Are British Cycling & Sky being deliberately sexist?

[totallyfixed]

All these discussions about Sky / BC / Breeze are all of course symptomatic of a much bigger issue, gender inequality. The wife of a friend of mine, competing in a TT told how the quickest man won a carbon TT frame and the fastest woman won a pair of shorts.
My better half doesn't do the local rides that are run by men because they can't keep up. Just adding a bit of balance .

 

[mr_cellophane]

Why all these comments about getting people to join clubs ? The point of Skyrides is to get people cycling regularly, not to get them to a level where they fell comfortable in joining a club.
BTW one female leader now runs her own club in south London for those who cycle for leisure and not to build themselves up to 13mph runs.

 

[mr_cellophane]

No idea, perhaps it was covered in a bit you couldn't be arsed to read.

I did read all the posts eventually and utter tosh most of them were

 

[srw]

I'd say a ride looking to average 13-15 mph for 30 miles is suitably defined as easy.

You're wrong. It's not. It's quite fast.

 

[StuAff]

13-15 mph is not an easy pace for most people by any means.

 

[mr_cellophane]

I'd say a ride looking to average 13-15 mph for 30 miles is suitably defined as easy (you could flip your comment and say maybe Sky ought to re-think what they call advanced, I certainly would not consider someone who struggles to ride at 13-15 mph average as advanced).

If you consider that as "Easy" what would you classify a ride of 10 miles at 8-10mph, or even a 3 mile ride around the local park at 5 mph ?

 

[Rob3rt]

You're wrong. It's not. It's quite fast.

I enjoy your conviction!

13-15 mph is not an easy pace for most people by any means.

Whilst 13-15mph may be a challenge for some people, on a spectrum of ride levels where you have anything ranging from a 13mph ride to a 22+mph chaingang, then you have to differentiate and in this case, the 13mph end of the spectrum is easy! There is no expectation that everyone will find it easy, it is simply a term used to differentiate it from other rides with a higher level of difficulty. It could equally be called "Level A" where a B, C, D ride are harder!


IME, people vastly underestimate peoples ability, including their own!

 

[Rob3rt]

If you consider that as "Easy" what would you classify a ride of 10 miles at 8-10mph, or even a 3 mile ride around the local park at 5 mph ?

The former, sub-recovery pace, an absolute crawl, the latter.... walking pace!

 

[Dusty Bin]

If you consider that as "Easy" what would you classify a ride of 10 miles at 8-10mph, or even a 3 mile ride around the local park at 5 mph ?

A walk?

 

[Spinney]

The last few posts are a fine example of what puts many people off clubs etc. I can average about 12 mph fairly comfortably, but no more, and on a long ride my average drops to nearer 10. But I've been cycling for a few years now. Anyone less fit (and most of you club cyclists would probably not describe me as cycling fit), or me after a winter with less riding, would not find 13-15 mph 'easy' , and many would not find 30 miles easy either, let alone both at once.

So, for an unfit me or people who have cycled less, to go on an 'easy' ride and fail to keep up is likely to stop them wanting to ride with a club again.

It would be far better, if people want to encourage new members, to describe rides in terms of length and speed expectations, and perhaps give letter grades.

 

[Rob3rt]

The last few posts are a fine example of what puts many people off clubs etc. I can average about 12 mph fairly comfortably, but no more, and on a long ride my average drops to nearer 10. But I've been cycling for a few years now. Anyone less fit (and most of you club cyclists would probably not describe me as cycling fit), or me after a winter with less riding, would not find 13-15 mph 'easy' , and many would not find 30 miles easy either, let alone both at once.

So, for an unfit me or people who have cycled less, to go on an 'easy' ride and fail to keep up is likely to stop them wanting to ride with a club again.

It would be far better, if people want to encourage new members, to describe rides in terms of length and speed expectations, and perhaps give letter grades.

As I said before, you can't cater for everyone, especially with limited resources. Which is why I argued that some of the people involved with Sky Ride etc might be better placed within a club allowing them to offer a more diverse ride profile, this would cater for the people a Sky Ride caters for PLUS it would offer a pathway for progression and a support network and community if people decided they wanted that. As it stands, people outgrow Sky Rides then are "on their own".

To address your last 2 points:

A) Our current system (with its flaws) seems to be doing a good job as it stands, with us being one of the largest clubs, if not the largest club in the North West, with a quickly growing membership including a near 50:50 ratio between male and female NEW members.

B) However, I accept the terms are subjective and in fact, one of the things we are doing at present is redefining these in terms of grade (0-3 is the current proposal, not that I fully agree with the new proposal on various points).

 

[Spinney]

As I said before, you can't cater for everyone, especially with limited resources.

Agreed.

B) However, I accept the terms are subjective and in fact, one of the things we are doing at present is redefining these in terms of grade (0-3 is the current proposal, not that I fully agree with the new proposal on various points).

I do think this would be helpful, as long as people understand what is involved in (say) a grade 0.
It sounds as if your club is getting enough new members. My main point was the loss of confidence involved in not being able to keep up with a ride described as 'easy', and the number grades would help with this.
It may be more of a female thing...??

 

[Rob3rt]

Agreed.

I do think this would be helpful, as long as people understand what is involved in (say) a grade 0.
It sounds as if your club is getting enough new members. My main point was the loss of confidence involved in not being able to keep up with a ride described as 'easy', and the number grades would help with this.
It may be more of a female thing...??

Our easiest ride is currently termed "Intro", not "easy" BTW, I used the word easy as a term to suggest the end of the spectrum I was referring to (of course this was a subjective term).

I have seen many people (male and female) who are essentially complete beginners (even though we aim to cater to people new to club cycling, not cycling in general) turn out to our "easy" ride which is actually termed "Intro" and complete the distance, at the pace with little to no bother. Now they may not have found it easy, it may have been a challenge, BUT they could do it. People often underestimate what people can do, especially in a group with the drafting effect and the encouragement of others.

 

[Rob3rt]

Are Sky rides and Breeze rides free to attend?

 

[Rob3rt]

Believe it or not there are people out there who have no interest in upping their average speeds or benefiting from the drafting effect - they just want to potter about on their bikes with a friendly group at 8-10 mph being sociable. I'm sure you do good work in your club Rob3rt, but I think the milieu has blinkered you a bit.

And different groups cater to them...