Goodbye indexed gears?

[sebinho]

The hanger can be bent back into place using the right tools. That looks to me like it's also twisted a bit so that'll be the problem with the gears.

I'm still in doubt though

If this piece is the hanger, it seems to sit flush on one side with the tab on the frame and flush on the other with the body of the derailleur (the mech?). So I can't see how it could be bent. But I'm probably misunderstanding something.

 

[si_c]

I'm still in doubt though

If this piece is the hanger, it seems to sit flush on one side with the tab on the frame and flush on the other with the body of the derailleur (the mech?). So I can't see how it could be bent. But I'm probably misunderstanding something.

It's a soft aluminium bracket, if you look at your first photo you posted, you'll see the QR for the wheel and immediately to the right of that a small silver bolt which connects the hangar to the frame. The derailleur then screws into this bracket, it's whole purpose is to absorb energy in the event that the bike is hit by something or falls over, it will then bend slight stopping any damage to your bike frame or the derailleur. In extreme circumstances it will snap entirely and need replacing.

If this becomes twisted or bent slightly then the angle the derailleur sits at will no longer be flush with the bike frame so the chain will twist and leave it at an angle causing the poor shifting you are experiencing. It doesn't have to be bent or twisted much to have an noticeable impact on the shifting.

 

[DCLane]

Well that's brilliant. I've not been able to find the hanger itself for sale but have see a few complete used rear-derailleurs on Ebay and one overpriced one locally. If anyone has any tips on finding the part, please let me know. Thanks everyone for your help!

For the derailleur hanger you need a bike shop that has a hanger alignment tool. That will allow them to bend the hanger back into place. If not, you remove the one/two screws and match it with one.

In terms of a derailleur any Shimano 9 speed will be fine; so a Sora 3500 / Tiagra 4500 / 105 5500 will all work as well as the Ultegra 6500. Are you in Brazil? If so then the Sora should be widely available new and much cheaper.

 

[sebinho]

In terms of a derailleur any Shimano 9 speed will be fine; so a Sora 3500 / Tiagra 4500 / 105 5500 will all work as well as the Ultegra 6500. Are you in Brazil? If so then the Sora should be widely available new and much cheaper.

Yes and yes, they are cheap. There's this one. Are they any good?
https://produto.mercadolivre.com.br...cking_id=ff170493-4ca4-4318-82d1-bc52f4fcdb28

 

[DCLane]

@sebinho - yes. It's 9 speed so will work.

 

[sebinho]

It's a soft aluminium bracket, if you look at your first photo you posted, you'll see the QR for the wheel and immediately to the right of that a small silver bolt which connects the hangar to the frame. The derailleur then screws into this bracket, it's whole purpose is to absorb energy in the event that the bike is hit by something or falls over, it will then bend slight stopping any damage to your bike frame or the derailleur. In extreme circumstances it will snap entirely and need replacing.

Bear with me if you will @si_c: So the hanger is actually part of the frame (or comes with it) and not part the derailleur, am I correct? And if I were to exchange the derailleur, would I'd be left with the same problem? It's the soft plate of aluminium attached to frame with bolts that needs to be aligned properly.

 

[sebinho]

additionally, if what I said above is correct, are there hanger spares available to suit the Principia frame? ie. does it use any particular standard?

 

[Milkfloat]

Well that's brilliant. I've not been able to find the hanger itself for sale but have see a few complete used rear-derailleurs on Ebay and one overpriced one locally. If anyone has any tips on finding the part, please let me know. Thanks everyone for your help!

edit:

This one looks nice and the freight is affordable but things can take months to arrive and may get heavily taxed:
https://www.ebay.com/p/1100634705

This one looks much rougher but is local:
https://produto.mercadolivre.com.br...cking_id=fa2ba792-5c4f-4cd3-bcf5-ec56eb110f6c

More photos with together with front derailleur here:
https://produto.mercadolivre.com.br...cking_id=a552c9c1-64a6-4c44-9208-5351044a0faa

I can try and get the price down on the local one and the platform gives free returns.

