COVID Vaccine !

[matticus]

Whilst it would be nice to get from 80% to, say, 90% (there will always be some who refuse despite whatever messaging is used) it doesn't have a major impact on when herd immunity is achieved. If someone in a higher risk group refuses the vaccine it means someone in a lower risk group gets vaccinated more quickly.

This agrees with my intuitive view on the situation

Citation?

[The only problem may be the uneven spread e.g. BAME communities seem especially reluctant.]

 

[nickyboy]

This agrees with my intuitive view on the situation

Citation?

[The only problem may be the uneven spread e.g. BAME communities seem especially reluctant.]

My common sense (way better than any citation IMV )

I actually think that the more high riskers who pass the vaccination (leading to low riskers having it more quickly), the quicker herd immunity is achieved on the basis that low riskers probably have a lifestyle more aligned with spreading the virus.

 

[Ajax Bay]

Citation (perhaps)
https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/fears-bame-community-more-refuse-4898861

An undated document released by SAGE on 10 days ago (15 Jan) found “marked difference existed by ethnicity, with black ethnic groups the most likely to be Covid-19 [vaccine] hesitant, followed by Pakistani/Bangladeshi groups”.
"Adults in minority ethnic groups were less likely to receive the vaccine than those in white groups, by between 10-20%."

On 18 Jan? BBC Radio 4’s Today programme, Vaccines minister Nadhim Zahawi said he is concerned that vaccine uptake may be lower in BAME communities. “I am worried about BAME communities, which is why I’m spending a lot of time with the mayors, with Sadiq (Khan), and of course other parts of local government to make sure we reach those hard-to-reach groups.
“My big worry is if 85% of the adult population get vaccinated, if the 15% skews heavily to the BAME community, the virus will very quickly infect that community.” [Comment: Think the last bit is doubtful, at least I see no reason why the virus would spread quicker than with current behaviours.]

I have commented about this a few times in the last week: it needs pro-activity and I understand the NHS has reached out to the wide medical community, in particular those with whom the BAME communities can identify with (and trust more (assumed)) to urge them to communicate the facts, persuasively, counter unfounded concerns and invite people to recognise that while this is an individual choice, there are wider family and community responsibilities.

 

[classic33]

To be clear, it was more that I don't trust that gov.UK hasn't misinformed its ambassador, but OK, in case this wasn't clear enough: I doubt the accuracy of reports from the likes of the Republican-supporting Politico.


Because that substance appears to be right-wing horse shoot, often missing key details to make it appear worse. I'd point out that all countries have been keeping bits of vaccination deals quiet, arguing commercial sensitivities to avoid freedom-of-information laws, and participating countries were allowed to negotiate with the companies involved once the EU concluded its talks (which mostly happened in August), as well as with companies not in talks with the EU.

But what's the alternative you prefer? Every country for itself and outbidding and gazumping each other, driving the price up for something that won't truly protect until it's been bought for enough willing takers in each area?


Think of it in terms of the curse "may you live in interesting times".

Others have addressed the MHRA/EMA point, including pointing out the disruption caused by EMA relocation due to Brexit.

Those developed under "Operation Warp Speed", were all to be of a similar price and spec. This in order to make large scale manufacturing easier and to ensure they got the Emergency User Agreement, in exchange for their product.

Pfizer was just one of many that used "Operation Warp Speed" to get their product approved* and onto the market.

*FDA approval.

 

[C R]

Those developed under "Operation Warp Speed", were all to be of a similar price and spec. This in order to make large scale manufacturing easier and to ensure they got the Emergency User Agreement, in exchange for their product.

Pfizer was just one of many that used "Operation Warp Speed" to get their product approved* and onto the market.

*FDA approval.

I didn't think Pfizer were part of warp speed.

 

[Landsurfer]

Citation (perhaps)
https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/fears-bame-community-more-refuse-4898861

An undated document released by SAGE on 10 days ago (15 Jan) found “marked difference existed by ethnicity, with black ethnic groups the most likely to be Covid-19 [vaccine] hesitant, followed by Pakistani/Bangladeshi groups”.
"Adults in minority ethnic groups were less likely to receive the vaccine than those in white groups, by between 10-20%."

