Hills

[jimboalee]

On a long climb, I will be seated for a while, and then stand up for a while.
After a few of these, I become reluctant to sit down due to the rythym and subsequent speed loss.

In either case, my abdominals, obliques, lats and delts are tensed up to provide stability for my glutes and leg flexors; as Bill says.

Incidentally, I have found standing up and performing a 'stair climbing' exercise more natural than sitting on a saddle doing a 'cycling' exercise.

 

[Bill Gates]

On a long climb, I will be seated for a while, and then stand up for a while.
After a few of these, I become reluctant to sit down due to the rythym and subsequent speed loss.

In either case, my abdominals, obliques, lats and delts are tensed up to provide stability for my glutes and leg flexors; as Bill says.

Incidentally, I have found standing up and performing a 'stair climbing' exercise more natural than sitting on a saddle doing a 'cycling' exercise.

One of the reasons for me to develop strength in my upper body including shoulders and arms is to provide the muscle endurance to withstand out of the saddle, and seated efforts on climbs. Although the demands on the CV system are indeed great IMO it is not the only limiter as some coaches would have you believe.

On the other hand if you are an exponent of training with power then it is likely that you believe it's the only thing worth worrying about and there is no need to bother with anything else. Just riding your bike will do it for you. Well as I say each to their own.

Out of the saddle efforts involve different techniques as well. Sometimes I will swing the bike in the vertical plane and pull on the handlebars as I push down with the legs to accelerate or maintain high power. If getting out of the saddle but maintaining a steady pace then the bike remains fairly upright all the time.

 

[SimonC]

Most other riders recommend and use a relaxed upper body method for climbing and it obviously works for them. For me I suppose it depends on the context of the climb. When I'm riding my bike unless it's a recovery ride (and then I'm avoiding any climbs) I'm out to use climbs as a means of raising the power output and HR to push my LT and VO2max limits.

Apart from sitting more upright the position, technique and effort is similar to that I would use in a TT. It's not something that I'm that conscious of at the time but thinking about it, when in the seated postion, my upper body is quite tense as it is providing a solid foundation for my legs to push against. If it is a very long climb or it's part of a very long ride then my power output would be reduced and then the upper body might be more relaxed.

+1, generally always ride hard on climbs, whether short or long, and find that upper body is tense, arms are tense.

Sometimes out of saddle (especially powering up short climbs), sometimes sat down. Not sure of my cadence, probably 70-ish. I've found that if my upper body is relaxed I'm not riding hard enough, and if my cadence is too high, what you might call spinning, again feels like I'm not riding hard enough or fast enough.

What I do think is that it is very different for new riders, to those of us who have been riding and racing for a long time (20 yrs here), and that advice about hammering up short climbs, pacing on long climbs to save a bit for a blast at the top etc is pretty meaningless when the power and endurance isnt there and you are more concerned about not having to stop and push.

 

[lukesdad]

I tend to agree with Simon C and Bill . If your attacking a climb your technique will be different to somebody who is just trying to survive it.In the case of the OP probably the latter so relaxing and spinning up would probably be the best gameplan, but to be a really good climber there are no shortcuts mentally or physically a lot of pain will be involved.

 

[westofsouth]

My cycling career is measured in months rather than years, so you may find my naive comments faintly amusing.
A few people have said one should try to relax, I take it a stage further and try to meditate, silently repeating the mantra "I love hills" as I climb (...yes really).
I have a heavy hub-geared bike with high North Road 'bars and plain pedals; people advise me that as a minimum I should have drop bars and clip-on pedals.
On a 55 mile club ride yesterday the longest climb was some 800ft with a few hairpin bends included. I started at the back and was the first to arrive at the top, some riders (apparently with all the right equipment) were 10min behind.
Not sure what point I am trying to make, as we all have different fitness levels. As with most sporting activities, psychology is important.... just try to eliminate any negative thoughts about your capabilities...... things will be easier.

 

[Fab Foodie]

What I do think is that it is very different for new riders, to those of us who have been riding and racing for a long time (20 yrs here), and that advice about hammering up short climbs, pacing on long climbs to save a bit for a blast at the top etc is pretty meaningless when the power and endurance isnt there and you are more concerned about not having to stop and push.

