Driving Test

[slow horse]

I taught my wife how to drive.

Top tip: never attempt to teach your spouse how to drive, unless you have an extremely robust marriage.

 

[icowden]

The 'making progress' thing is something I do not agree with, if fast driving is encouraged, then is it safe?
I can understand the reasons, but surely better to drive appropriately for conditions, rather to emphasis making progress.

It's been around for a long time though. My grandma failed her first driving test for "being too cautious" when passing horse-drawn vehicles. She nearly failed her second for "not being cautious enough" when passing horse-drawn vehicles...

These may both have been the voluntary test pre second world war, or else the compulsory test just after. She drove trucks around Liverpool during the second world war, so she was definitely driving at that point.

 

[grldtnr]

I assume that was a typo, and meant to say "disagree" rather than "diagress"

But what do you disagree with - nothing else in your post contradicted anything I said.

More of a comment bon driving rather disagreeing with your comments, seems to me drivers focus on 'passing ' the test rather learning to drive, you never stop learning,
That was my gist

 

[lazybloke]

I had a lot of trouble finding an instructor for my son.
I wanted someone who was experienced at teaching neurodiverse pupils.
But despite going by personal recommendation, and having very positive calls with instructors, they all later ghosted me; refusing to respond to any further calls or emails.
The thought occurs I could make allegations of direct discrimination to the DVSA...

After having the same problem with nearly 10 instructors I opted to do the teaching myself.

I gave a family friend a driving lesson earlier today and I’m still reeling from the experience. She’s had twenty lessons apparently. I don’t know what they’ve been teaching her because she has zero road positional sense, can’t use mirrors, and often loses concentration. Resulting in several near misses.

Yeah, i had some hair-raising experiences when teaching, and thought I'd embarked on a fool's errand.. but my son suddenly "got it", and he was suddenly a competent and confident driver, happy to drive day or night, in fair or foul weather, on quiet rural lanes or in the middle of London.

But the weird thing is he's still on L plates; he's shown absolutely no sign of wanting to qualify and hasn't been booked a theory test yet. He's nearly 19, so he's a lot more experienced than most newly qualified drivers.
I gather this might result in lower insurance premiums when he does eventually qualify.

 

[grldtnr]

What do you mean by Neuro diverse? Not wishing to be non inclusive, but some conditions ought to preclude some drivers wanting to get a full licence .
If it seems from your post that you consider him proficient to drive in a very testing environment in central London, yet he chooses not to take a driving test.
Perhaps, giving his perceived challenges it's best not to, whilst he feels confident if you are sat with him, maybe he wouldn't feel like that with a stranger conducting a test.
As a Examiner conducting tests, they have to be sure, given any difficulties the candidate has, are competent to drive for other road users as well.
I am unaware of the testing regime regards people who have physical or learning difficulties, but physically disabled must have a harder time taking the driving test over ones that have no difficulties.
Certain illnesses have to be notified to DVLC, Diabetes is one, ,but being diabetic should not stop you from driving, I am a type 2 diabetic, but it doesn't preclude me from driving or cycling , unless I am insulin dependent ,which I am not, Type 1 diabetics do have to control their Blood sugars, whilst they can drive cars, would be precluded from HGV or PSA driving licences.

 

[Electric_Andy]

I am unaware of the testing regime regards people who have physical or learning difficulties

Neurodiverse does not mean learning difficulties. It generally means autism spectrum disorder but also covers things like ADHD, Tourettes and OCD. Many ND people are actually better drivers because they can be risk averse and/or insist on doing things by the book and in an orderly way. Some may be the opposite, or somewhere inbetween. Basically, a person is deemed fit to drive if they can demonstrate that they are fit to drive. Or unless a health professional specifically says that they must not drive (a bit like they did to my Gran when she was going blind). Sometimes practice (with a stranger in the car) can make things more tolerable for ND person. Sometimes it will not be an issue at all. My son has ASD and did increcdibly badly on his CBT, even went round a roundabout the wrong way, but he still got his certificate and was just told to practice more. He did, and is fairly confident now if it's a familiar route

 

[grldtnr]

