dark cycle kit!!

[bianchi1]

"No lights" bit of a goalposts shift there, in the context of this thread.

Just responding to the "offensive victim blaming" quote. It cant always be the motorists fault, as much as some may like to believe. We have a role to play, and is this sensible?

"In the dusk a black clad cyclist with no lights"

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

So why am I not dead yet?

 

[ianrauk]

So why am I not dead yet?

No one can see you....?

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

No one can see you....?

Excellent work. I knew my special rain camouflage would be highly effective in NI.

Are you sure?

I am doubting myself now.

 

[bianchi1]

Is this a downgrade to goalpost tweaking? We have reasonably clear laws. Lights from sunset to sunrise. I see no good reason to conceded anything more.

So far the evidence put forward, in response to some nice peer reviewed journal articles, by those who advocate not wearing conspicuous cycle clothing appears to consist of:

a picture of a giant lemon in space
the bland personal assertion that all black clothing is more visible than high viz
there is only one rule and that is never wear white shorts
they paint airplanes black
not to be mistaken for council workers
all drivers never look anyway
and something about yellow vomit?

Compelling stuff!! I can see why you wouldn't conceded anything.

I and i forgot that high viz is a superstition

 

[bianchi1]

Fine feel free to carry on preaching to people then.

I prefer informing, to preaching, but i guess its subjective.

Thanks for your permission for me to carry on tho. Much appreciated.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

So far the evidence put forward, in response to some nice peer reviewed journal articles, by those who advocate not wearing conspicuous cycle clothing appears to consist of:

a picture of a giant lemon in space
the bland personal assertion that all black clothing is more visible than high viz
there is only one rule and that is never wear white shorts
they paint airplanes black
not to be mistaken for council workers
all drivers never look anyway
and something about yellow vomit?

Compelling stuff!! I can see why you wouldn't conceded anything.

I and i forgot that high viz is a superstition

Whilst you're here....

Have you converted anyone to your point of view yet?

 

[GrumpyGregry]

And even then, the buggers change their minds!

If you did wait every time to absolutely sure, sadly, you'd never get out of your drive. (well, or out of the first turning with any other traffic). All you can do is be as sure as possible, and still expect to have to take evasive action.

Roundabouts are terrible for people changing their minds without looking or indicating. At least when they do it in front of a lorry, they learn an expensive painful lesson, rather than the "oh, was that something? no, never mind", they'd get hitting a cyclist...

I think it is fair to say that when motorcycling, driving, cycling or crossing the road I must have higher "as sure as possible" standard to many.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

Just responding to the "offensive victim blaming" quote. It cant always be the motorists fault, as much as some may like to believe. We have a role to play, and is this sensible?

"In the dusk a black clad cyclist with no lights"

Could you paint a scenario for us where, in your opinion, it would not be the fault of the operator of 1 tonne plus of metal and plastic were it to collide with a more vulnerable road user at night?

It might help if you could give us your working definitions of sunset, twilight and dusk to be going on with?

I believe sunset occurs just a few minutes before 16:00 in your neck of the woods at this time of year, so riding around at three-ish with no lights is perfectly legal. At four-ish? Not so much.

 

[ufkacbln]

So i may as well ditch my lights as well if these drivers aren't looking ?

If you so wish....

 

[Flying_Monkey]

Seriously for a second - black clothing on its own is probably the best thing to wear during the day if you want to be seen. At night, in rural areas and small towns where other reflective materials are not widespread, reflective additions are the best way to be seen - although you still need lights to see where you're going and to see pedestrians etc. In big cities, where there are lots of reflective materials, the advantages of wearing reflective material for being seen are likely to be significantly diminished. And you probably don't need lights to see by either, although of course it is against the law not to have them. It's a bit silly to argue against reflective materials in every situation, but it's also a bit silly to pretend they offer so much of an advantage in urban cycling. As with most arguments of this nature, entrenched positions mean that the extremists on either side just pay no attention to anything that should probably cause them to modify their position.

That's it really. But please carry on...

 

[Archie_tect]

Whilst you're here....

Have you converted anyone to your point of view yet?

...those boots could do with a good clean Greg! A bit of dubbin and some elbow grease 'n you'll get years out of them yet.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

...those boots could do with a good clean Greg! A bit of dubbin and some elbow grease 'n you;'ll get years out of them yet.

You sound like a bizarre cross between the Aged P and the lovely Helen.

 

[Archie_tect]

Granny would be proud!

 

[Arch]

Sounds like you've been there then Arch

Thankfully not yet, but I've seen enough stupid driving and near misses to know how dull witted some people are.

Only a couple of weeks ago, NT and I were on a roundabout near Warrington, that led to a motorway junction. NT was in the correct lane (in effect a right turn), for the motorway, when a woman in a Porsche 4x4, who was in the lane for straight ahead suddenly realised she wanted the lane to her right instead, and started to move into it, no slowing, no indication, nothing, regardless of the fact that our car was currently occupying that space. Fortunately, NT was on the ball, and braked, and used his horn to warn her, and she slammed on the anchors and looked down at me in the passenger seat with an expression that combined "What?" and "Get out of my way!"

Now, as we were heading for a motorway, that space wouldn't have been occupied by a cyclist, but it could have been a motorcyclist. If she didn't see (because she didn't look) an estate car, what chance has a biker? And no doubt her default behaviour on any unfamiliar road or junction is to change lanes at random for her own convenience.