Zwift Chat

[Del C]

I think the green kit last night worked , it really stood out making it easier to see team mates in the first group , was looking for Andy but he disappeared in his camo shirt😀

Completely agree with this.

I started better last night but still not as well as I need to. The course across the desert helped to line out the group, but that meant I could draft and jump between little groups. I could see I was last of our group on the companion app, but I could also see occasional green jerseys up ahead, which gave me motivation to keep pushing forward.

Like you say Chris, once I'd made it into the lead group, I was constantly checking that everyone was still there and making sure that I held my place in the group. I think without that, I may not have made it up into the lead group at all.

It also took me a little while to work out which green shirt Andy was riding in!

 

[bridgy]

Completely agree with this.

I started better last night but still not as well as I need to. The course across the desert helped to line out the group, but that meant I could draft and jump between little groups. I could see I was last of our group on the companion app, but I could also see occasional green jerseys up ahead, which gave me motivation to keep pushing forward.

Like you say Chris, once I'd made it into the lead group, I was constantly checking that everyone was still there and making sure that I held my place in the group. I think without that, I may not have made it up into the lead group at all.

It also took me a little while to work out which green shirt Andy was riding in!

The green kit certainly made it easier to pick my own avatar out! I was mostly on my own but it was good to see @Brusgaard and @LBHIFI again towards the end of the race when the group I was in caught back up with their group which I'd got dropped from early on

 

[Whorty]

Completely agree with this.

I started better last night but still not as well as I need to. The course across the desert helped to line out the group, but that meant I could draft and jump between little groups. I could see I was last of our group on the companion app, but I could also see occasional green jerseys up ahead, which gave me motivation to keep pushing forward.

Like you say Chris, once I'd made it into the lead group, I was constantly checking that everyone was still there and making sure that I held my place in the group. I think without that, I may not have made it up into the lead group at all.

It also took me a little while to work out which green shirt Andy was riding in!

I third this - seeing the team around me was a big boost and made me smile (either that, or I was grimacing in pain, not sure!)

Just need to get my legs and lungs stronger so I can hold on longer next time

 

[Del C]

I was thinking about this last night, and I'm not sure. The climb is only 1 minute or so in length, so sprintable for most. And with the big downhill the other side, most heavy riders who can sprint and recover will get back on. The trick will be to be as far ahead in the group as possible when you hit the climb so that you have drifting space, and also so you don't get caught in any sticky drafts. As you turn left off the cobbles start to push forward, right over the bridge you need to be close to the front so that when you turn left onto the climb you're at full speed and power - then hold that for a minute - easy That first 6km or so run in to the climb is going to be manic!

This is going to be an interesting stage.

This was one of my better stages on TdZ, but I rode it 'cardio-mode' when I wasn't racing. Followed your style of steady start then staying in the pack for 3 laps. On the leg-snapper climb I just aimed to hold position, which worked well and that all meant that when I reached the base of the last climb, I had plenty in hand and gained a lot of places to the finish.

If I ride that way again, it's not going to matter how much I've got at the base of the club, as everyone else will up at the finishing line by then!

If I can ride like last night, and improve my start a little more, then I think I can stay with the group on the circuits. The leg-snapper will be interesting because I'll probably be more tired when I hit it, but I think holding position is probably the right approach again, but making sure as @kipster says to keep the power on over the top of the climb because that's where the heavier riders make you pay on the fast descent.

Then it will be all about hoping I've kept enough for the last climb.

Should be a good stage!

 

[CXRAndy]

Yup, me too. Totally cocked that up. I was feeling Ok too, getting ready for the final push when everyone started sprinting. Caught me completely off guard.


There were a lot of sandbaggers, now DQ'd, pulling that group. Had it just been C riders I think you and Chris would have stayed in the group too. On that little climb, I had to average 292 watts for 1:20 to stay in that group; nearly 4 w/kg to hold on to a C group being torn apart by B riders. Hopefully this will be fixed soon by Zwift where riders can't join the wrong cat. It makes you work hard, which is good, but it really does change the dynamics of the race

I was holding position, averaged 347W ,then I spotted a gap 3 or 4 riders in front of me appear. At that point I backed off as I was near popping and could see no point in blowing up.
I needed to be positioned further up the front to fall back through the pack but still maintain pack position. Another tactical lesson

 

[CXRAndy]

Carl just do lots of 30 second intervals 150-200% of FTP. 30secs on 30 secs off. These will build your tolerance to minute or 2 ftp+ efforts

 

[Freelanderuk]

Just started to use the workouts on Zwift and need some tips, big ring or little ring ? When they say 50 cadence is it compulsory or can I just adjust my cadence to suit my riding style, my watts seam to fluctuate rapidly and it’s showing more power less power quite a lot

 

[Whorty]

Just started to use the workouts on Zwift and need some tips, big ring or little ring ? When they say 50 cadence is it compulsory or can I just adjust my cadence to suit my riding style, my watts seam to fluctuate rapidly and it’s showing more power less power quite a lot

Still not fixed my front ring, so it's a moot point for me as I can only use big ring, but I think the general consensus is small ring at front is better.

