Coronavirus outbreak

[mjr]

There’s a very readable and informative blog about the development of the app from Ian Levy, NCSC‘s Technical Director.

Ironically, it refuses to display if browser security isn't relaxed. I'll read it when I'm at a sandbox computer. Thanks.

 

[newfhouse]

Ironically, it refuses to display if browser security isn't relaxed. I'll read it when I'm at a sandbox computer. Thanks.

And some more interesting reading here from Ross Anderson, someone whose opinions I have learned to value over many years.

 

[randynewmanscat]

France saw its first covid 19 patient in December according to doctors. The 24th of January was presumed to be the first case. The surprising factor is that the patient had no travel history in the months after August 2019. They are speculating that community transmission was already occuring during December.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920301643?via=ihub#!

 

[randynewmanscat]

And here is the problem: I suspect the people who hired these companies to harvest illegal data thought it was a great wheeze, but they squandered what little trust remained, just before a crisis turned up that required their citizens to trust them.

I think the blowback from the Cambridge Analytica scandal will cast a shadow for years. No criminal trials, no apologies, a £15,000 fine for the owners. I sympathise with people turned away from politics and trust in governance, this matter alone is sufficient for me. The employees of Cambridge Analytica were still excoriating the journalists who described ways in which they misused data just days before the plug was pulled on the firm.
The government said next to nothing of substance on the matter.

 

[Unkraut]

but if the government spends years acting illegally, peddling lies as truth, contradicting itself, then dismissing experts when it doesn't suit them, than they shouldn't be surprised when a real problem comes up and they discover that they don't have much credibility: shared responsibility requires shared trust.

Isn't this a classic case of reaping what you have sown. It's not just the way a certain debate was conducted over the last 4 years, but also if you elect a one-issue populist don't be surprised if he turns out to be incapable of making unpopular, but necessary, decisions.

The job of PM entails this, and you have to be prepared to make decisions, maybe even against your normal party policy in the manifesto in some circumstances, and take the mauling you will get from the opposition in Parliament.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

France saw its first covid 19 patient in December according to doctors. The 24th of January was presumed to be the first case. The surprising factor is that the patient had no travel history in the months after August 2019. They are speculating that community transmission was already occuring during December.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920301643?via=ihub#!

Yes, I heard that on the BBC World Service this morning. 27 December. I posted a Guardian link earlier today.

 

[Andy in Germany]

So we now have a government app that from day one never complied with Apple or goggles joint covid tracing privacy rules.
Is unclear who own it, runs it, and has control of the data.
The governments own information commissioner still has questions over.
No law in place to govern it's use , data ownership , or to prevent none use leading to denial of goods, services and employment.
An NHS app that fails to meet NHS data and clinical standards so can't be included in the NHS own app library.

Seems legit...

I'm not sure how the 'track and trace' thing is being done here, or of they use an app. Perhaps @Unkraut can advise, being more technologically savvy than I?

 

[Andy in Germany]

Isn't this a classic case of reaping what you have sown.

Thanks, that's what I was trying to say, in one pithy sentence...

 

[tom73]

Seems legit...

I'm not sure how the 'track and trace' thing is being done here, or of they use an app. Perhaps @Unkraut can advise, being more technologically savvy than I?

Germany and France locked horns with Apple and Google last week and pushed for them to back down.
Germany 2 days later changed it's stance and now is working on a decentralised approach.
It not clear if it's building it's own or joining Switzerland, Austria, and Estonia on decentralised privacy-preserving proximity tracing (DP-3T)
https://appleinsider.com/articles/2...tance-on-apple-google-contact-tracing-project

 

[Beebo]

UK now has the highest death toll in Europe.

How did we manage to cock it up more than Italy and Spain?

 

[vickster]

UK now has the highest death toll in Europe.

How did we manage to cock it up more than Italy and Spain?

Exactly same stats being compared?

There are ~20m more people in the UK compared to Spain and around 7m more than Italy - need to compare taking population into account ideally (and count in the exact same way).
Also need to understand the impact of gender, ethnicity, genetics, morbidity on deaths and how countries look in terms of these measures. Lots of numbers for epidemiologists to look at once the outbreak is over for sure!
And it's far from over it seems

 

[mjr]

UK now has the highest death toll in Europe.

How did we manage to cock it up more than Italy and Spain?

See also two earlier replies, first at https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/coronavirus-outbreak.256913/post-5982538

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

UK now has the highest death toll in Europe.

How did we manage to cock it up more than Italy and Spain?

Really?

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

Exactly same stats being compared?

There are ~20m more people in the UK compared to Spain and around 7m more than Italy - need to compare taking population into account ideally (and count in the exact same way).
Also need to understand the impact of gender, ethnicity, genetics, morbidity on deaths and how countries look in terms of these measures. Lots of numbers for epidemiologists to look at once the outbreak is over for sure!
And it's far from over it seems

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ gives a deaths per million figure. Note though that a good number of deaths are likely to be recorded as pneumonia, plus the latest ONS figures have not yet been incorporated into today's record.

 

[mjr]

There are ~20m more people in the UK compared to Spain and around 7m more than Italy - need to compare taking population into account ideally (and count in the exact same way).

That's debatable: "per million population" comparisons are most relevant when you think the size of population is a limiting factor in each country being compared. It's arguably misleading in the early stages of an outbreak when the illness hasn't reached all of a country.