Doubling Up On Road

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John the Monkey

Frivolous Cyclist
Location
Crewe
I didnt suggest that powered vehicles had or should have a priority. I merely said that some would feel that those who were directly contributing toward the cost of the road network shouldnt be excluded from its use by those not directly contributing.

Nobody is "directly contributing" though, given that the whole lot goes into the general taxation pot.

Indeed, it's likely that a cyclist could pay more into that (and thus, one could assume, more towards the upkeep of the roads) than many motorists, given the relative demographics of the two groups in the UK.
 

Bicycle

Guest
I warned you Monty! It's Moomin time...


6309288446_98b7d88a42_b.jpg

Lovely collection. It must be unique.

The Swimming Moomin one (second left, bottom row) is particularly good.

If that mug were a car, I think it would be a 1966 Abarth 500 (595 Esse Esse) with Alquatti heads.

What do you think, paper folder?

Maybe a late-model R5 Turbo2 Maxi?

There's something about it that says quirkiness and chateau-bottled quality in a small, innocuous-looking bottle.

Maybe an R8 Gordini with the racing stripes removed?

Now if the R8 gordini were a bicycle it would be a.... Oops!
 

benb

Evidence based cyclist
Location
Epsom
Nobody is "directly contributing" though, given that the whole lot goes into the general taxation pot.

Indeed, it's likely that a cyclist could pay more into that (and thus, one could assume, more towards the upkeep of the roads) than many motorists, given the relative demographics of the two groups in the UK.

Or more accurately, all tax payers directly contribute to the roads, even people who don't drive or cycle.

It's basically the flip side of someone who objects to their taxes paying for schools on the basis that they don't have children.
 

montyboy

New Member
Lovely collection. It must be unique.

The Swimming Moomin one (second left, bottom row) is particularly good.

If that mug were a car, I think it would be a 1966 Abarth 500 (595 Esse Esse) with Alquatti heads.

What do you think, paper folder?

Maybe a late-model R5 Turbo2 Maxi?

There's something about it that says quirkiness and chateau-bottled quality in a small, innocuous-looking bottle.

Maybe an R8 Gordini with the racing stripes removed?

Now if the R8 gordini were a bicycle it would be a.... Oops!

Now, is there really any difference between collecting art, cars or mugs?

If we like something and have an appreciation for it what is the problem?

I would not criticise paper folder for having a vulgar lifestyle for her collection?
 

montyboy

New Member
Nobody is "directly contributing" though, given that the whole lot goes into the general taxation pot.

Indeed, it's likely that a cyclist could pay more into that (and thus, one could assume, more towards the upkeep of the roads) than many motorists, given the relative demographics of the two groups in the UK.


Do the demographics prove that?

Are cyclists generally higher tax payers, if that is the case I think that would suprise many (probably me included)

I dont know the answer to that question.
 

ianrauk

Tattooed Beat Messiah
Location
Rides Ti2
I am quite happy to pay the same amount of 'road tax' for my bike as what the following cars have to pay to be on the road.