Re cadence, the target is not compulsory (unlike the power target) so if it's too low and buggering your knees then ride to what you can. I generally ignore the too low cadence or use that time to get out the saddle and ride stood up for that section.

I also tend to create my own workouts, based on existing ones or what I've read/learned online. Not that I know what I'm doing, but I can tailor to what works for me and I enjoy this more

The trick to the power fluctuations is to try and keep the cadence smooth. The more the cadence jumps, the more the trainer tries to compensate, but because it takes a bit of time to react you end up with the power curve going up and down.

 

[CXRAndy]

Just watched Steen's video of last nights event, pretty much mirrored my experience on the 'col du saddle springs' bump

He was holding 3.9-4.2W/kg whilst the lighter riders were mid 4.5-4.9W/kg

Left in no mans land at the crest

 

[CXRAndy]

Just started to use the workouts on Zwift and need some tips, big ring or little ring ? When they say 50 cadence is it compulsory or can I just adjust my cadence to suit my riding style, my watts seam to fluctuate rapidly and it’s showing more power less power quite a lot

Chris use the little ring. The Neo is not controlled enough on the big ring- you produce too much torque and the trainer cant adjust rapidly enough to hold watts/resistance near constant. I use the inner ring and mid cassette to give the chain less wear.

But, if you find the Neo is still fluctuating keep using smaller(easier ) gearing until the software/trainer have near smooth response to you cadence variations

See here the power remains pretty constant to my various cadences on this fixed power erg session

 

[Freelanderuk]

Still not fixed my front ring, so it's a moot point for me as I can only use big ring, but I think the general consensus is small ring at front is better.

Re cadence, the target is not compulsory (unlike the power target) so if it's too low and buggering your knees then ride to what you can. I generally ignore the too low cadence or use that time to get out the saddle and ride stood up for that section.

I also tend to create my own workouts, based on existing ones or what I've read/learned online. Not that I know what I'm doing, but I can tailor to what works for me and I enjoy this more

The trick to the power fluctuations is to try and keep the cadence smooth. The more the cadence jumps, the more the trainer tries to compensate, but because it takes a bit of time to react you end up with the power curve going up and down.

Chris use the little ring. The Neo is not controlled enough on the big ring- you produce too much torque and the trainer cant adjust rapidly enough to hold watts/resistance near constant. I use the inner ring and mid cassette to give the chain less wear.

But, if you find the Neo is still fluctuating keep using smaller(easier ) gearing until the software/trainer have near smooth response to you cadence variations

Thanks Carl and Andy

 

[kipster]

App.trainerday.com (ergdb) have some good workouts, download as zwo files.and use on zwift.

 

[<Tommy>]

Just watched Steen's video of last nights event, pretty much mirrored my experience on the 'col du saddle springs' bump

He was holding 3.9-4.2W/kg whilst the lighter riders were mid 4.5-4.9W/kg

Left in no mans land at the crest

Lighter or just able to knock out a higher watt per kilo?

Sort of going back to what I was saying yesterday about race tactics and drafting. For my money it’s always better to be nearer the front. Even more so being a bigger rider approaching a lump in the road. I can’t match the lightest lightest guys who can also knock out a bit of power over a long climb. But if I’m at the back of the group at the start of a climb then I have no chance.

To be honest though it sounds like so many people were sandbagging yesterday that it probably wouldn’t of made a difference.

 

[<Tommy>]

Here's the tactics for you guys to stay out of Cat A, but at the top of Cat B @<Tommy> and @IrishAl - from a bit of detective work on all those 4w/kg Cat B's on ZP after last night's race:

- Make sure that you enter a few races regularly where you're not going to push super hard - i.e enter a race but do a recovery ride. This will keep your 90 day race power average down in B Cat levels. Then, you can unleash the full power in the races that matter to you - you will usually not be DQ'd even if you do 4.2w/kg as there's some leeway as long as you have entered your ZP assigned category.

This seems to be what a lot of the Cat B's in last night race who had 4w/kg+ were doing - whether on purpose or not!

I didn’t realise it was averaged out over 90 days. I thought it was taken from your 3 best rides over 90 days.

That seems stupidly easy to game the system.

 

[JuhaL]

Chris use the little ring. The Neo is not controlled enough on the big ring- you produce too much torque and the trainer cant adjust rapidly enough to hold watts/resistance near constant. I use the inner ring and mid cassette to give the chain less wear.

But, if you find the Neo is still fluctuating keep using smaller(easier ) gearing until the software/trainer have near smooth response to you cadence variations

See here the power remains pretty constant to my various cadences on this fixed power erg session
View attachment 506039

Generally speaking little ring is best option for workouts with any smart trainers not just Tacx Neo. Also with smart trainers is not necessary change gears at all like what might need to do with dumb trainer.