COVID Vaccine !

[tom73]

The news now saying only 4 million doses expected this year, another update from BioNTech ☹.

Guess that follows on from yesterday when they reported they are already having issues with getting hold of materials.
Your right about attitudes changing on the vaccine news it’s just made matters worse I’ve heard and seen even more ”who cares about covid” From trolleys that I’ve seen more look set for Christmas than before this either that or couples are even more happy to give the bin a good feed come Boxing Day.
The timing of this though welcome has come just the wrong time given what’s coming in down the line.

 

[lane]

I can see reasons why they start with cities, but most of them are basically continuations of the neglect of rural/semi-rural boroughs over the last 10+ years.


Some of mine do, some don't, so I'm fairly neutral in that regard, but on balance, I think it would make more sense to prioritise boroughs with high infection rates and their neighbours, rather than the current practice of sending this short-supply vaccine to outlying cities in low-infection areas.

The announcement on https://www.england.nhs.uk/2020/12/...est-ever-nhs-vaccination-programme-this-week/ seems a bit misleading because it listed trusts when it is often only the HQ hospital which is getting any. For example, Boston's hospital is run by the United Lincs Hospitals Trust which is on the list, but I heard that only Lincoln is getting the vaccine despite Boston's semi-rural borough having more cases per 100k per week than Lincoln as of yesterday (418 vs 412).

Boston also has far and away highest rate in over 60s nationally

 

[mjr]

People who live in cities are more likely to have larger networks than people in market towns,

Is that true? I thought once there was a fairly low threshold level of built-up-ness, then network size remained pretty constant (because once you're seeing people all the time when moving around, it doesn't matter that there's - for example - another five suburbs beyond yours rather than only one) until you get to the biggest cities that have metros/undergrounds putting hundreds in contact, instead of bus-sized groups.

 

[Randomnerd]

You couldn’t make this shoot up.

Hatt Mancock crying fake tears on telly. Daft royals chugging about on a train. A couple of million people in one of the richest nations on the planet heading for destitution. Sixty thousand dead in nine months. And Boris is busy getting his suitcase packed to go argue about haddock.

im going for a bike ride.

 

[srw]

Is that true? I thought once there was a fairly low threshold level of built-up-ness, then network size remained pretty constant

In terms of people you know, possibly. In terms of people you can infect, definitely not.

 

[Adam4868]

You couldn’t make this shoot up.

Hatt Mancock crying fake tears on telly. Daft royals chugging about on a train. A couple of million people in one of the richest nations on the planet heading for destitution. Sixty thousand dead in nine months. And Boris is busy getting his suitcase packed to go argue about haddock.

im going for a bike ride.

V Day....🙄

 

[tom73]

It turns out the biggest factor in which hospitals become one of 50 hubs came down to which hospitals already had the freezers. As this stuff is in such sort supply and the media are just waiting for things to go wrong. It a sensible way to start it means they can be up and running quickly. Given that it take a few weeks for the freezers to get to temperature and that pharmacy staff will have experience of correct medicines mangermaent and the skills to dispense the vaccine correctly. Using experienced clinicians allows for things to be quickly be learned and built into a wider roll out.
My area is not part of the 50 either but I know in time it will come it's no point having a vaccine if it can't be given in a way that works and at a rate that is quick enough but still clinically safe.
It's only day two and some of the clowns are already starting the "they have one I don't have one" game. This is not a political game but a public health matter and not a time for things to off the rails. It won't work if the ones who know how to do this are not allowed to do it.
T&T mess up shows what happens when the clowns get to work.

 

[mjr]

It turns out the biggest factor in which hospitals become one of 50 hubs came down to which hospitals already had the freezers.

Have they come out and said that officially? Such an admission would go some way to soothing anger of those in "vaccine deserts" - it would then just seem like another consequence of past thoughtlessness rather than a new deliberate choice to prioritise (for example) Tier 1 Truro ahead of Tier 3 Boston.

It's only day two and some of the clowns are already starting the "they have one I don't have one" game. This is not a political game but a public health matter and not a time for things to off the rails. It won't work if the ones who know how to do this are not allowed to do it.
T&T mess up shows what happens when the clowns get to work.

Oh I quite expect that, as with T&T, this cannot be fixed now for this time. It was probably broken in 2012 during the last balkanising reform of NHS hospitals or the short-term year-to-year complete reboot of public health policy or something like that. I just hope the clowns aren't playing games and remember this injustice the next time they are invited to review the public health structures for England.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Look, there’s only limited doses till next year. Not everyone is getting vaccinated for Christma. Just be patient, we are all in a vaccine desert till invited.