With the upmost respect Electric Andy,what you say about your sons condition and his struggles with doing his CBT which is only training ,and not a test , going through a roundabout the wrong way, kind of demonstrates my thoughts and of many others, if they do something wrong like that,would be considered a dangerous fault and an instant failure.
Whilst I understand what you say about his compunction to follow procedures, as is often the case with other drivers, they break rules ,which they know they shouldn't would that cause your son to panic and do something dangerous.
I get some people with. ASD can be high performing people and can cope very well with unusual circumstances, but conversely they have an adverse reaction and then do something risky.
Some might say that's what Insurance is for, to compensate loss for ' Accidents', which are things unforeseen, but I 'd say the opposite.
That's my view, I was hit and seriously injured many years ago, by a speeding driver on a bendy twisty country lane with a national speed limit of 60 mph, whilst the accident investigation said the car wasn't over the speed limit, common sense says it would be stupid to drive on such a narrow lane at that speed, just because the rules say you can speed down the lane at 60 ,didn't mean he had to.
I am not suggesting your son would do that, but presumably the person that hit me had no attention difficulties....there is that danger, Equally your Son might never ever do the same, but that is an unknown

 

[Jameshow]

What do you mean by Neuro diverse? Not wishing to be non inclusive, but some conditions ought to preclude some drivers wanting to get a full licence .
If it seems from your post that you consider him proficient to drive in a very testing environment in central London, yet he chooses not to take a driving test.
Perhaps, giving his perceived challenges it's best not to, whilst he feels confident if you are sat with him, maybe he wouldn't feel like that with a stranger conducting a test.
As a Examiner conducting tests, they have to be sure, given any difficulties the candidate has, are competent to drive for other road users as well.
I am unaware of the testing regime regards people who have physical or learning difficulties, but physically disabled must have a harder time taking the driving test over ones that have no difficulties.
Certain illnesses have to be notified to DVLC, Diabetes is one, ,but being diabetic should not stop you from driving, I am a type 2 diabetic, but it doesn't preclude me from driving or cycling , unless I am insulin dependent ,which I am not, Type 1 diabetics do have to control their Blood sugars, whilst they can drive cars, would be precluded from HGV or PSA driving licences.

I think diabetic people shouldn't drive just saying....🤔

 

[grldtnr]

I think diabetic people shouldn't drive just saying....🤔

Fair enough, your just as guilty as I am with my perception of people with neuro diversity, Type 1 diabetics over a certain age have to reapply for a driving license and get a medical assessment,Type 2 do not, if it's proven that they are not insulin dependent, equally type 1 are capable of driving, if they can control their condition.
Whilst both types are a blood sugar balance thing, they are different conditions, type 1 can suffer Hyperglycaemia,and lose consciousness, type 2 will not ,they are chalk and cheese conditions.
If a Neurodiverse person can consistently show during the driving test competency ,then allow them to drive.
It's like put a dog in a field of sheep, they will likely chase them, but if that animal is a trained sheepdog ,it perhaps responds to the Shepherd's commands ...then again it might not.
That's the parable.

 

[lazybloke]

What do you mean by Neuro diverse?

It's an umbrella term covering many conditions. The details of my son's particular conditions aren't important as they haven't stopped him learning. He's certainly had his "moments" behind the wheel but that was in the early days due to inexperience, not his conditions.

Not wishing to be non inclusive, but some conditions ought to preclude some drivers wanting to get a full licence .

Inclusivity isn't relevant; anyone should be allowed to drive if they can demonstrate an appropriate standard.
Epilepsy and stroke for exampe, mean an immediate stop to driving (although not necessarily permanently).

My son's conditions and medication don't affect his driving, and don't need to be declared to DVLA or insurer.

If it seems from your post that you consider him proficient to drive in a very testing environment in central London, yet he chooses not to take a driving test.
Perhaps, giving his perceived challenges it's best not to, whilst he feels confident if you are sat with him, maybe he wouldn't feel like that with a stranger conducting a test.

Well that could be interpreted as non-inclusive.
As I've said, he's reached a standard of confidence and competence; I'd say much higher than when I passed my test.

You presumably think it a problem that he hasn't taken his tests yet?
But he's he's not deliberately avoiding them, it's just that his conditions make him a chronic procrastinator, but also remove his desires to be independent. He doesn't have any social life, no job, the only time he leaves the house is a train journey to uni. He couldn't drive there without buying his own car, paying his own insurance and parking; and wasting a lot of time sitting in traffic when the train takes half the time.