Alfa Romeo MiTo 1.3 JTM-2 85PS Sprint
Audi A1 1.6 TDI SE, Sport, S Line
Audi A3 1.6 TDI 105PS Start/Stop 99
BMW New 1 Series 116D Efficient Dynamics
Chrysler Ypsilon 0.9T Twin Air
Citroen C-Zero 49kw
Citroen C3 1.4 HDi 70PS VT
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 67PS Airdream VTR+ 93g
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 88PS Airdream VTR+, Exclusive
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream+
Citroen New C4 1.6 e-HDi 110PS Airdream EGS6 VTR+
Citroen DS3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream Dstyle 95g
Citroen DS3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream Dstyle, Dstyle Plus
Fiat 500 0.9T Twin Air Pop, Sport, Lounge, By Gucci Start/Stop
Fiat 500C 0.9T Twin Air Pop, Lounge Start/Stop
Fiat Punto Evo 1.3 Dynamic, Dynamic Eco Start/Stop
Ford Fiesta 1.6 TDCi ECOnetic
Hyundai New i10 1.0i Blue
Kia New Picanto 1.0i 1, 1Air, 2
Kia New Picanto 1.25i 2 Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 1 Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 1 Air Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 2 Ecodynamics
Lexus CT200h 1.8 Hybrid SE-I, SE-L, SE-L Premier
Mini One 1.6D Base, Pepper/Media/Sport Pack
Mini Cooper 1.6D Base, Pepper Pack, Media Pack, Chilli Pack, Sport Pack
Mitsubishi i MiEV
Nissan Leaf EV
Nissan Micra 1.2 S/C DIG-S
Peugeot 207 1.6 HDi Oxygo, Oxygo+ 92PS
Peugeot New 308 1.6 e-HDi SR98 112PS
Peugeot iOn 330v
Peugeot 3008 2.0 HDi FAP 200PS HYbrid 99kg 4WD
Renault Clio 1.5 dCi Expression Eco 88PS
Seat Ibiza 1.2 TDI 75PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Seat Ibiza Estate 1.2 TDI 75PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Seat Leon 1.6 TDI 105PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Skoda Fabia 1.2 TDI CR 75PS Greenline II
Skoda Fabia Estate 1.2 TDI CR 75PS Greenline II
Skoda Octavia 1.6 TDI CR Greenline II
Smart fortwo coupé Electric Drive
Smart fortwo coupé 0.8 cdi Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo coupé 1.0 mhd Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo cabrio 0.8 cdi Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo cabrio 1.0 mhd Pulse, Passion
Toyota Auris 1.8 VVT-i HSD 89g/km T4
Toyota Auris 1.8 VVT-i HSD 93g/km T4, T-Spirit
Toyota iQ 1.0i VVT-i Base, 2
Toyota Prius 1.8 VVT-i T3, T4, T Spirit
Vauxhall Corsa 1.3 CDTi 95PS ecoFLEX S, Exclusiv Start/Stop
Vauxhall Corsa 1.3 CDTi 95PS ecoFLEX S(AC), Exclusiv (AC) Start/Stop
Vauxhall Ampera 16-kwh 149PS
Volkswagen Up 1.0i 60PS Take Up, Move Up, High Up
Volkswagen Golf 1.6 TDI 105PS Bluemotion Start/Stop
Volkswagen Polo 1.2 TDI 75PS Bluemotion
Volvo C30 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
Volvo S40 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
Volvo V50 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
 

MissTillyFlop

Evil communist dictator, lover of gerbils & Pope.
Now, is there really any difference between collecting art, cars or mugs?

If we like something and have an appreciation for it what is the problem?

I would not criticise paper folder for having a vulgar lifestyle for her collection?

I like collecting empty food wrappers - or so my coat pockets would have me believe!
 

montyboy

New Member
Or more accurately, all tax payers directly contribute to the roads, even people who don't drive or cycle.

It's basically the flip side of someone who objects to their taxes paying for schools on the basis that they don't have children.


Its probably just that you dont pay extra tax if you have kids but you do if you have a vehicle on the road.
 

MissTillyFlop

Evil communist dictator, lover of gerbils & Pope.
I am quite happy to pay the same amount of 'road tax' for my bike as what the following cars have to pay to be on the road.


