Women's Cycling

[Postmanhat]

Very interesting debate. Have recently been going through my accreditation at Derby velodrome, Seven sessions so far, probably at least a hundred different riders in those, two of which were women. The occasional women-only sessions are though, quite well attended I believe

Safety isn't a gender-specific issue on the track, as it's a sterile environment, equally dangerous for everyone. And the role model imbalance doesn't apply as there are arguably more famous female track cyclists now, who get loads of media coverage.

Maybe a lot of women just don't like riding with men for some of the reasons mentioned above, and/or prefer the company of women. In which case, segregation probably is the only answer?

 

[classic33]

I do keep seeing the idea that women don't cycle because they think it's dangerous. Maybe that's not it. Maybe it's because they know it's dangerous. I'd say there are maybe 25% women cyclists in London, yet they are dying at a rate of 5:2. If cycling is 10 times as dangerous for woman as for men, maybe not cycling is a sensible, life saving decision.

You've been listening to Radio 2 & want to live to 150!

 

[Julia9054]

I do keep seeing the idea that women don't cycle because they think it's dangerous. Maybe that's not it. Maybe it's because they know it's dangerous. I'd say there are maybe 25% women cyclists in London, yet they are dying at a rate of 5:2. If cycling is 10 times as dangerous for woman as for men, maybe not cycling is a sensible, life saving decision.

That is London. I wouldn't cycle there - or drive for that matter!
Anecdotally, I have noticed an increase in women on my commute in the 3 years I have been doing it and middle aged couples cycling together at weekends seems to be a thing too.
When I cycle with female friends, there does seem to be a lot of cake and talking which I enjoy occasionally but I'm a bit more of a Lone Ranger normally.

 

[jefmcg]

They are really frightening stats @jefmcg Do you have any insight or links to why this is the case. I must admit I would be wary of cycling in real built up areas, at least until i was more confident, I would definitely look to use off road cycle ways. Around the quite roads of north wales I am quite happy to stand my ground on the roads. Today I made a white van man wait behind me on a single track lane, uphill, until I got to a gate way. Fair play to the driver, he could see I peddled quicker and was very patient

I was going to say those figures are an anomaly, but when I googled I found that things might be even worse. It was only 1 women of the 14 deaths last year, but maybe that's the anomaly. In 2009, it was 10 women and 3 men.

Then there is this ...

http://icycleliverpool.co.uk/2013/02/18/the-ladykiller/

In 14 years there have been 14 people killed in one small circular area of central London. It is a tragedy to be sure, but not exceptional in itself, that is until you notice that it is only women who have been killed in that area, not a single man.

(even if you extend the circle, the number of women - blue - is way out of proportion with the numbers on the roads)

All but one of these was caused by a HGV or bus.

Here is an illustration of a HGV blind spot. It's nearly exactly the same shape as the ASL and approach lane for bikes at most London intersections.

One theory is that women sit meekly in these, obliviously in the blind spot of a lorry, while men dart ahead - running red lights, or just racing off as soon as they change. Personally I make active eye contact (up to and including a wave and/or a nod) if I am not absolutely sure the driver has seen me, and I might be in danger if he (it's invariably a he) hasn't.

 

[jefmcg]

You've been listening to Radio 2 & want to live to 150!

I've never consciously listened to Radio 2, and I have no idea of what you are talking about.

 

[jefmcg]

Serious logistics question. If women ride the same distance as the men's cycling race, won't the pee stops be a bit tricky? It's not like ladies can just turn their backs and whip it out.

http://www.wheelsuckers.co.uk/page/toilet-stops

OK, I know this is trolling, but the only time I've suffered from penis envy was while watching the boats waiting for the start of the men's eights head of the river. Crew member (@Fnaar) after crew member stood up in the boats and had a sneaky wizz. When in a women's eight, there is nothing to do but concentrate and hold on and hope.

