Inexperienced e-Bike Riders [Local Problem?]

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mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
I'm quite happy to pay more for food to be delivered on the occasions I order it, if it's going into the riders pocket. In fact, if I know it's being delivered legally on a bicycle, I'm definitely happy to pay more. What about the other customers? Can't say too much more otherwise the thread will belong somewhere else.
Please stop with the scaremongering about getting this thread locked. We've been told repeatedly that the politics of cycling, which this definitely is, is allowed in the Advocacy board. While we're about it, do we know if any of the parties in next month's general election plan to do much about the delivery services? I expect there might be some words about zero-hours and "gig working" reforms, but I doubt the safety of the bikes and riders will be addressed.

Do any of the services offer a way to pay more for a legal delivery?

Most of the services don't bother with my little hamlet and I think the one that I know does, uses cars to deliver here from a petrol station shop or the two/three takeaways in the next village.
 

Slick

Guru
https://road.cc/content/news/calls-delivery-cyclists-wear-numbered-jackets-308775

Residents in Glasgow calling for e-bike delivery cyclists to have numbered jackets because of concerns about those riding illegal e-bikes

To be fair, this probably generates more questions than answers for me.

First one being, was it really residents, or are they really something else, but when you click on their first campaign, active travel is high on their agenda.
https://mctcc.scot/campaigns/mcphaen/
So it seems its a genuine concern, although they could maybe spend a weekend in parts of London to get a look at some real issues with ebikes.

Police launch a crackdown. Did they really? I don't think anyone noticed.

The only example of any issues they can cite is that of an ebiker cycling the wrong way on a cycle path and colliding with a cyclist, so I'm back at not really a huge issue but maybe more of an annoyance.

Meanwhile, a Just Eat spokesperson has said that the safety of couriers, road users and the public is a “key priority” for the company and all couriers delivering on their behalf “must ensure they follow all local laws and rules of the road”.

They said: “If we are ever made aware that a courier delivering on our behalf has acted in a way that does not uphold the standards we hope to deliver, we do not hesitate in taking action, which could include revoking the courier from our network.”

A spokesperson for Deliveroo added: “Road safety is of the utmost priority for Deliveroo. During the onboarding process, every rider completes a programme of road safety guidance and is required to meet minimum safety standards.


So much to question this, but the HSAWA requires instruction, information and SUPERVISION and employment status is irrelevant. Everyone knows what Just Eat are doing is the minimum required to reduce the risks to the business without taking any responsibility for how their riders act on the road. That will change eventually, but it will take a challenge in court and maybe even a death before they do. So the companies really do need to do more, but revoking riders from their network should always be a last resort.

And in February this year, an SNP councillor from Glasgow urged delivery riders to learn and obey the Highway Code, after his peers brought up a proposal of licence plates of insurance for cyclists due to concerns about traffic offences committed by cyclists.

However, the council confirmed that it will not support such measures, citing a “significant detrimental impact” on active travel. Councillor Millar said: “A licencing system or insurance requirement for delivery riders would likely require legislative change, likely at UK Government level.


Thankfully, there's a strong possibility of a change in power in Scotland and we will here less of this kind of nonsense.
 

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
Thankfully, there's a strong possibility of a change in power in Scotland and we will here less of this kind of nonsense.
Why? Are the SNP known to be cycling-hostile? Pretty much every party other than the greens is more authoritarian than them, so I'm not sure why a change from SNP would reduce the calls for compulsory insurance and registration.
 
You do have to feel for the 'riders'. They aren't doing this because they love it. They are just trying to earn a crust. Many won't be able to get other jobs, and they can't be making much money, so trying to do a full day, every day, pedalling about, of course they will want to make it easier, and if a cheap 'illegal' kit can help them, then they will. I recon 95% of the bikes I see are retrofitted cheap BSO's for a reason - folk can't afford 'legal ones'.

Unless folk get off their bottoms and go out to collect food, then there is a market for delivery riders.

For example, the Maccy's a mile from me, has mainly car driving delivery folk - probably due to the delivery area and hills. The Maccy's/KFC that's on my commute, about 4 miles from my home is predominantly 'bikes' - much tighter delivery area/flat/higher concentration of homes/different demographic.

Apprently there is a large grey job market for those unable to work legally in the UK to work as a delivery rider. A person legally able to work in the UK will sub contract their account they have being vetted for (as required by Home Office) to any number of illegal workers. Theres a recent article here with more info: Revealed: The Deliveroo, Uber Eats and Just Eat ‘backdoor’ to UK illegal migration , and many of those workers will be on illegal ebikes and emotorbikes.
 

