Coronavirus outbreak

[classic33]

1. I wrote it as "Why should it be mainly {{stuff that makes people happy that gets restricted} and not {anything that involves payment}}?" and you misread it as "Why should it be {{mainly stuff that makes people happy that gets restricted} and not {anything that involves payment}}?"
2. Is it only the drink that makes you happy in pubs, not the socialising?


Kicking everyone out at ten doesn't necessarily help with any of that, so are you saying it's just punishment?

And how exactly can they tell that taken contact details aren't correct, as long as "M Mouse" isn't on the list?

Maybe giving a thought to your choice of wording might help.

Pubs are not the sole source of socialising, but they are one where proper records aren't being kept. The minority, who feel the rules don't apply to them, have made it worse for the majority.

M. Mouse appeared at two local town centre pubs, along with a D. Trump and a B. Johnson.
Some haven't even set the means of recording the details. Legal requirement to be allowed to be open. Bear in mind they agreed to these conditions to be allowed to re-open. And you're the one who brought "ensuring public safety" into this. If basic rules, for ensuring public safety can't be done by those who should be doing them, why should they be allowed to open at all?

Four pubs, local to me, never applied because the personal licence holder felt that due to the premises, they couldn't meet the then current regulations.

 

[brodiej]

Because Sweden is in all probability, now at the tail end of it's pandemic, and is unlikely to see any further major waves of disease.

That aged well

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-h...es-possible-as-covid-cases-rise-idUKKCN26D1U6

 

[tom73]

That aged well

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-h...es-possible-as-covid-cases-rise-idUKKCN26D1U6

Boris tried the "now do you mind most awfully not getting too close and play nicely children" Approach and we just said "stuff you all we want to do is go to pub and get smashed" Along with covid I don't fear you your not stopping me the Germany's never did.

 

[mjr]

Some interesting views on and from NL, AT and RU on https://www.eurotopics.net/en/248093/corona-autumn-fear-of-lockdown-returns?zitat=247984#zitat247984

 

[mjr]

Maybe giving a thought to your choice of wording might help.

Damnit, Jim, I'm a cyclist, not an author!

Also, few people persist telling someone what they meant after they've clarified it!

Pubs are not the sole source of socialising, but they are one where proper records aren't being kept. The minority, who feel the rules don't apply to them, have made it worse for the majority.

Which completely misses the point that it's socialising being restricted when bars are not responsible for huge numbers of cases. If Boris was following the evidence I've seen, he'd be tightening up workplaces (especially food factories), dormitories and vehicles.

M. Mouse appeared at two local town centre pubs, along with a D. Trump and a B. Johnson.
Some haven't even set the means of recording the details. Legal requirement to be allowed to be open. Bear in mind they agreed to these conditions to be allowed to re-open.

So take action against those. Punishing the whole sector seems rather like keeping the whole class in detention despite knowing exactly who did it - and I hope we all accept what sort of illegal assaults outside the school gate often resulted from that. That's not what we need to see now!

And you're the one who brought "ensuring public safety" into this.

That was a quote but anyway, this whole crisis is about public safety. That's not something I brought.

 

[classic33]

Damnit, Jim, I'm a cyclist, not an author!

Also, few people persist telling someone what they meant after they've clarified it!


Which completely misses the point that it's socialising being restricted when bars are not responsible for huge numbers of cases. If Boris was following the evidence I've seen, he'd be tightening up workplaces (especially food factories), dormitories and vehicles.


So take action against those. Punishing the whole sector seems rather like keeping the whole class in detention despite knowing exactly who did it - and I hope we all accept what sort of illegal assaults outside the school gate often resulted from that. That's not what we need to see now!


That was a quote but anyway, this whole crisis is about public safety. That's not something I brought.

Clarified! You've tried to explain, more than once what you meant, and your answers don't match.

How do you take action against someone who has given false details?

The minority have made it worse for the majority. As is often the case. And many have had action taken against them, but they don't seem to care. Just another example of "I'm alright Jack, sod you". My enjoyment is more important than your health. Explain why you feel this is the case.

With regards "socialising", are you saying that pubs are the only place where this can take place. There's many small clubs, run in small halls, that are limited in number allowed to attend. Many of these are the only time some people will ever get out. But they've been forgotten, again. Why, in your opinion should pubs not be limited in the same way, number wise. Pubs seem the only place that numbers in the building doesn't count.

 

[tom73]

Clarified! You've tried to explain, more than once what you meant, and your answers don't match.