Alfa Romeo MiTo 1.3 JTM-2 85PS Sprint
Audi A1 1.6 TDI SE, Sport, S Line
Audi A3 1.6 TDI 105PS Start/Stop 99
BMW New 1 Series 116D Efficient Dynamics
Chrysler Ypsilon 0.9T Twin Air
Citroen C-Zero 49kw
Citroen C3 1.4 HDi 70PS VT
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 67PS Airdream VTR+ 93g
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 88PS Airdream VTR+, Exclusive
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream+
Citroen New C4 1.6 e-HDi 110PS Airdream EGS6 VTR+
Citroen DS3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream Dstyle 95g
Citroen DS3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream Dstyle, Dstyle Plus
Fiat 500 0.9T Twin Air Pop, Sport, Lounge, By Gucci Start/Stop
Fiat 500C 0.9T Twin Air Pop, Lounge Start/Stop
Fiat Punto Evo 1.3 Dynamic, Dynamic Eco Start/Stop
Ford Fiesta 1.6 TDCi ECOnetic
Hyundai New i10 1.0i Blue
Kia New Picanto 1.0i 1, 1Air, 2
Kia New Picanto 1.25i 2 Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 1 Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 1 Air Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 2 Ecodynamics
Lexus CT200h 1.8 Hybrid SE-I, SE-L, SE-L Premier
Mini One 1.6D Base, Pepper/Media/Sport Pack
Mini Cooper 1.6D Base, Pepper Pack, Media Pack, Chilli Pack, Sport Pack
Mitsubishi i MiEV
Nissan Leaf EV
Nissan Micra 1.2 S/C DIG-S
Peugeot 207 1.6 HDi Oxygo, Oxygo+ 92PS
Peugeot New 308 1.6 e-HDi SR98 112PS
Peugeot iOn 330v
Peugeot 3008 2.0 HDi FAP 200PS HYbrid 99kg 4WD
Renault Clio 1.5 dCi Expression Eco 88PS
Seat Ibiza 1.2 TDI 75PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Seat Ibiza Estate 1.2 TDI 75PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Seat Leon 1.6 TDI 105PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Skoda Fabia 1.2 TDI CR 75PS Greenline II
Skoda Fabia Estate 1.2 TDI CR 75PS Greenline II
Skoda Octavia 1.6 TDI CR Greenline II
Smart fortwo coupé Electric Drive
Smart fortwo coupé 0.8 cdi Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo coupé 1.0 mhd Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo cabrio 0.8 cdi Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo cabrio 1.0 mhd Pulse, Passion
Toyota Auris 1.8 VVT-i HSD 89g/km T4
Toyota Auris 1.8 VVT-i HSD 93g/km T4, T-Spirit
Toyota iQ 1.0i VVT-i Base, 2
Toyota Prius 1.8 VVT-i T3, T4, T Spirit
Vauxhall Corsa 1.3 CDTi 95PS ecoFLEX S, Exclusiv Start/Stop
Vauxhall Corsa 1.3 CDTi 95PS ecoFLEX S(AC), Exclusiv (AC) Start/Stop
Vauxhall Ampera 16-kwh 149PS
Volkswagen Up 1.0i 60PS Take Up, Move Up, High Up
Volkswagen Golf 1.6 TDI 105PS Bluemotion Start/Stop
Volkswagen Polo 1.2 TDI 75PS Bluemotion
Volvo C30 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
Volvo S40 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
Volvo V50 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop

:tongue:
 

montyboy

New Member
I am quite happy to pay the same amount of 'road tax' for my bike as what the following cars have to pay to be on the road.


