. Result Russell gets a 5 second penalty, did he deserve it or should that too been dealt with under a first lap incident, Perez certainly had the place should Russell have given up earlier & slowed therefore being able to put the extra lock on.

Albon pushes Norris off the track at turn 3, similar in some sense to the Perez/Russell he's claiming that Norris was alongside, braked slightly later which washed his front end grip out & he just couldn't turn.

Sainz (again) the car was on fire, he was trying to get out but couldn't leave the car in gear presumably as he'd coasted as close to the marshals as possible & couldn't engage a gear, I suspect no physical link between lever & box. The marshal tried to put a block under the wheel but it was still sliding/rolling. it might be specific to that marshal post, but I feel they were lacking in A. Marshalls only appeared initially to be 1 B. If it is such a slope then maybe they need better arresters.

Finally track limits, now I do like the idea that the track is between the white lines & that at least 1 wheel (I would prefer 2) wheels have to be kept on the track at all times. Errors will be made & they will go out there when they get it wrong, but stamping down on them is good, but 2 things spring to mind, it got all a bit confusing, who had been noted (on their 3 strikes), who had been black & whit'd & who was carrying a penalty. Along with if they are doing it in Austria it has to be continued to all events.