2021 Brompton C-Line Explore

[wafter]

Further; numbers have been acquired that might perhaps one day be of interest to someone...

I've measured the saddle fore/aft position with a plumb line from the leading edge of the saddle nose to the centre of the bottom bracket (as accurately as is practicable) in each of the four configurations below relating to the orientation of the clamp and saddle:

Clamp forward, saddle extreme forward (furthest forward the saddle can go): 47mm
Clamp forward, saddle extreame rearward (middling): 61mm
Clamp rearward, saddle extreme forward (middling): 77mm
Clamp rearward, saddle extreme rearward (furthest rear the saddle can go): 92mm

The numbers are somewhat arbitrary in themselves, (unless you're comparing exactly like-for-like / have this saddle on another bike and want to replicate the geometry on a Brompton); however they do give a decent idea of the range of adjustment this setup provides. With the clamp facing forwards there's between 47 and 61mm nose-BB centre distance available by sliding the saddling in clamp, while reversing the clamp so it hangs off the back of the seatpost give 77-92mm of nose-BB centre separation.

Previously I was running clamp forward, saddle rearward for 61mm.. which felt too far forward. I've since swapped it around to clamp rearward saddle forward; leap-frogging that dead-zone between 61 and 77mm (which may be irritating for anyone most comfortable within this range!) and now running the saddle at 77mm... which feels so much nicer and I no longer have to choose between my arse feeling right on the saddle and the rest of me feeling right on the bike. If I want it I have another 15mm rearward travel, but I don't think that's needed.

I've also refitted the missing rogue washer to the clamp; which at least has covered up the area damaged by the burred spring washer.

Looking forward to seeing how it pans out over tomorrow's commute

 

[Gunk]

Clamp forward, saddle extreme forward (furthest forward the saddle can go): 47mm
Clamp forward, saddle extreame rearward (middling): 61mm
Clamp rearward, saddle extreme forward (middling): 77mm
Clamp rearward, saddle extreme rearward (furthest rear the saddle can go): 92mm

F$$ing hell, you really do overthink everthing!

 

[EltonFrog]

F$$ing hell, you really do overthink everthing!

He’s a DETAIL man, I am not. All these are important if you are into detail.

When I put my Brooks on, I just threw it at the seat post and crossed me fingers.

This lack of my paying attention to detail is why I often cock things up and end up doing the job three times.

 

[Gunk]

When I put my Brooks on, I just threw it at the seat post and crossed me fingers.

That’s exactly what I did and it seems fine

 

[404 Not Found Anywhere]

The comments above about fitting phones to handlebars (I think the best place for the phone is in the bottom of the bag, preferably switched off!) reminded me of a chapter in Robert Pirsig’s Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance where the narrator‘s friend‘s expensive BMW motorcycle developed a slipping handlebar and he fixed it with a shim made out of a beer can… the friend was outraged and swapped it for a genuine BMW shim at the next dealership. Personally I like being creative and fixing problems, it makes a thing mine and gives me a feeling of having outsmarted Big Business.

 

[wafter]

F$$ing hell, you really do overthink everthing!

lol - I even left out the bit about the effect of seat tube and saddle rail angles

Aside from the obvious need to feed the OCD monster I find keeping detailed, quantitative records is of value. For example, geometry measurements (reach & stack for various bits) of bikes I own and I know fit me can help me quickly determine whether another bike will fit, and allows me to make it fit quickly and precisely..

It also helps you narrow stuff down quicker - for example I like max saddle layback on most of my bikes; so the natural things was to do the same with the Brompton. It didn't feel right and only when I tried the plumbline trick did I acknowledge that the seatpost being offset to the BB gives potentially a lot more layback than other bikes, so I had too much. Measurements give you a solid point to start from that you can tweak, rather than trying to improve on a starting point that could be anywhere..

He’s a DETAIL man, I am not. All these are important if you are into detail.

