A question for Ordnance Survey experts

[ColinJ]

I think it's extremely unlikely to be a misprint. The maps are printed from litho plates so you'd hardly have a map if the black plate was missing.

I just looked this up in my OS Descriptive Manual (1975). Outdoor Leisure maps are based on 1:25000 mapping and neither the First nor Second Series mapping uses chevrons for gradients.

My guess is that chevrons were introduced when the 1:25000 maps became known as Explorer, and this would then filter through to the OL series.

I've no idea how the maps are printed, but I bet the elevation data used by OS is in the form of an intricate grid from which the contour lines can be calculated and plotted. I would expect the data for roads, footpaths etc. to be stored in separate 'layers' so OS could print maps with or without certain features if they wanted to. Perhaps someone forgot to include a chevron layer?

I'll do the obvious, and ask them!

I think working for OS would be a very interesting job.

As for your guess - nope! I just checked a Lake District Outdoor Leisure map from 1995 and it has the chevrons marked on it. The map I'm talking about is the only OS map I've ever seen without chevrons. (I bet that there is somewhere in the UK flat enough to not need them, but most maps have at least one steep hill on them somewhere.)

 

[MockCyclist]

As for your guess - nope! I just checked a Lake District Outdoor Leisure map from 1995 and it has the chevrons marked on it. The map I'm talking about is the only OS map I've ever seen without chevrons.

You're right. My OL English Lakes also has chevrons, and states it's compiled from 6" to a mile or 1:10000, no mention of 1:25000, despite what my book says.

(I bet that there is somewhere in the UK flat enough to not need them, but most maps have at least one steep hill on them somewhere.)

That would be where I live then. 20 miles in almost any direction and not even a contour line.

 

[al-fresco]

That would be where I live then. 20 miles in almost any direction and not even a contour line.

<gives a hard stare>

Yew ain't from around here - are yew boy?

 

[al-fresco]

I have the entire mainland UK as one huge digital Landranger map (1:50,000) but this evening I was looking at one of my old paper maps. It is a 1:25,000 map from 1983 - Outdoor Leisure 27, North Yorkshire Moors, Eastern area. (Were they really only £2.95 then!)

I am thinking of going cycling in that area in 2012 so I was looking for where the steepest road climbs are. Then it struck me - there are no chevron symbols (< and <<)anywhere on the map! It is the only one of my OS collection not to have them marking steep hills. Can somebody explain why they are missing?

OK...

Outdoor Leisure 6 - The English Lakes, South Western area 1990 has chevrons on the map and in the legend.
Outdoor Leisure 7 - The English Lakes, South Eastern area, 1989 doesn't.
Outdoor Leisure 24 - The Peak District, White Peak area 1989 does.
Ourdoor Leisure 17 - Snowdonia, Snowdon area, 1984 does.
Outdoor Leisure 18 - Snowdonia - Harlech and Bala areas 1994 doesn't.
Outdoor Leisure 30 - Yorkshire Dales Northern and Central areas 1985 does.

So it seems that some had chevrons, some didn't - but if you discover that yours is a misprint please let me know - because I have two!

 

[Arch]

As for your guess - nope! I just checked a Lake District Outdoor Leisure map from 1995 and it has the chevrons marked on it. The map I'm talking about is the only OS map I've ever seen without chevrons. (I bet that there is somewhere in the UK flat enough to not need them, but most maps have at least one steep hill on them somewhere.)

I think you are rather overestimating the amount of steep hills in the country! Ever been to the Fens?

In fact when I'm back home, I'll check the York one - it's just possible there are no chevrons on that!

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

You can buy the relevant map tiles (10km x 10km 1:25,000) for about £2.50 each (£1.89 + vat) from mapyx ( http://www.mapyx.com...ctview&pid=6635 ) so you don't need to spend very much money at all. You'd have to download their free mapping software but it works pretty well and it's free. I often print out maps at a suitable scaling and stick them in my jacket. It takes a surprisingly long time to cover £10's worth of map.

Absolutely no idea about those disappearing chevrons though...

EDIT: an alternative would be to subscribe for a month for full access to all OS maps (c £12) and work out all your routes and then cancel the sub.

 

[martint235]

My cousin works for OS, I've asked her. Will let you know.

As with a lot of the civil service, I don't think it's a great place to be working at the mo!!

 

[oldroadman]

I have a few local maps at 1:25000, which seem to be "walking" maps more than anything else, and no chevrons either. The area is hilly, so I guess they just didn't print them on, simply relied on the user seeing lots of contour lines close together and working out that it was going to be a steep bit!

 

[mcr]

I've got a 1976-vintage version of the Brecon Beacons East map (Black Mountains), based on First Series, and that has no chevrons (still has the dashed orange colouring of minor roads). So I think that suggests they were added when the mapping was 'redrawn' for the later OL editions.

 

[ColinJ]

I think you are rather overestimating the amount of steep hills in the country! Ever been to the Fens?

In fact when I'm back home, I'll check the York one - it's just possible there are no chevrons on that!

Most places that I've been to have at least one steep hill somewhere nearby.

I haven't been to anywhere near the east coast, north of London! (One reason why I was planning to head out to Scarborough and the NY Moors.)

I just had a quick scan of the Fens - it does seem pretty unlikely that there are any steep hills given that the highest elevation I could find was 3 metres!

I had a look around York and I found one 24 km from the centre, which wouldn't be on the York map. There might be one closer than that.

My cousin works for OS, I've asked her. Will let you know.

Thanks - that will save me composing an email.

As with a lot of the civil service, I don't think it's a great place to be working at the mo!!

Pity, but it's happening pretty much everywhere really. Where and when is it all going to end!

 

[martint235]

Most places that I've been to have at least one steep hill somewhere nearby.

I haven't been to anywhere near the east coast, north of London! (One reason why I was planning to head out to Scarborough and the NY Moors.)

I just had a quick scan of the Fens - it does seem pretty unlikely that there are any steep hills given that the highest elevation I could find was 3 metres!

I had a look around York and I found one 24 km from the centre, which wouldn't be on the York map. There might be one closer than that.


Thanks - that will save me composing an email.


Pity, but it's happening pretty much everywhere really. Where and when is it all going to end!

Hi Colin, unfortunately the best my cousin could come up with is that they've been using chevrons for several years. She suggested calling their Public Enquiry line on 08454560420 who will be able to give you a precise answer though.

 

[ColinJ]

Hi Colin, unfortunately the best my cousin could come up with is that they've been using chevrons for several years. She suggested calling their Public Enquiry line on 08454560420 who will be able to give you a precise answer though.

Thanks, but I'll email them instead. (I don't like paying for 0845 calls!)

 

[martint235]

Thanks, but I'll email them instead. (I don't like paying for 0845 calls!)

Fair enough. If it's the same as other Govt Depts, it'll be the same people answer the email as would the phone.

. Let us know what you find out though.

 

[Globalti]

Colin, to diverge for a second... have you ever wondered how it would be to get every single 1:50,000 map of Britain or better, every 1:25,000 map, cut off the borders and stick them all together in a huge warehouse? How big would it be in 1:25,000?

(Greetings from damp and sweaty Dar es Salaam by the way!)

 

[rodgy-dodge]

some nice roads around the Farndale Moor area. You feel like your on top of the world, So if your on the top you gotto go up to get there! some nice steep hills if thats what your into. And there's the Rosedale Chimney near Rosedale Abby