Armstrong charged and banned

[lukesdad]

I'm not sure what your point is Ld. I think super teams assist the main riders, of course. I'm saying that you don't have to be doped to win or complete or compete. Wiggins finished 4th behind 2 or 3 dopers with an unfancied, non-super team. So, yes, it's possible.

Most things are possible, what is probable is another matter.

My point is, drugs and the dopers are the symptom, money is the route cause. Remove the money and we can go back to simple cheating which, some seem to find more pallateble.

 

[Andrew_P]

"Dear USADA- we have now sent you THREE letters requesting all the relevant info in order for me to respond to your "review board" Until now there has been no response, not even an acknowledgement of receipt. The knife cuts both ways - it's time to play by the rules"

Taken from LA's Facebook https://www.facebook.com/#!/lancearmstrong

 

[Noodley]

aww diddums, poor wittle wancey...

 

[yello]

LA made the sign of the zipped-up mouth to the cameraman

17s in, he makes it then but I'm assuming that's before the chasing down. Even the commentator is pretty damning of the incident.

 

[Crackle]

If you think we're harsh on here.....

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=17452

 

[raindog]

17s in, he makes it then but I'm assuming that's before the chasing down.

cheers yello - that's a hotch-potch of the day's stage, and the bits and bobs aren't necessarily in the right order. The zipped mouth was after the chasing down in real time, almost as an explanation for his actions. It was one of the more bizarre moments of Tour history.

 

[raindog]

If you think we're harsh on here.....

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=17452

ha ha - enter The Clinic at your peril

 

[Andrew_P]

Blimey 117 pages, hope I am not expected to read all of that before contributing (not that I am going to do either!)

 

[yello]

Blimey 117 pages, hope I am not expected to read all of that before contributing (not that I am going to do either!)

I read but don't contribute as it's heavyweight stuff.

There are some very very knowledgeable people there. There's some fools too. In fact, the shoot-to-gold ratio is high but it really is worth tolerating that if you want 1st rate knowledge, comment and analysis. Some contributors are people that know Armstrong, that have ridden and/or worked with him. Others are well connected in cycling, or sports or media. As I say, unless you're a fool or really know your stuff, you really don't want to contribute.

 

[smutchin]

Surely part of what contributes to winning in any sport is establishing not just physical but psychological domination over your opponents? ... I think that for a leading rider and his team to send out the message to all other riders that they are not to be messed with establishes an advantage that is likely to be to their benefit on a later occasion and is part of what it takes to win in sport at the top level.

Like Sky in the Dauphiné, chasing down a break and then Wiggo finishing off the job by jumping across the gap? Yeah, that's magnificent. Brutal but beautiful. Love it.
(Edit: see also Lemond & Hinault on Alpe d'Huez in 1986)

The difference is that Wiggo dealing that psychological blow to Evans won't end Evans's career. In fact, it's an act that could even come back to bite him because it'll only make Evans more determined to beat him in the Tour.

d.

 

[albion]

I'm disputing that the severity of the route makes them cheat. I believe Evans and Wiggins to be clean and still do well in the TdF. Evans won it and Wiggins came 4th behind 2 or 3 dopers. So it can be done clean.

All a belief system?

"“I have never doped, and, unlike many of my accusers, I have competed as an endurance athlete for 25 years with no spike in performance, passed more than 500 drug tests and never failed one,” Armstrong said in a statement released by his publicist. “That USADA ignores this fundamental distinction and charges me instead of the admitted dopers says far more about USADA, its lack of fairness and this vendetta than it does about my guilt or innocence. Any fair consideration of these allegations has and will continue to vindicate me.”"

So in this massive doping conspiracy from 1998 to 2007 I'm still baffled as to why only Armstrong was consistent in tests and performance? I don't have a belief but there certainly ain't a lot of science involved.

 

[Zofo]

This is simply not true. Most observers believe Wiggins and Evans, to name but two, are clean. Evans would have won a few more TdFs if that was true albeit at a slightly slower pace than the cheats who did win.

Do they? Why, because they've passed the odd drugs test? LAs passed over 500 and still most think he's guilty- double standards or what. If you think Wiggos clean with his performance spike you are sadly deluded my friend.

 

[smutchin]

Wiggo's "performance spike" needs to be looked at in its proper context before you start jumping to conclusions.

d.

 

[Erratic]

Blimey, I read a bit about the Simeoni incident, certainly sounds unpleasant and probably uncumfortable to watch however, got this from wikipedia - take it as you see fit...
"Because Simeoni was a prosecution witness in legal proceedings against Ferrari at the time of Armstrong's move against him in the 2004 Tour, Italian authorities threatened to bring charges of witness intimidation against Armstrong. In March 2005 Armstrong was interviewed by the authorities, apparently without resolution. Armstrong had been indicted by Italian authorities in December 2005 and ordered to stand trial for defaming Simeoni on March 7, 2006. In April 2006, the defamation charges were dropped"

 

[Andrew_P]

Wiggo's "performance spike" needs to be looked at in its proper context before you start jumping to conclusions.

d.

To be honest I don't know enough but on that very forum with the thread about Lance Armstrong, I also read some of a thread from 2009 comparing performance spike of Contador and Wiggins, most of it was lost on me but the gist of it seemed to be trying to find out the root cause of the power to BMI spikes. The thread appeared in very specific search for Wiggins.

It would be awful to find out any of the current UK riders were tainted but to state 100% that they completely clean is a bold statement! The rewards are so huge who knows what currently cannot be found in urine and blood tests. I would imagine the anti doping tests are constantly running at least a year behind the Dr's and drug corps.