He'd have no objection to me booking the tests for him, and then he'd get them done.
But I'm in no hurry yet; the longer he remains a learner, the better his driving will be, and the cheaper his insurance becomes.

 

[icowden]

I think diabetic people shouldn't drive just saying....🤔

I think ar$$holes shouldn't drive but there we go.

Firstly you have to define diabetics. There are two types (at least). Type 1 diabetics who have an irreversible (at the moment) health condition which means that they are insulin dependent, and Type 2 who have a reversible health condition which can be managed through improved diet and exercise.

There is no reason that Type 1 diabetics cannot drive. As with any health condition, the DVLA have to be notified, but unless the person in question is having regular hypos they are not putting anyone at risk. There is a tiny percentage of Type1 diabetics who have hypos with no symptoms, and they are probably best not driving. For the vast majority, they know they are going low because they feel it in advance - they therefore have plenty of time to pull over and/or knock back some jelly babies.

Type 2 diabetics are far more high risk as they tend to have co-morbidities and be much older. However, as long as someone is managing their diabetes and responding to symptoms, again they are safe to drive.

 

[grldtnr]

It's an umbrella term covering many conditions. The details of my son's particular conditions aren't important as they haven't stopped him learning. He's certainly had his "moments" behind the wheel but that was in the early days due to inexperience, not his conditions.

Inclusivity isn't relevant; anyone should be allowed to drive if they can demonstrate an appropriate standard.
Epilepsy and stroke for exampe, mean an immediate stop to driving (although not necessarily permanently).

My son's conditions and medication don't affect his driving, and don't need to be declared to DVLA or insurer.


Well that could be interpreted as non-inclusive.
As I've said, he's reached a standard of confidence and competence; I'd say much higher than when I passed my test.

You presumably think it a problem that he hasn't taken his tests yet?
But he's he's not deliberately avoiding them, it's just that his conditions make him a chronic procrastinator, but also remove his desires to be independent. He doesn't have any social life, no job, the only time he leaves the house is a train journey to uni. He couldn't drive there without buying his own car, paying his own insurance and parking; and wasting a lot of time sitting in traffic when the train takes half the time.

He'd have no objection to me booking the tests for him, and then he'd get them done.
But I'm in no hurry yet; the longer he remains a learner, the better his driving will be, and the cheaper his insurance becomes.

I am sorry ,I was ignorant of the circumstances, so readily admit there is some prejudice in my thoughts, .....but if he can show competency then why not.
It's your son's decision ultimately, seems he can do these things.

Part of this is society's fault. Before everyone seemed to find a label, perhaps I. The past. People just didn't bother !

 

[icowden]

But he's he's not deliberately avoiding them, it's just that his conditions make him a chronic procrastinator, but also remove his desires to be independent. He doesn't have any social life, no job, the only time he leaves the house is a train journey to uni. He couldn't drive there without buying his own car, paying his own insurance and parking; and wasting a lot of time sitting in traffic when the train takes half the time.

Sounds very similar to my nephew who is autistic. He can drive well and has passed his test, but only because his mum booked it for him and took him there. He struggled a lot with GCSEs and a-levels as he is unable to pass over questions without someone guiding him. He is similarly a chronic procrastinator and has no desire to do anything other than what he does daily or what people ask him to do. He does have a job at the local garage (again his mum got him the job) but despite being very bright in many ways, has no thought or desire to get further qualifications or a better job.

 

[lazybloke]

Sounds very similar to my nephew who is autistic. He can drive well and has passed his test, but only because his mum booked it for him and took him there. He struggled a lot with GCSEs and a-levels as he is unable to pass over questions without someone guiding him. He is similarly a chronic procrastinator and has no desire to do anything other than what he does daily or what people ask him to do. He does have a job at the local garage (again his mum got him the job) but despite being very bright in many ways, has no thought or desire to get further qualifications or a better job.

That sounds v familiar. My lad's grades were slipping as his gcse years approached, but a combination of medication, private tutoring, and a host of exam access arrangements got him through.
For A levels, the school stood back a lot, letting him stand more on his own two feet, and we did the same. He managed to get through. Early days to tell how his degree will go...

 

[icowden]

For A levels, the school stood back a lot, letting him stand more on his own two feet, and we did the same. He managed to get through. Early days to tell how his degree will go...

Fingers crossed. My nephew hasn't done anything more than A-Levels, he's just working at the local service station.