berty bassett
Legendary Member
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Just joined B cat 3R race in London at 17:10pm. I'm still officially C cat rider, but I'm hoping sitting in a B cat group will make me work harder and may even see me return a B cat w/kg result 
That, or, I'll be completely blown away 
That, or, I'll be completely blown away 
I’m hoping this is the right answer!
Ouch. That hurtJust joined B cat 3R race in London at 17:10pm. I'm still officially C cat rider, but I'm hoping sitting in a B cat group will make me work harder and may even see me return a B cat w/kg result
Managed to hold on to the lead group of A and B riders until Northumberland Avenue when all but 2 dropped me. We caught a 4th B rider up and worked together until lead Cs caught us. This was a big group until coming out of the underground when I was dropped. I worked hard to get back on and managed to suck wheels until Northumberland again where me and 2 others were dropped. We road together until the end.I came 10th in Bs out of 16 and 6th in Cs out of 20!! Still only averaged 248 watts at 3.1 w/kg, despite averaging over 300 for first 2 mins
Excellent workout though and definitely worth the effort
Still hurting this morning!!! Looking at the start to that race yesterday, I averaged 313 watts over the first 2 mins, and 342 over first 100 seconds. I normally don't push anywhere near that at the start of races, preferring to go out relatively hard to stay in lead C group, but not risk blowing up.
I will definitely be picking more B cat races (flat of course!) to help me hone the starts and to help my body learn to recover better after such brutal starts and still stay with the pack
For those interested, and I know many are
, I was 78.7kg this morning - a few more 78.x kg weigh ins this week and I'll be lowering my weight in Zwift 
Looking at the start to that race yesterday, I averaged 313 watts over the first 2 mins, and 342 over first 100 seconds. I normally don't push anywhere near that at the start of races, preferring to go out relatively hard to stay in lead C group, but not risk blowing up.I will definitely be picking more B cat races (flat of course!) to help me hone the starts and to help my body learn to recover better after such brutal starts and still stay with the pack
For those interested, and I know many are
, I was 78.7kg this morning - a few more 78.x kg weigh ins this week and I'll be lowering my weight in Zwift
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i don't see why not, but I don't think it will be a good idea. The tours rides have hundreds of riders, so loads of drafting which massively helps your speed. If you ride TT you'll have no draft benefit and I'd think lose quite a bit of time. Even a basic bike with drafting when such large ride numbers will beat a TT bike.
As Carl says, don't use a TT bike as you won't be able to draft which will be a disaster! Maybe see if you can upgrade your wheels to Zipp 808s or something?
Unless the race has separate staggered starts for different categories (like Hare & Hounds) what's the benefit of you entering B cat instead of c? Because surely if it's a mass start you can ride with whoever you can keep up with irrespective of the cat you entered in? Or am I missing something (highly possible!)Still hurting this morning!!!
I will definitely be picking more B cat races (flat of course!) to help me hone the starts and to help my body learn to recover better after such brutal starts and still stay with the pack
For those interested, and I know many are
It's about who you start with in the pens. As and Bs start together, Cs and Ds start together. Due to 'sticky draft' when you start with Cs, however hard you push you will only go as fast as other Cs (unless you can break out the sticky and latch on to the As and Bs). But when you start in an A/B pen, pushing 400 watts means I can stay with the the lead group.
As an overall race, had I started with Cs yesterday I'd probably have finished in the same position as I'd have been in the lead C group and hence would have caught the stragglers from B (i.e the guys I ended up riding with). But, I'd have done this for less effort (a lot more Cs to wheel suck and not having to go into the red early on to stick with the lead As and Bs).
So, within that race, no advantage of starting with Bs on my end result, but from a work out perspective much harder as I had to burn a lot more matches early on and then work very hard later to stick with the lead Cs.
Probably worth saying, I've never even seen the lead A/B group before when I've started in the C/D pen.
If it was a mass start, all in one pen, then zero benefits of selecting a higher cat
JuhaL
Guru
Regular road bike is probably better option than TT bike because of drafting. I have always think how much in a mass start you pay penalty because of sticky draft when you ride normal road bike vs. TT bike which dont have sticky draft problems. I guess the draft benefits weight’s more in scale than sticky draft issues with road bike. Just thinkin how easily sticky draft suck you in and keep you there long time if you dont have energy enough to sprint away from that situation.
Yes, you're right - the 'sticky' effect at the start of a race out the pens can almost dictate where you finish the race as you can lose the faster groups in the first few 100 metres and never see them again. I think this is why some people join the pens early for races, so that they are at the front of the pen and hence less likely to be caught in a slower riders 'stickiness'!
JuhaL
Guru
Maybe i will, then i send email to American Pickers i have something what you don’t wanna miss. I try to make more money with thatPah ... i've raced up the Alpe twice this week, plus a little jaunt up a 20km climb on BRVR ..... I'm such a heroIf anyone wants my signed photo, drop me a PM
Ah OK, that's what I was missing then - despite doing loads of races I didn't really notice the start groups were split between A/Bs and C/Ds (I'm not very observant!), so I can see your logic nowIt's about who you start with in the pens. As and Bs start together, Cs and Ds start together. Due to 'sticky draft' when you start with Cs, however hard you push you will only go as fast as other Cs (unless you can break out the sticky and latch on to the As and Bs). But when you start in an A/B pen, pushing 400 watts means I can stay with the the lead group.
As an overall race, had I started with Cs yesterday I'd probably have finished in the same position as I'd have been in the lead C group and hence would have caught the stragglers from B (i.e the guys I ended up riding with). But, I'd have done this for less effort (a lot more Cs to wheel suck and not having to go into the red early on to stick with the lead As and Bs).
So, within that race, no advantage of starting with Bs on my end result, but from a work out perspective much harder as I had to burn a lot more matches early on and then work very hard later to stick with the lead Cs.
Probably worth saying, I've never even seen the lead A/B group before when I've started in the C/D pen.
If it was a mass start, all in one pen, then zero benefits of selecting a higher cat
mjd1988
Guru
In my nerdier moments watching a youtube zwift race (i know) I've noticed this - they tend to join the big races 20 or 30 minutes early for this exact reason