 

[Jenkins]

Have they come out and said that officially? Such an admission would go some way to soothing anger of those in "vaccine deserts" - it would then just seem like another consequence of past thoughtlessness rather than a new deliberate choice to prioritise (for example) Tier 1 Truro ahead of Tier 3 Boston.

The lack of freezers is why Ipswich (Suffolk) isn't getting any vaccines yet, but the sister hospital in Colchester (Essex) is. Plenty of coverage from The James Paget (Gorelston, Norfolk) of vaccinations in Look East this evening.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

Plenty of coverage... ...of vaccinations in Look E

Isn't it just wonderful to be able to read news like this. Just imagine back in April. Who would have believed it possible.

Fantastic.

 

[lazybloke]

....Such an admission would go some way to soothing anger of those in "vaccine deserts" - it would then just seem like another consequence of past thoughtlessness rather than a new deliberate choice to prioritise (for example) Tier 1 Truro ahead of Tier 3 Boston....

Tiers are almost certainly irrelevant to the hub locations.
The decision of location would have been decided long ago, possibly in hot weather when infections rates were low and the idea of tiers was still way down in a back pocket. Factors in deciding locations may have included the existence and capacity of storage facilities, electrical supplies for all those freezers, hospital staffing levels, space/capability/skills to start immediate vaccination campaigns on the premises, the likely impact on other services at that site, the availability of staff with skills to run the wider vaccination programmes within the wider commuity, local transport links, and no doubt many other factors.

The important thing to remember is that vaccination is a long-term solution; a strategic response that will take a long time to be delivered.

In that time infection rates in different areas will rise and fall. A high rate in Linconshire now does deserve a rapid tactical response, of course it does, but that exactly what the Tiers are for.

Edited for typos

 

[mjr]

Plenty of coverage from The James Paget (Gorelston, Norfolk) of vaccinations in Look East this evening.

BBC as state propaganda machine reacting to the rural outrage being expressed to several of their local radio phone ins yesterday by emphasising probably the smallest settlement to get the vaccine yet.

But even then, everyone should be aware that Gorleston runs into Yarmouth, Caister, Hopton, Corton, Lowestoft, Oulton and Carlton with only golf courses and holiday parks between some of them as artificial green divides, so really it's the hospital of a cross-border urban area of 125'000+ people. It's almost as populous as the Cambridge area excluding students.

 

[lazybloke]

BBC as state propaganda machine reacting to the rural outrage being expressed to several of their local radio phone ins yesterday by emphasising probably the smallest settlement to get the vaccine yet.

But even then, everyone should be aware that Gorleston runs into Yarmouth, Caister, Hopton, Corton, Lowestoft, Oulton and Carlton with only golf courses and holiday parks between some of them as artificial green divides, so really it's the hospital of a cross-border urban area of 125'000+ people. It's almost as populous as the Cambridge area excluding students.

Yesterday you implied that Truro didn't deserve a vaccination hub - your preference was Boston.

The Boston hospitals are already in a trust that runs a vaccination hub, just 36 miles up the road at Lincoln.
Meanwhile, if you "moved" the Truro hub to Boston, that would leave the entire country of Cornwall without any hub.

The nearest hub to Cornwall would probably then be Plymouth , so if a care worker lived near Lands End, they could face a round trip of well over 150 miles and a Tamar bridge toll to receive their first vaccination. And the same for the booster in 3 weeks.

I'm not trying to criticise; more a case of recognising that each hub location will have different pros & cons, so some areas will not be served as well as others.
As others have said, patience is needed by all. Local vaccination will come.

 

[tom73]

Many have tried to explain that sound clinical and logistics issues are driving this. Most focus has been no the latter but the clinical part is massive and complex it can't/won't be rushed. If that fails the trust and confidence in the vaccine will go and it's game over. It's not about one area getting one one up on another the tiers and case rates have nothing to do with this. Vaccine programs don't work like that and public health doesn't fit into nice little boxers.
Not having a hub may well turn out to be an advantage as the need for more GP's hubs will be bigger. Which GP's become hubs will be down to CCG's. This vaccine program is not time limited everyone who want's this can have one. We just have calm down and sit tight and wait for the vaccination program to get rolled out. The vaccine is the way to future not a way out current mess the more people start to push the more the clowns get twitchy and start to poke around. We really can't afford that to happen. Mass vaccination programs has been bread and butter for the NHS for years they really know how to do this. It's a simple choice let them do it at a speed that's safe ,Clinical sound and do able or let Serco et al let rip and watch the wheels come.