When I put my Brooks on, I just threw it at the seat post and crossed me fingers.

This lack of my paying attention to detail is why I often cock things up and end up doing the job three times.

Exactly. That said I'd probably end up doing the job three times anyway..

The comments above about fitting phones to handlebars (I think the best place for the phone is in the bottom of the bag, preferably switched off!) reminded me of a chapter in Robert Pirsig’s Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance where the narrator‘s friend‘s expensive BMW motorcycle developed a slipping handlebar and he fixed it with a shim made out of a beer can… the friend was outraged and swapped it for a genuine BMW shim at the next dealership. Personally I like being creative and fixing problems, it makes a thing mine and gives me a feeling of having outsmarted Big Business.

Absolutely - I'm all for some DIY engineering; sadly my facilities are limited so I don't have a lot of options for mounting; especially in this case given the perculiarities of the Brompton bar setup. Path of least resistance in this case is to try and use what I have / cobble something together from available parts.

All that said I will put my hand in my pocket for an off-the-shelf solution if it's clearly superior to anything I could make myself.

I agree about the phone - the mount is required for my bike computer

 

[wafter]

Another great commute this morning. I left a little later than intended but still in good time after a reasonably efficient morning routine; followed by 20 traffic-free minutes in the car and a very leisurely 45-ish minutes on the bike - taking it very steady after a last-minute mental health ride on the Fuji last night.

A very unstressed 10.9mph / 56% of max HR average saw me arrive in my least sweaty state yet

As soon as I arrive I was dispatched with a delivery to a client in the city; so that meant another little excursion on the Brompton with a few photo stops on the way back and a brief stop in the park for some spinal decompression courtesy of the adventure playground..

One of the east Oxford LTN's you've all seen subject to varying states of conflict and butchery on the news:

Cowley spacecat:

Poorly-composed rendition of the park's exquisite lushness

After the initially overwhelming experience of jumping in at the deep end I'm gradually feeling more comfortable with the setup - thanks largely today to my new legwear which affords many zipped pockets and hence removes the need to rummage through bags for immediately-required bits such as keys and phone. The new saddle position seems very amenible too

The edge has been smashed off my clothing smugness however as it's now cold and raining outside; the best my new legware can offer being the ability to dry off quickly in the absence of anything to keep the rain off in the first place.. which I guess is the next hurdle...

 

[ExBrit]

Can I ask a question about LTNs? I've never encountered one here in the States. What is the purpose? How do they work? Why are they so controversial? It looks like your photo is of a car barrier so how is there a car in the photo too? Or are you on the LTN side of the barrier?
Thanks

 

[ColinJ]

Can I ask a question about LTNs? I've never encountered one here in the States. What is the purpose? How do they work? Why are they so controversial? It looks like your photo is of a car barrier so how is there a car in the photo too? Or are you on the LTN side of the barrier?
Thanks

It is 'L' for LOW not 'N' for NO! Some city back streets get used as 'rat runs' by drivers trying to avoid the traffic on bigger roads. Obviously, residents still want to be able to get to their homes. The idea is to stop other drivers tearing down those streets rather than locals driving home. By blocking off the roads at one end the through traffic is stopped.

Some people just do not like being stopped from doing what they want to do, so if they are forced to go the long way round because their favourite shortcut is blocked they get very angry about it.

I did a ride with @GuyBoden on Saturday and he was telling me about a similar scheme being introduced somewhere in Cheshire. There was such a fuss made about it that the changes were reversed and it is back to how it was before.

I cycle round a lot of back streets in this small town and from what I see on almost every ride we could do with LTNs here. Little kids are playing in the roads on foot, on scooters, and on bikes. They do some really scary things and I think that it is only a matter of time before one of them is hit by a car. Better parental supervision would help, but if we could at least slow the traffic down then then the risks would be much reduced.