Of course, needing a pee focuses the mind and probably improves your rowing, but there is so much unpredictable waiting in a head race that's not something that could be used safely to your advantage.

 

[classic33]

I've never consciously listened to Radio 2, and I have no idea of what you are talking about.

Piece on yesterday saying what you said, almost word for word.

 

[jefmcg]

Piece on yesterday saying what you said, almost word for word.

Oh dear. That is a worry. Is radio 2 the station for dull middle age people to listen to the music of their youth? Are you sure it wasn't radio 4? I wouldn't mind sharing ideas with Melvyn Bragg.

 

[Yazzoo]

Thanks all for your input, really interesting to see everyone's opinions!

 

[steveindenmark]

Jefmcg. You said this "All but one of these was caused by a HGV or bus."

Did you mean to say " All of these involved a HGV or bus?" To say "Caused by" implies that all the HGV or bus drivers have been to court and convicted of an offence. I would like to know if that is the case.

If that is not the case, some of these accidents could have been caused by a cyclist.

 

[theclaud]

Jefmcg. You said this "All but one of these was caused by a HGV or bus."

Did you mean to say " All of these involved a HGV or bus?" To say "Caused by" implies that all the HGV or bus drivers have been to court and convicted of an offence. I would like to know if that is the case.

If that is not the case, some of these accidents could have been caused by a cyclist.

Being hit by the HGV/bus was what caused them to die. It's not difficult.

 

[Simpleton]

I was going to say those figures are an anomaly, but when I googled I found that things might be even worse. It was only 1 women of the 14 deaths last year, but maybe that's the anomaly. In 2009, it was 10 women and 3 men.

Then there is this ...

http://icycleliverpool.co.uk/2013/02/18/the-ladykiller/

(even if you extend the circle, the number of women - blue - is way out of proportion with the numbers on the roads)

All but one of these was caused by a HGV or bus.

Here is an illustration of a HGV blind spot. It's nearly exactly the same shape as the ASL and approach lane for bikes at most London intersections.

One theory is that women sit meekly in these, obliviously in the blind spot of a lorry, while men dart ahead - running red lights, or just racing off as soon as they change. Personally I make active eye contact (up to and including a wave and/or a nod) if I am not absolutely sure the driver has seen me, and I might be in danger if he (it's invariably a he) hasn't.

There's no blind spots in the above pic. Don't get sucked into the bullshit that the FHA, TfL and the met are coming out with.

 

[Simpleton]

Jefmcg. You said this "All but one of these was caused by a HGV or bus."

Did you mean to say " All of these involved a HGV or bus?" To say "Caused by" implies that all the HGV or bus drivers have been to court and convicted of an offence. I would like to know if that is the case.

If that is not the case, some of these accidents could have been caused by a cyclist.

Yeah, like a cyclist would deliberately go and get themselves run over. You are reminded of the case of Putz, the other guy who had killed someone up in Notting hill. And that farking piece of garbage who only pleaded guilty when it came out in court his previous driving convictions would be disclosed who killed a cyclist near Kings x.

And please do me the courtesy of not responding with the caveat of ''I said they could...'' I know what you are implying and you are bang out of order.

 

[jefmcg]

Jefmcg. You said this "All but one of these was caused by a HGV or bus."

Did you mean to say " All of these involved a HGV or bus?" To say "Caused by" implies that all the HGV or bus drivers have been to court and convicted of an offence. I would like to know if that is the case.

If that is not the case, some of these accidents could have been caused by a cyclist.

The collisions may have been caused by the driver of the vehicle, or the cyclist, or some combination or a freak event that involved neither being at fault.

The deaths however, were caused by the vehicles. If you are crushed under a 50 tonne lorry, then the cause of death will be injuries caused when you were crushed under a 50 tonne lorry. How you came to be under that lorry is a separate issue.

 

[jefmcg]

Being hit by the HGV/bus was what caused them to die. It's not difficult.

as usual, @theclaud is there quicker and more succinctly