Coronavirus outbreak

[mjr]

Interesting read highlighting the ddifference in German response to CV19
http://www.eurointelligence.com/public/
Summary : decentralized planing is better

No shoot. Sadly the UKIP/BxP policy was always Whitehall supremacy and the Conservatives adopted it, dismantling English regional government under headlines like "red tape challenge" and only giving limited powers back to a patchwork of too-small areas once there was a chance it could be Tory-controlled, such as Birmingham electing a Tory mayor

 

[fossyant]

Following on from @kingrollo post about a report in guardian from a paramedic about more people dying at home not being reported and increase use of DNR's in the community.
I've asked around the ambo's and it's happening all over the place.
Use of ROLE is now become common place on every shift.

We've already been asked about MIL - where do you want her treating ? - if she get's it, they'll make her comfy in the nursing home before she dies - that's all they can do. We did make sure the DNR was back in place a few months ago as she had revoked it when she nearly died last year - she can't remember doing that, as she want's DNR - be no point trying to bring her round in an even worse state.

 

[tom73]

We've already been asked about MIL - where do you want her treating ? - if she get's it, they'll make her comfy in the nursing home before she dies - that's all they can do. We did make sure the DNR was back in place a few months ago as she had revoked it when she nearly died last year - she can't remember doing that, as she want's DNR - be no point trying to bring her round in an even worse state.

That's how it should it's her wish and her right to do it together with your involvement.
My main worry is the increase in just using them without any one being involved in the process.
They get handed out widely enough as it is current situation has just made it a whole lot worse.

 

[Eziemnaik]

No shoot. Sadly the UKIP/BxP policy was always Whitehall supremacy and the Conservatives adopted it, dismantling English regional government under headlines like "red tape challenge" and only giving limited powers back to a patchwork of too-small areas once there was a chance it could be Tory-controlled, such as Birmingham electing a Tory mayor

It is not unique to UK, unfortunately. Seems most of Europe has been going in that direction (here in Spain, despite substantial autonomy of regional governments the response of central Gov has been very much top down - regions are complaining local experience and particularities are not taken into account). It is a theme repeating itself with FN, VOX, Liga or AFD

 

[tom73]

I've just had a chat with my manager about us making up.
Shortage of clinical masks, we have a weeks supply of the right masks.

We may need to wear them if we get it here..I'm of the opinion that will be too late.

No need to worry one call to Hancocks new order hotline and your all sorted.

 

[pawl]

Easier to exploit?

In some cases I would agree.But perhaps some of these workers aren’t afraid of hard work.I remberthere was a TV report a bought a farm in east anglia .The owner had set up residential mobile homes on his site,all mod cons.Built laundry facilities and club room.

He was asked why he didn’t employ local labour.He had advertised for workers Two responses.One alked off the job after an hour the other on didn’t return the next day not even to pick up his days wages Perhaps it has something to do with there work ethic. The same workers returned year after year
Agriculture has become increasingly mechanised but ther are some jobs that need manual labour and is not able to be achieved by the push of a button

 

[pawl]

Funny you should say that. I’ve just read a comment from a guy saying he knows of at least ten people that have applied but not even received a reply. Maybe they prefer foreign workers? Faster, more skilled?

You hit the nail on the head there Mo

 

[Andy in Germany]

It is not unique to UK, unfortunately. Seems most of Europe has been going in that direction (here in Spain, despite substantial autonomy of regional governments the response of central Gov has been very much top down - regions are complaining local experience and particularities are not taken into account). It is a theme repeating itself with FN, VOX, Liga or AFD

No idea about the other political parties, but take what the AfD say on this subject with a pinch of salt: Germany is constitutionally Federal which means the central government can't really order the 16 states to do much. In fact we've had a number of people saying it was too federal in the light of this situation, because the states had different responses.
On the other hand that's why the Saarland can work closely with Belgium and Luxembourg, because they have the autonomy to decide how they respond, and as they are a tiny state and culturally and geographically closer to the other SU states, it makes sense to work with their "foreign" neighbours.
Also, the AfD would be very happy for a British style centralised government if they were in charge: like every populist party they're very good at complaining about anything that they think will get them a vote.

 

[slowmotion]

It was clear but a few weeks ago, someone decided we were thicker than most countries and switched to the message which only mentions staying home: "stay home, protect the NHS, save lives". This mismessaging is probably literally killing people.

Here's the current Dutch message:
View attachment 515689
IIRC, they're on a trajettory closer to Germany than Italy than the UK is. This may be part, but only part.

Places like South Korea have cool videos with the three-point message, but I can't tell which is official and current.

I looked earlier in the week and the Netherlands had a quarter of UK deaths...……..and a quarter of the UK population.

 

[pawl]

I think that NHS Supply Chain deals with procurement.

https://www.supplychain.nhs.uk/about-us/

I imagine that the politicians just hand over money and don't have any hands-on involvement. I won't bother getting into an argument about whether NHS Supply Chain has been given enough money because I don't know.

Do the private sector care/nursing homes pay for there own personal protection equipment.As by definition they are profit making organisations Is it a case of the government/NHS not supplying them or the items are just not a available for them to purchase.

 

[slowmotion]

Do the private sector care/nursing homes pay for there own personal protection equipment.As by definition they are profit making organisations Is it a case of the government/NHS not supplying them or the items are just not a available for them to purchase.

I honestly don't know, I'm afraid.

 

[Andy in Germany]

I looked earlier in the week and the Netherlands had a quarter of UK deaths...……..and a quarter of the UK population.

As of today they are reporting 18.18813 deaths per 100 000 of the population and the UK reporting 19.35358 deaths per 100 000, so on the fact of it, they seem comparable.

That said, I've heard the UK is only counting hospital deaths, which would mean many are unreported.

 

[tom73]

Do the private sector care/nursing homes pay for there own personal protection equipment.As by definition they are profit making organisations Is it a case of the government/NHS not supplying them or the items are just not a available for them to purchase.

Mostly down to them in normal times. Currently the sheer volume needed has made it a national matter of supply.
Homes are still free to source what ever they can find. Some are happy to pay but can't find any or can only order small amounts that just wont last out the day.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

.

As of today they are reporting 18.18813 deaths per 100 000 of the population and the UK reporting 19.35358 deaths per 100 000, so on the fact of it, they seem comparable.

That said, I've heard the UK is only counting hospital deaths, which would mean many are unreported.

NL new cases and daily mortality looks to have stabilised earlier, so on that basis you can expect lower final figures I would guess. But that's no better informed than personal speculation.

 

[newfhouse]

one call to Hancocks new order hotline and your all sorted.

Tried it, just got music on hold. How does it feel?

View: https://youtu.be/LQaehcfXvK0