Slick

Guru
Why? Are the SNP known to be cycling-hostile? Pretty much every party other than the greens is more authoritarian than them, so I'm not sure why a change from SNP would reduce the calls for compulsory insurance and registration.

Not particularly as far as I know, but it is one of their councillors stirring the pot regarding insurance and number plates, and there's also the obvious falling out with the greens that led to the change at the top for them in the first place, which definitely weakened the active travel debate up here.

Not sure about the bold bit, never really seen the LibDems as Authoritarian.

I think we are where we are after a number of years with the status quo, and I reckon it will take a change to see any real improvements here anyway but probably south as well. Maybe there was a bit of wishful thinking on my part
 

classic33

Leg End Member
Not particularly as far as I know, but it is one of their councillors stirring the pot regarding insurance and number plates, and there's also the obvious falling out with the greens that led to the change at the top for them in the first place, which definitely weakened the active travel debate up here.

Not sure about the bold bit, never really seen the LibDems as Authoritarian.

I think we are where we are after a number of years with the status quo, and I reckon it will take a change to see any real improvements here anyway but probably south as well. Maybe there was a bit of wishful thinking on my part
Despite the word council in their title, and calling their board community councillors, they are nothing more than a residents and tenants group.
Unelected, except by those in their group, and self serving. They have no legal authority.
 

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
Despite the word council in their title, and calling their board community councillors, they are nothing more than a residents and tenants group.
Unelected, except by those in their group, and self serving. They have no legal authority.
Are you sure? In England and Wales, community councils are equivalent to parish and town councils. I thought Scotland was similar but I've obviously no experience of this law there.
 

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
https://mctcc.scot/community-council/

Residents forum and pressure group.

They do have a lot of good things to say mind.
Yet https://mctcc.scot/constitution/ says there are elections and partial safeguards for a majority of members to be elected. Are you sure "residents forum and pressure group" isn't just someone writing their website describing what they think a parish council is?
 
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classic33

Leg End Member
Yethttps://mctcc.scot/constitution/ says there are elections and partial safeguards for a majority of members to be elected. Are you sure "residents forum and pressure group" isn't just someone writing their website describing what they think a parish council is?
Tenants and Resident Associations in England have to have a similar constitution, written up, and the wording agreed by all members, not a majority.

What an unelected local local forum has to do when deciding what needs to be done in their area is getting tedious.
They can only make requests to the local bodies.
 

Mr Celine

Discordian
Our Role

We are a residents’ forum and pressure group for the Merchant City & Trongate area of Glasgow


Pretty sure.

Isn't that what all community councils are supposed to be?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_council

I don't see why a pressure group would call itself a community council if it wasn't one.

Dunno what it's like in Glasgow but round here the actual cooncil ignores the community councils' opinions on any planning applications, which they have a right to be consulted on.
 

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
Dunno what it's like in Glasgow but round here the actual cooncil ignores the community councils' opinions on any planning applications, which they have a right to be consulted on.
I forget where you are, but in England, they're meant to tell community/parish/town councils why they disagree with their comments.
 
Apprently there is a large grey job market for those unable to work legally in the UK to work as a delivery rider. A person legally able to work in the UK will sub contract their account they have being vetted for (as required by Home Office) to any number of illegal workers. Theres a recent article here with more info: Revealed: The Deliveroo, Uber Eats and Just Eat ‘backdoor’ to UK illegal migration , and many of those workers will be on illegal ebikes and emotorbikes.

This is a good point. I now find myself caught between two sides on this:
- on the one hand, a huge proportion of the vehicles I see are clearly illegal*, and delivery drivers/riders in general are some of the least safe/cautious road-users that I meet. [*e.g. no pedalling required uphill, no lights ... ]
- in my town you don't have to look hard to notice the demographic delivering food - it is massivey different to the residents of the town. I don't think it's a big leap to assume these are people who have no other job prospects. I don't want to be the one taking food off THEIR table :-/

So legally it's all dodgy AF ... but are they a net evil? Not sure ...
 

Slick

Guru
Isn't that what all community councils are supposed to be?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_council

I don't see why a pressure group would call itself a community council if it wasn't one.

Dunno what it's like in Glasgow but round here the actual cooncil ignores the community councils' opinions on any planning applications, which they have a right to be consulted on.

Check out their own website, they do claim that the cooncil are required to consult them on a number of matters.
 
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