Are British Cycling & Sky being deliberately sexist?

[TheJDog]

Are women avoiding these rides because of men on the rides, or because they think they won't keep up?

Do Sky/Whotheflipever just need to stratify the rides into differing abilities, make it obvious what those levels are, and let whoever wants to join them, join them?

Or do they need to also explicitly state somewhere that these are mixed rides and demeaning and sexist behaviour won't be tolerated at all?

And try to encourage more women to be paid leaders of rides of all types?

(I tried reading the thread, and got bored at page 5 with the same arguments being repeated on both sides)

 

[GrumpyGregry]

[QUOTE 2894854, member: 1314"]I’d like to put the debate into the concept of the debates that have been happening around the gross BME under-representation in the Met; in the acting caste, and in the echelons of power in this small rock off the coast of mainland Europe.

I’m not sure whether the sense of that (old) white middle class male entitlement expressed as dismissal of any critique, as sense of persecution, and as fear of losing control is Brobdingnagian or Lilliuputian. My personal thoughts are that the old guard probably just need to pass on (harsh but true); but that in the meantime positive action can be taken until such passing on is complete.

As with BME recruitment in the Met, of course positive action should take place within BC to support greater inclusion of women in greater numbers, with the rides given exactly the same support as other rides.

Have BC got an access/equalities officer, and if not, why not? Even the supposedly macho world of the English RFU is doing great stuff with dedicated female junior rugby coaches. (Personal aggrandisement moment alert - have I mentioned I coached Brian Moore’s daughter at minis level? When she plays for England it will have been because of me.)

TC will have seen the interesting article in the Guardian today about how Black British actors are finding success in the States rather than in the UK because of the affirmative programme that occurred there 2 or 3 decades ago. (TC will find this of interest of course following the question that was posed when receiving white applicants when the JD specifically asked for Black actors, reflecting that sense of white middle class entitlement.)

innit[/quote]
Iz it coz I iz fick, innit?

 

[buggi]

Are female only rides not sexist in themselves.. What is wrong with male cyclists to warrant exclusion?

not sexist, no. Some women are embarrased about their capabilities and less inclined to join a ride with males on it for this reason. So they promote women only rides to get the women on it, in the hope they will gain confidence. Men don't have the same confidence issues so there is no need to tailor a ride in this way.

 

[saoirse50]

In a world where, riding out in Kent this past Saturday I was one of possibly 5 other women I saw riding round those hills amongst so many men I lost count, where we still witness, every road racing season, the (to my mind anyway) gross and offensive spectacle of podium girls, where major women's road racing events struggle to find sponsors despite the talent that is out there, where we were told ad nauseam in 2012 that one (male) Bradley Wiggins was the first Brit ever to win the Tour de France (still says that in Wikipedia) despite one (female) Nicole Cooke winning the women's event twice before, and another, Emma Pooley, winning it once, again before a Brit male got near winning theirs, I am just gobsmacked that some of you still question why we might need women only rides now and again. And even more gobsmacked that some of you might suggest that holding such a ride might be sexist!

The examples I have given above are merely a few showing how cycling becomes seen as something that most women don't and even shouldn't do and women who do cycle well and achieve highly are hidden. Cycling for women is perhaps swanning around on a Dutch style bike with a wicker basket on the front in a flowing skirt and blonde hair drifting in the breeze (like an old Harmony hairspray ad) and nothing more. The more women only rides around where women get to see that all kinds of women cycle, at all kinds of levels, the more level the playing field (or maybe equal the gradient) becomes between the sexes.

 

[saoirse50]

And with reference to the OP, I am a Breeze ride leader. I don't know the ins and outs of why Sky ride leaders are paid and we are not and why we have to do all our publicising etc. I am guessing it's bureaucratic minutiae rather than overt sexism. But, do you know what, in the context of the kind of stuff I printed above, in the context of my life as a woman and all the sexist rubbish I have experienced in my life both on and off the bike, well, it absolutely does FEEL sexist. Now, I don't expect some of you to even begin to understand that. But some of you will, absolutely.

 

[Leodis]

If I wear my Wiggle Honda team kit does it make me less sexist?

 

[saoirse50]

No, but that comment in this context, makes you more so.

 

[mr_cellophane]

I have read half way through this and there are so many things wrong that I can't be bothered to read the rest before replying.

I am a Skyride leader and like most of the other leaders I know, I am also a route planner Skyrides are planned to a schedule laid down, in the majority of areas, by the local authority who also provide some finance and can dictate route and dates. Breeze rides are much looser and range from 30+ miles (not many of those admittedly) to one around Epping Forest that is more of a book club with some cycling.
Many Breeze leaders are also Skyride leaders.
There are now social rides which can be organised by people with no training what so ever. These organisers, male or female, don't get paid for this either.

 

[saoirse50]

What do you mean, Breeze rides are much looser? Some of the council funded Skyrides in our borough looked pretty loose to me, if by that you mean short wanders along a traffic free cycle path.

 

[mr_cellophane]

What do you mean, Breeze rides are much looser? Some of the council funded Skyrides in our borough looked pretty loose to me, if by that you mean short wanders along a traffic free cycle path.

No I meant the Breeze champion chooses the route, start time, numbers etc. For many Skyride routes the local council chooses the route, when and how often it is run through the season. The Skyride route planner gets a level and points the route should pass and has to work out the best way from that.

 

[mr_cellophane]

I applied to be a Breeze leader but withdrew my application after learning that helmet use for leaders was mandatory.

That is not a rule that is enforced (how can it be) I know several leaders who won't wear one. It just makes it easier to enforce the rule for children.

BTW, I lead a Skyride ride up Boxhill and finished last. Beaten to the cafe by males and females

 

[saoirse50]

BTW, I lead a Skyride ride up Boxhill and finished last. Beaten to the cafe by males and females

I lead several rides every year around the Surrey Hills, Box Hill is one of the easier, earlier hills on the routes I do. I too am regularly beaten to the top of the Box and all the other hills.......not sure what relevance that has to this thread, though.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

I have read half way through this and there are so many things wrong that I can't be bothered to read the rest before replying.

I read halfway through your post and there are so many things wrong with the first sentence that I can't be bothered to read the rest before replying.

Thus badly informed and without understanding the argument you are putting forward at all I'll just say it is tosh. Complete and utter.

 

[thom]

Someone on a Pinarello scalped me over the Col de Ponte de Lambeth yesterday evening. That wasn't relevant either

Must have been a hair-raising experience though

 

[Flying Dodo]

No I meant the Breeze champion chooses the route, start time, numbers etc. For many Skyride routes the local council chooses the route, when and how often it is run through the season. The Skyride route planner gets a level and points the route should pass and has to work out the best way from that.

The Sky Ride leader I chatted to the other week (on a Sustrans ride I was running, funnily enough) said he didn't have to do any planning, and was simply emailed a list of planned rides starting at various points in the next few months and was asked which ones would he be able to lead.