Thank you.
The needs of the newbie are different to those of the experienced.
having said that, watch good climbers do big hills, I don't see a lot of use of the upper body or straining against the bars. If there is, it's short bursts only.

 

[jimboalee]

If you do watch the good climbers ride the 'big hills', you will get captions on the screen saying "Gradient 7.5%" and "Gradient 8%".

Yes, it is possible to merrily spin up these inclines with the upper body floppily resting on bent arms gently holding the bars with a light caress.

When they come to a hairpin where the gradient goes to 10, 12 and 14% sharpish, they will stand up and heave-ho, grasping the bars and pedaling from the shoulders.


When tourists and leisure riders come to 10, 12 and 14% inclines, they slap the chain down onto the very small ring and rythmicly legpress there way to the top.
I would dearly love to see a tourist climb a long 10% hill on a 27" gear spinning it at over 80 rpm....
Not unless their legs can put out 300 Watts for half hour stints, SITTING DOWN...

 

[Fab Foodie]

Jimbo, for the most part people are not riding 25% hills every day, a few might (and why not for fun), but even so with modern bikes and low gearing you don't for the most part need to rip the handlebars off the bike to get up them.

 

[Bill Gates]

I couldn't even get a relaxed upper body when winding down yesterday on the turbo.

 

[jimboalee]

Jimbo, for the most part people are not riding 25% hills every day, a few might (and why not for fun), but even so with modern bikes and low gearing you don't for the most part need to rip the handlebars off the bike to get up them.

Who mentioned 25% hills?

Something else I'd like to see.

Take a 20lb sports bike, a car park ramp ( 25% ), a 36T ring and a 25T sprocket.

Put the bike on it's lowest gear and ride toward the ramp at 80 cadence. ( 8.7 mph ).
Ride up the 25% ramp and see how much speed and cadence you lose,,

If you think this is crackers, there was a carpark in East Brum with a six storey spiral 25% upramp. We trained on it riding 22.5lb bikes with 39 x 23 gearing.

Maybe that's the reason I can mash up most hills.....

Anyone who has some hills to climb should try it now and again....

 

[SimonC]

Thank you.
The needs of the newbie are different to those of the experienced.
having said that, watch good climbers do big hills, I don't see a lot of use of the upper body or straining against the bars. If there is, it's short bursts only.

'Cos they are skinny streaks of p1ss who dont have any upper body strength

 

[automatic_jon]

'Cos they are skinny streaks of p1ss who dont have any upper body strength

I'll have you know that as a newbie who is also a skinny streak of p1ss with no upper body strength I've been following some of the advice here and not only managed to conquer the hill that looms over the town but I managed all the way to work with out stopping for breath on a hill even once. I even passed someone on one climb, which buoyed by spirits for the rest of the journey.

I've definitely found that seated works best for me and although I'd like to stand up to put more power down I just don't have the legs to get up off of my saddle after a little bit of climbing.

 

[Fab Foodie]

I'll have you know that as a newbie who is also a skinny streak of p1ss with no upper body strength I've been following some of the advice here and not only managed to conquer the hill that looms over the town but I managed all the way to work with out stopping for breath on a hill even once. I even passed someone on one climb, which buoyed by spirits for the rest of the journey.

I've definitely found that seated works best for me and although I'd like to stand up to put more power down I just don't have the legs to get up off of my saddle after a little bit of climbing.

Yay! Climbing God under tuition...

 

[jimboalee]

"If you want even the nerds to consider you a nerd, try getting enthusiastic about bicycle gearing. There is probably no topic with poorer esteem or poorer coverage in any book on cycling. There are three reasons for this low estate: 1) newbies don't understand it, 2) strong cyclists don't need it, and 3) most people dislike math. If these things are true, why do I want to approach the task? -- simply because cadence and gearing are important for the newbie, the tourer, and the person with weak muscles. "

Ken Kifer.

 

[lukesdad]

Welcome to the " Darkside " Automatic Jon. Glad to hear your climbing is going well.

There are as many ways to climb as there are riders. What height and weight are you,and what cadence are you climbing at, at the moment ?