At the moment we don’t think you need a new derailleur, but we do know the hanger is bent. The hanger does not come with the derailleur it is a sacrificial part of the frame that you but separately. Yours should look like one of these https://www.elanusparts.com/principia-derailleur-hangers. In an ideally world, when your hanger is bent badly you just buy a new one and fit it, rarely you need to get even a new hanger aligned. In your case getting hold of a new hanger may be tricky, you need to identify which one you have and then find someone who can get it to Brazil for you. Therefore, people are quite rightly suggesting you try and straighten your existing hanger. This may work or it may snap, but it is worth a try. There is a special tool that the bike shop should have. It is very strange that they did not look at this and try to straighten it first. Are they a proper bike shop or is it the local guy who can fix cars and washing machines with a hammer?

 

[sebinho]

At the moment we don’t think you need a new derailleur, but we do know the hanger is bent. The hanger does not come with the derailleur it is a sacrificial part of the frame that you but separately. Yours should look like one of these https://www.elanusparts.com/principia-derailleur-hangers. In an ideally world, when your hanger is bent badly you just buy a new one and fit it, rarely you need to get even a new hanger aligned. In your case getting hold of a new hanger may be tricky, you need to identify which one you have and then find someone who can get it to Brazil for you. Therefore, people are quite rightly suggesting you try and straighten your existing hanger. This may work or it may snap, but it is worth a try. There is a special tool that the bike shop should have. It is very strange that they did not look at this and try to straighten it first. Are they a proper bike shop or is it the local guy who can fix cars and washing machines with a hammer?

Thanks a lot for the explanation and link. I would think it's a good shop, it's the Brazilian branch and distributor of the Italian brand Lazzaretti. They've got some nice looking bikes there.

 

[sebinho]

Took the wheel off, can see a little better:

 

[Arrowfoot]

The hanger looks flush and flat. It maybe the pulley arm twisted or bent. Surprised that the mechanic did not pick it up.

I travel with my bike on flights and have got this. Have straighten it with pliers.

 

[si_c]

The hanger looks flush and flat. It maybe the pulley arm twisted or bent. Surprised that the mechanic did not pick it up.

It's flush with the frame yes, but it looks like the bit that "hangs" below the frame is bent and slightly twisted, you can see this in some of the earlier photos.

Edit: To the OP, you can just pop into any bike shop and ask them to align the hanger, it doesn't take long, maybe 5 minutes so they can do it while you wait. You can get a tool and do it yourself, which for me worked out to be the most cost effective thing in the long term, but it costs about $50 US for a basic tool online in the UK, you'd have to look online for Brazil, plenty of guides online about how to use them.

 

[Ajax Bay]

I've not been able to find the hanger itself for sale but have see a few complete used rear-derailleurs on Ebay and one overpriced one locally.

Your post suggests that you don't understand the excellent advice that others have offered. Your RD is entirely functional, if a bit scratched - the incident which caused that is very likely the reason the hanger is skewiff.
Have you removed the RD yet (requires a simple allen key - easy to put back on as well: so go for it)?
Once removed, can you see the hanger which (as @DCLane has said) will be secured by one or two small screws?
Put the bike on a stand and make sure it is vertical (spirit level) and then look at the hanger. It should be vertical in one plane and parallel to the bike's frame axis in the horizontal plane (I can see yours isn't in the latter).
As for 'bending (the hanger) back', it is aluminium and it's been bent once: bend it back and it'll be weaker and the chance of it breaking is increased. Stop gap do it (heed @fossyant 's advice above, and ride your bike), but immediately procure a replacement hanger (hundreds of different ones and it must be the correct one). Someone will have the 'hangersareus' website address (or search on here for 'hanger'). When it arrives swap the twice (or more) bent one out (and chuck).
HTH (Edit: cross posted with updates above - happy OP got there in the end).

 

[sebinho]

Your post suggests that you don't understand the excellent advice that others have offered.

I think that was the case but it became very clear towards the latter part of the thread. Looking at the link that @Milkfloat kindly sent, it looks like it's the D124 model and I've written to the company and sent a photo for confirmation. So I'm starting on the premise that it's hanger. Thanks to everyone for the brilliant advice, I feel well equipped now to talk with the mechanics. All the best!

 

[DCLane]

Looking at the derailleur hanger it appears to be a Pilo D124. That's 3 bolts, but only 2 are needed:

@sebinho - you beat me to it. Get one of these and it should solve most of your issues.