Why can't I just do it - Lawyer's lips drive me mad!

[Brandane]

What is it that makes you feel a thru-axle is inconvenient?

I feel the same about LL. I'm struggling to understand the massive inconvenience some folk find these.

The one inconvenience on the one bike I have with thru-axles is that, on mine at least, the front and rear require different sized allen keys to loosen them. The rear is 8mm and front 6mm (?? I think, without going to check). Whatever size the rear is, the allen key is not of a size included on any multi-tool I have. So I need to carry that size over and above the multi-tool, in case it is needed.
Not massively inconvenient, I agree. But then, neither are LL's..

 

[brommieinkorea]

All very well, however when someone new to cycling sees a 'regular cyclist' twiddling the quick-release around to loosen it a couple of turns to enable the wheel to be released they may copy this motion thinking that's the way to fasten it and never know there is a cam which needs tightening. Many years ago at a time-trial venue I saw someone do just that (twiddle the QR, not use the cam). I felt obliged to speak to him and when I lifted his bike and brought my hand down on the top of the wheel it fell off -this was, of course before lawyers lips. He was pretty shocked and thanked me for advice on how to correctly tighten it. A loose wheel (even if there are lawyers lips) could cause a bad crash.

Every bike shop I've been to in the last 20 years has had a policy of explaining to anyone purchasing a bike how a quick release works. So, it would seem even rookies should know. Also I've seen lots of people with the quick release undone who didn't crash. Luck maybe ? Oh, additionally if you don't tighten the wheel either by using the lever or twiddling, the wheel isn't retained at all even with lawyers lips. And if you roll on a bike with lawyers lips and an unsecured skewer it still moves, enough that if you have rim brakes that tire is gonna hit the brake blocks.....with predictable results.

 

[Andy in Germany]

I must have changed hundreds of tyres and removed hundreds of wheels and I never had a problem; I'd noticed Lawyer's lips, of course, but never knew what they were called.

 

[the_mikey]

What is it that makes you feel a thru-axle is inconvenient?

I feel the same about LL. I'm struggling to understand the massive inconvenience some folk find these.

Personally, I've not been very inconvenienced by Thru Axles, but comparing QR skewers with Thru-Axles, the QR skewer has a distinct convenience factor in terms of time taken to release and refit a wheel vs the assured security of thru axles.

 

[Dogtrousers]

I've never been really convinced by QRs. For many years I rode a bike with wheel nuts. Yes I had to carry a dumbell spanner and removing the wheel took slightly longer. Not whole minutes longer, but a bit. But how often do I remove wheels? Not very often. And how often do I remove wheels in a hurry? Pretty much never.

Some people transport bikes by car, and are forever popping the wheels on and off. Some people race, and time is of the essence. I don't do either of those things.

QRs are handy, but I could easily live without them.

 

[andrew_s]

Incidentally, a friend of mine has had a crash caused by the front wheel falling off. He's actually a really clever guy and embarrassingly enough for him, an engineer.

How on earth did the front wheel "Fall off"?

Braking hard with a front disc brake will do it.
Front disc pads are generally positioned so that the reaction force tries to lever the front wheel out of the dropouts. This force is deceleration force x wheel diameter / disc diameter, so if you decelerate at 0.5g (generally about as hard as you can), that can be double your bodyweight trying to pull the axle out, and it will succeed if there are no lawyer lips and your QR isn't properly tight.

It happened to a friend of mine, mid tour in France. No injury, but the forks got bent enough to be unusable when the dropouts hit the road, which was a bit of a faff.

Don't file the lawyer lips off if you've a front disc brake.

 

[Fastpedaller]

Braking hard with a front disc brake will do it.
Front disc pads are generally positioned so that the reaction force tries to lever the front wheel out of the dropouts. This force is deceleration force x wheel diameter / disc diameter, so if you decelerate at 0.5g (generally about as hard as you can), that can be double your bodyweight trying to pull the axle out, and it will succeed if there are no lawyer lips and your QR isn't properly tight.

It happened to a friend of mine, mid tour in France. No injury, but the forks got bent enough to be unusable when the dropouts hit the road, which was a bit of a faff.

Don't file the lawyer lips off if you've a front disc brake.

Good advice - I'd also add don't do it with any bike using external cam QR's, only ones with internal cams

 

[mickle]

For the record, of my bikes new enough to have them, all but the very newest/poshest one has had the lawyer tabs removed by me. And i never turn my bikes upside down.