 

[ExBrit]

It is 'L' for LOW not 'N' for NO! Some city back streets get used as 'rat runs' by drivers trying to avoid the traffic on bigger roads. Obviously, residents still want to be able to get to their homes. The idea is to stop other drivers tearing down those streets rather than locals driving home. By blocking off the roads at one end the through traffic is stopped.

Some people just do not like being stopped from doing what they want to do, so if they are forced to go the long way round because their favourite shortcut is blocked they get very angry about it.

I did a ride with @GuyBoden on Saturday and he was telling me about a similar scheme being introduced somewhere in Cheshire. There was such a fuss made about it that the changes were reversed and it is back to how it was before.

I cycle round a lot of back streets in this small town and from what I see on almost every ride we could do with LTNs here. Little kids are playing in the roads on foot, on scooters, and on bikes. They do some really scary things and I think that it is only a matter of time before one of them is hit by a car. Better parental supervision would help, but if we could at least slow the traffic down then then the risks would be much reduced.

Thanks for that explanation. It make a lot of sense but I can see why it would be divisive. There are a lot of drivers who are happy to risk killing someone just to get home five minutes earlier. On both sides of the Atlantic.

 

[EltonFrog]

Another great commute this morning. I left a little later than intended but still in good time after a reasonably efficient morning routine; followed by 20 traffic-free minutes in the car and a very leisurely 45-ish minutes on the bike - taking it very steady after a last-minute mental health ride on the Fuji last night.

A very unstressed 10.9mph / 56% of max HR average saw me arrive in my least sweaty state yet

As soon as I arrive I was dispatched with a delivery to a client in the city; so that meant another little excursion on the Brompton with a few photo stops on the way back and a brief stop in the park for some spinal decompression courtesy of the adventure playground..

One of the east Oxford LTN's you've all seen subject to varying states of conflict and butchery on the news:

View attachment 697359


Cowley spacecat:

View attachment 697361


Poorly-composed rendition of the park's exquisite lushness

View attachment 697362


After the initially overwhelming experience of jumping in at the deep end I'm gradually feeling more comfortable with the setup - thanks largely today to my new legwear which affords many zipped pockets and hence removes the need to rummage through bags for immediately-required bits such as keys and phone. The new saddle position seems very amenible too

The edge has been smashed off my clothing smugness however as it's now cold and raining outside; the best my new legware can offer being the ability to dry off quickly in the absence of anything to keep the rain off in the first place.. which I guess is the next hurdle...

It seems you are enjoying your rides in the morning, long may it continue. Has to be better than being stuck in a car, I know it is for me.

The bike certainly looks the business, and I expect overtime you’ll be fine tune the commute to point of unconscious competence.

 

[FrankCrank]

It is 'L' for LOW not 'N' for NO! Some city back streets get used as 'rat runs' by drivers trying to avoid the traffic on bigger roads. Obviously, residents still want to be able to get to their homes. The idea is to stop other drivers tearing down those streets rather than locals driving home. By blocking off the roads at one end the through traffic is stopped.

Some people just do not like being stopped from doing what they want to do, so if they are forced to go the long way round because their favourite shortcut is blocked they get very angry about it.

I did a ride with @GuyBoden on Saturday and he was telling me about a similar scheme being introduced somewhere in Cheshire. There was such a fuss made about it that the changes were reversed and it is back to how it was before.

I cycle round a lot of back streets in this small town and from what I see on almost every ride we could do with LTNs here. Little kids are playing in the roads on foot, on scooters, and on bikes. They do some really scary things and I think that it is only a matter of time before one of them is hit by a car. Better parental supervision would help, but if we could at least slow the traffic down then then the risks would be much reduced.

On a recent visit to the Oxford Museum, part of the city's dark history was revealed - the infamous wall (two meters high topped with spikes) dividing the council estate from the 'posh' area. Having been born and raised on a council estate, this was particularly chilling.