Alfa Romeo MiTo 1.3 JTM-2 85PS Sprint
Audi A1 1.6 TDI SE, Sport, S Line
Audi A3 1.6 TDI 105PS Start/Stop 99
BMW New 1 Series 116D Efficient Dynamics
Chrysler Ypsilon 0.9T Twin Air
Citroen C-Zero 49kw
Citroen C3 1.4 HDi 70PS VT
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 67PS Airdream VTR+ 93g
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 88PS Airdream VTR+, Exclusive
Citroen C3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream+
Citroen New C4 1.6 e-HDi 110PS Airdream EGS6 VTR+
Citroen DS3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream Dstyle 95g
Citroen DS3 1.6 e-HDi 90PS Airdream Dstyle, Dstyle Plus
Fiat 500 0.9T Twin Air Pop, Sport, Lounge, By Gucci Start/Stop
Fiat 500C 0.9T Twin Air Pop, Lounge Start/Stop
Fiat Punto Evo 1.3 Dynamic, Dynamic Eco Start/Stop
Ford Fiesta 1.6 TDCi ECOnetic
Hyundai New i10 1.0i Blue
Kia New Picanto 1.0i 1, 1Air, 2
Kia New Picanto 1.25i 2 Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 1 Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 1 Air Ecodynamics
Kia New Rio 1.1CRDi 2 Ecodynamics
Lexus CT200h 1.8 Hybrid SE-I, SE-L, SE-L Premier
Mini One 1.6D Base, Pepper/Media/Sport Pack
Mini Cooper 1.6D Base, Pepper Pack, Media Pack, Chilli Pack, Sport Pack
Mitsubishi i MiEV
Nissan Leaf EV
Nissan Micra 1.2 S/C DIG-S
Peugeot 207 1.6 HDi Oxygo, Oxygo+ 92PS
Peugeot New 308 1.6 e-HDi SR98 112PS
Peugeot iOn 330v
Peugeot 3008 2.0 HDi FAP 200PS HYbrid 99kg 4WD
Renault Clio 1.5 dCi Expression Eco 88PS
Seat Ibiza 1.2 TDI 75PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Seat Ibiza Estate 1.2 TDI 75PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Seat Leon 1.6 TDI 105PS SE Copa Ecomotive
Skoda Fabia 1.2 TDI CR 75PS Greenline II
Skoda Fabia Estate 1.2 TDI CR 75PS Greenline II
Skoda Octavia 1.6 TDI CR Greenline II
Smart fortwo coupé Electric Drive
Smart fortwo coupé 0.8 cdi Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo coupé 1.0 mhd Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo cabrio 0.8 cdi Pulse, Passion
Smart fortwo cabrio 1.0 mhd Pulse, Passion
Toyota Auris 1.8 VVT-i HSD 89g/km T4
Toyota Auris 1.8 VVT-i HSD 93g/km T4, T-Spirit
Toyota iQ 1.0i VVT-i Base, 2
Toyota Prius 1.8 VVT-i T3, T4, T Spirit
Vauxhall Corsa 1.3 CDTi 95PS ecoFLEX S, Exclusiv Start/Stop
Vauxhall Corsa 1.3 CDTi 95PS ecoFLEX S(AC), Exclusiv (AC) Start/Stop
Vauxhall Ampera 16-kwh 149PS
Volkswagen Up 1.0i 60PS Take Up, Move Up, High Up
Volkswagen Golf 1.6 TDI 105PS Bluemotion Start/Stop
Volkswagen Polo 1.2 TDI 75PS Bluemotion
Volvo C30 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
Volvo S40 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop
Volvo V50 1.6D DRIVe SE, SE Lux Start/Stop


Very good point.

Why do they get out of paying, cant be equitable?
 

MissTillyFlop

Evil communist dictator, lover of gerbils & Pope.
Very good point.

Why do they get out of paying, cant be equitable?

So the Uk can turn up at the G20 summit and say "Look we're encouraging the reduction of carbon emissions by encouraging the use of these environmentally friendly cars! Although we may not actually provide the infrastructure to make them work, not to mention that electric vehicles are well out of most people's budgets."
 

Origamist

Legendary Member
Is it a Moomin thing specifically, or do you like Tove Jansson generally? If the latter, you should look at his work for "The Hobbit", which is delightful, if you've not already seen it.

I've liked a lot of her work, but I can't recall the Hobbit stuff, I'll check it out though.

It's interesting how the Moomin's came about - from a debate about Kant, believe it or not...
 

benb

Evidence based cyclist
Location
Epsom
Its probably just that you dont pay extra tax if you have kids but you do if you have a vehicle on the road.

And lorry drivers pay more VED than car drivers, but I haven't noticed car drivers falling over themselves to clear out of the way to defer to the higher tax payer.
 
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