On 18 Jan? BBC Radio 4’s Today programme, Vaccines minister Nadhim Zahawi said he is concerned that vaccine uptake may be lower in BAME communities. “I am worried about BAME communities, which is why I’m spending a lot of time with the mayors, with Sadiq (Khan), and of course other parts of local government to make sure we reach those hard-to-reach groups.
“My big worry is if 85% of the adult population get vaccinated, if the 15% skews heavily to the BAME community, the virus will very quickly infect that community.” [Comment: Think the last bit is doubtful, at least I see no reason why the virus would spread quicker than with current behaviours.]

I have commented about this a few times in the last week: it needs pro-activity and I understand the NHS has reached out to the wide medical community, in particular those with whom the BAME communities can identify with (and trust more (assumed)) to urge them to communicate the facts, persuasively, counter unfounded concerns and invite people to recognise that while this is an individual choice, there are wider family and community responsibilities.

What is the reason some members of the BAME community will not / are unsure of .. taking the Vaccine.

 

[classic33]

"When the Department of Health and Human Services released Pfizer's $1.95 billion coronavirus vaccine contract with Operation Warp Speed last Wednesday"

https://khn.org/morning-breakout/pf...warp-speed-excludes-common-government-rights/

 

[Deleted User]

What is the reason some members of the BAME community will not / are unsure of .. taking the Vaccine.

Some on religious grounds apparently, Pig in the Vaccine!

Simplifying it but you get the gist.

 

[tom73]

Yet, despite this, public of acceptance of the vaccination is one of the highest in the world. Whilst it would be nice to get from 80% to, say, 90% (there will always be some who refuse despite whatever messaging is used) it doesn't have a major impact on when herd immunity is achieved. If someone in a higher risk group refuses the vaccine it means someone in a lower risk group gets vaccinated more quickly.

Countries like France have a massively bigger issue regarding vaccine messaging than UK does

Oh well it's ok than as long someone has one it's not a problem. It's plainly not i'm not talking about anti vac mob. Some real work needs doing on that front. This is a public health matter end off and no one who is willing to have access to to it. Should be put off or fearful of once I've had it then what. We don't do public health like that or should be going down that road. Anyone who's ever seen what happens when we get things wrong or it's effects on them or wider society. Understands why yet more health inequalities will being. It's ok to for others to think it is but they don't have to worry about it.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Well, the message must be getting through somehow - vaccine acceptance rates growing in UK since mid-November +20% up from 61% then to 81% now.

Germany struggling and France a nightmare - although both are improving.

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/interna...s/2021/01/22/europe-becoming-more-pro-vaccine

 

[C R]

"When the Department of Health and Human Services released Pfizer's $1.95 billion coronavirus vaccine contract with Operation Warp Speed last Wednesday"

https://khn.org/morning-breakout/pf...warp-speed-excludes-common-government-rights/

That's distribution, not development. When the initial results on the effectiveness of the vaccine came out, Trump said that was a result of warp speed funding, but Pfizer were quick to point out that they were not part of that effort, see for instance here:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/andrew...though-company-did-not-take-government-funds/

 

[mjr]

Amusingly, at tonight's press conference, Hancock said "We are stronger together, and Europe is stronger together in the fight against this pandemic."

OK, really he said the UK is stronger together, arguing against Scottish autonomy on vaccine supply, but the same argument cuts both ways. It remains a nonsense to argue that the nations of the UK should work together on vaccines but the nations of Europe or even the world should not.

 

[Ajax Bay]

Remind me who is arguing or suggesting that the nations of the European Union should not work together on vaccines.
[SPOILER/]Noone[/SPOILER/]

 

[midlife]

... surely 0.3% increase ...... Maths .....

Going from 10 to 13 is circa 30% change for an individual . Doesn't matter if that's per hundred, per thousand....... for an individual

 

[srw]

... surely 0.3% increase ...... Maths .....

0.3 percentage points. 30%.

To calculate the percentage increase, do (Y-X)/X and express the result as a percentage by multiplying by 100.