 

[Gunk]

https://www.oxfordshirelive.co.uk/news/history/oxfords-cutteslowe-walls-were-divisive-6159764

 

[FrankCrank]

View attachment 697439

View attachment 697440


https://www.oxfordshirelive.co.uk/news/history/oxfords-cutteslowe-walls-were-divisive-6159764

Hard to believe such a thing could happen, and only came down a couple of years before I was born.

 

[wafter]

Can I ask a question about LTNs? I've never encountered one here in the States. What is the purpose? How do they work? Why are they so controversial? It looks like your photo is of a car barrier so how is there a car in the photo too? Or are you on the LTN side of the barrier?
Thanks

They're essentially as @ColinJ describes in principle; the idea being to discourage private motorised transport and reduce traffic in some residential areas.

While I'm all for this in theory, in practice as usual their implementation has been abysmal - routing all traffic through one or two now-highly-congested streets (so potentially increasing journey time / pollution / hazards), while doing little to incentivise alternatives as cycling infrastucture's largely a joke and public transport provision is constantly being pared back.

All they've really succeeded in doing is sowing division and conflict throughout communities; with east Oxford being one of the worst affected as the demographic is seemingly 50/50 split between yoghurt-knitting Guardian readers carrying their entire families in cargo bikes, and red-faced boomers outraged at having curtailed their entitlement to drive their chelsea tractor two minutes round the corner through a school playground to buy the Daily Mail.

Most cynically it's been engineered as yet another distraction and sadly may well marr any future consideration of similar (even if better-thought-out) programs..

It seems you are enjoying your rides in the morning, long may it continue. Has to be better than being stuck in a car, I know it is for me.

The bike certainly looks the business, and I expect overtime you’ll be fine tune the commute to point of unconscious competence.

I am by and large; ta! Likewise I enjoy driving but not under the horrible conditions imposed by getting to work entirely in the car.

A few weeks ago it'd got to the point where I was sinking a four-pack every other day, while I've not really felt the need over the past few weeks



Yesterday's ride home was uneventful if not entirely enjoyable as I was absolutely wrung out and my arse was starting to protest.

After another night of less-than ideal sleep, this morning held a certain amount of trepidation thanks to the sketchy weather forecast, cool air and water falling from the sky. I was going to wear my faithful Craghoppers lightweight trousers, however remembered that their pocket provision is less than ideal (no zips) and actually it didn't seem too bad in the 3/4 lengths so I went with these again - albeit this time with a baselayer as opposed to the usual shirt.

I think the trouser situation might mean an earlier-than-planned purchase of some more Mountain Warehouse gear; although I'd prefer to give those I've just bought a few months to ensure they're not going to fall to bits..

Kit was otherwise the same; except for the addition of some clear safety glasses to keep the flies at bay in the absence of sunglasses, and my walking waterproof bundled up inside a placcy bag; nearly maxing out the 23L capacity of the basky-bag with all its other contents.

Got up a bit earlier and left the house in good time. Car portion was unremarkable bar a bit more traffic in one spot than usual (a two-changes-wait at the lights) and I got to Yarnton in good time. It was spitting as I deployed the bike and for the first part of the ride I was a little chilly, warming up by the time I'd got to Jericho; maybe 3 miles in; by which time the rain had also eased off.

Faster than yesterday at 12.3mph and 61% of max HR - probably due to rain anxiety and the need to warm up a touch. Legs ache a bit as this is the third consecutive day of riding - both muscles (fine - shows I'm doing some work) and knees (less fine - wondering if I've got the saddle a shade high). Reached work 1:06 after leaving the house; a new record

Potentially not looking forward to the return leg as the forecase is suggesting a 70%-odd chance of rain...



In other news I finally ordered two new mudguards, some easy wheels and touch-up paint - not sure about fitting the rear guard when it arrives however as the current one is taking a hammering thanks to the uneven ground where I park the car and tiny, knackered wheels currently fitted - perhaps the bigger ones will help in this regard..