How do you take action against someone who has given false details?

The minority have made it worse for the majority. As is often the case. And many have had action taken against them, but they don't seem to care. Just another example of "I'm alright Jack, sod you". My enjoyment is more important than your health. Explain why you feel this is the case.

With regards "socialising", are you saying that pubs are the only place where this can take place. There's many small clubs, run in small halls, that are limited in number allowed to attend. Many of these are the only time some people will ever get out. But they've been forgotten, again. Why, in your opinion should pubs not be limited in the same way, number wise. Pubs seem the only place that numbers in the building doesn't count.

Agree still no word on such clubs , or day centres either. So much of this has been all about the big boys who are always 1st in in line with the begging bowl. Any more funding now needs to the targeted to ones in real need. Small placers , locally owned and ran placers and services. Who with in the big scheme of this won't been much to keep ticking over or help to adapted to new ways of working. The big boys will happily walk away from the high street once the small local placers go. That's what really will kill things. We need now more than ever local money made and kept local. That's the only way we can rebuild the post covid mess. Communities with the right help can and do amazing things.
So many local services who have stepped up and taken on the gaps in state provision not to counting the way they stepped up to keep things going at the moment will not survive this and the state will be left with one hell of a problem.

 

[tom73]

Found the help page for the App that's out tomorrow.
Plenty it to see what it just can do. One note of interest which looks to be at odds with how other guidelines appear laid down.
Is it says no place can prevent you entering if you won't log a visit using it.

 

[tom73]

So covid only a problem before 10 and you must sit at a table as that fools it too. That's unless you go McDonald's turns out covid only likes licensed premises. For ones can we just have some guidelines that join up.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-54268918

 

[PK99]

How do you take action against someone who has given false details?

Spot checks by licensing authority.
M. Mouse or D Trump is direct evidence of failure by the venue operator to comply with the law.
Venue immediately closed.
£10,000 fine.
License suspended for minimum 1 week and only reinstated after a personal appearance by Licensee and in the case of a Chain, by a senior manager of the Chain

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

So covid only a problem before 10 and you must sit at a table as that fools it too. That's unless you go McDonald's turns out covid only likes licensed premises. For ones can we just have some guidelines that join up.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-54268918

It's also afraid of chauffeur-driven cars or the people who get driven around in them....

Chauffeur-driven cars will be exempt from new laws forcing passengers to wear masks in taxis to slow the spread of coronavirus, Downing Street has said. As PA Media report, Boris Johnson announced that passengers in licensed vehicles would have to wear coverings under new restrictions in England aimed at preventing a resurgence of Covid-19. But No 10 said the measure, to come into force on Thursday, would not include passengers in chauffeur-driven cars, though the driver’s employer would have to ensure they could work safely. (Guardian Live - https://www.theguardian.com/politic...rictions-government-pmqs-covid-latest-updates)​

​

So, if you can get to the grouse moors in the chauffeur-driven car you're pretty much mask free....

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Spot checks by licensing authority.
M. Mouse or D Trump is direct evidence of failure by the venue operator to comply with the law.
Venue immediately closed.
£10,000 fine.
License suspended for minimum 1 week and only reinstated after a personal appearance by Licensee and in the case of a Chain, by a senior manager of the Chain

Has this actually happened?

 

[PK99]

Has this actually happened?

No.
I'm suggesting an enforcement mechanism

 

[vickster]

Spot checks by licensing authority.
M. Mouse or D Trump is direct evidence of failure by the venue operator to comply with the law.
Venue immediately closed.
£10,000 fine.
License suspended for minimum 1 week and only reinstated after a personal appearance by Licensee and in the case of a Chain, by a senior manager of the Chain

Pub goers are pretty much paying by contactless now, so they presumably have a card with their name printed on it (or at least one person in the group should do) - should be easy enough for staff member at door to confirm name against track and trace form / table booking (ok there may be the odd genuine D.Duck or M.Mouse out there but not so many). No ID=no entry. Or is it not that simple?

 

[PK99]

Pub goers are pretty much paying by contactless now, so they presumably have a card with their name printed on it (or at least one person in the group should do) - should be easy enough for staff member at door to confirm name against track and trace form / table booking (ok there may be the odd genuine D.Duck or M.Mouse out there but not so many). No ID=no entry. Or is it not that simple?

Yes, it is that simple - so any venue not doing it should face draconian penalties.

My preference would be for personal ID of all customers, not just one in party who is "trusted"