Where's Cav Going?

[martint235]

Am I the only one who doesn't want him to go to Sky? As others have probably said, it's going to be difficult to estsblish who's team leader. Wiggins, Cav, or Chris Froome (after the Vuelta)? Personally I think it would be great if Cav went to QuickStep as Boonen seems to be a spent force (relatively speaking), and he'd be a constant irritant to Mr Brailsford's masterplan. Not that I have anything against Dave or Sky, I just find drama and conflict more entertaining than a watching a well-oiled machine!

No I don't think Sky is a good place for him either. I still think it would be difficult for Sky to field 9 riders that can target two GT jerseys. For Cav you need a lead out train of I'd say 4, now two of those can be riders that are generally strong and support a GC jersey bid on non-sprint days but even then the numbers don't add up to me.

I'd like him to go to Rabobank and rejoin Renshaw. I've seen a couple of interviews with Renshaw since the announcement and all he's said is "Next year will be interesting". All Cav has had to say really is a quote from ToB "I hope he likes coming second" or words to that effect. Maybe it's just me but I'd be quite please and amused if he went there.

 

[downfader]

Am I the only one who doesn't want him to go to Sky? As others have probably said, it's going to be difficult to estsblish who's team leader. Wiggins, Cav, or Chris Froome (after the Vuelta)? Personally I think it would be great if Cav went to QuickStep as Boonen seems to be a spent force (relatively speaking), and he'd be a constant irritant to Mr Brailsford's masterplan. Not that I have anything against Dave or Sky, I just find drama and conflict more entertaining than a watching a well-oiled machine!

*COUGH!!* Europcar *COUGH!!*

 

[brockers]

Oh! I see...Nudge, nudge. Say no more, say no more... My finger is well and truly off the pulse!

 

[RecordAceFromNew]

Am I the only one who doesn't want him to go to Sky? As others have probably said, it's going to be difficult to estsblish who's team leader. Wiggins, Cav, or Chris Froome (after the Vuelta)? Personally I think it would be great if Cav went to QuickStep as Boonen seems to be a spent force (relatively speaking), and he'd be a constant irritant to Mr Brailsford's masterplan. Not that I have anything against Dave or Sky, I just find drama and conflict more entertaining than a watching a well-oiled machine!

Sky a well oiled machine?

I hope I am wrong, but if Cav is going there then presumably Sky wants next year's Tdf green jersey, and if that is the case why is Wiggins saying "it might be all about Cav and winning the green jersey, in which case I don't go to the Tour"? Who in Sky is as good a lead out man as Renshaw, and who in Sky is as good a time trialist as Martin?

Imho the fundamental reason why htc Highroad is the most successful pro cycling team in the world is not because they have Cav, but because they know how to pull strong riders together all willing to park their own ego for the team's purpose, thereby dominating the battles they choose with near clockwork predictability - like a well oiled machine. To me that, such as the htc train in full flight, is a pure joy to watch.

 

[brockers]

^^^^ In a strange way, that was what I meant!!

 

[Intelligenthamster]

I agree with Brockers, no disrespect to Cav but I would love to see Wiggins and / or Froome do really well and can't help feeling his presence in the team might hinder that if everyone is looking after Cav the whole time. Geraint Thomas is blossoming into a good rider and I'd like to see him developing more.

It *might* be possible for Sky to have it both ways if the GC contenders take priority in TTs and mountains.

Well done to the GB team today!

 

[HLaB]

I agree with Brockers, no disrespect to Cav but I would love to see Wiggins and / or Froome do really well and can't help feeling his presence in the team might hinder that if everyone is looking after Cav the whole time. Geraint Thomas is blossoming into a good rider and I'd like to see him developing more.

It *might* be possible for Sky to have it both ways if the GC contenders take priority in TTs and mountains.

Well done to the GB team today!

I was thinking similar after todays race, I don't know where Wiggins, Froome and Geraint finished but I wonder if would have been closer to the front without having had to look after Cav and is that a sign of things to come ?

 

[rich p]

I was thinking similar after todays race, I don't know where Wiggins, Froome and Geraint finished but I wonder if would have been closer to the front without having had to look after Cav and is that a sign of things to come ?

They would or could have been nearer the front but they wouldn't have won, which is the point. It's a team game and for any of the others to do better they would still have needed leading out and protecting by someone and Cav had the best (only?) chance of a GB win.

That's not to say that the same would apply in a GT though and therein lies the dilemma.

 

[dellzeqq]

Sky would clearly want Cavendish, as he's a much better bet for a jersey than either Wiggins or Froome, but, as Tall Martin says, Sky are simply not able to compete for two jerseys. If Cavendish does go to Sky then Wiggins will content himself with the time trials and being third or fourth man in the lead-out.

 

[PpPete]

If Cavendish does go to Sky then Wiggins will content himself with the time trials and being third or fourth man in the lead-out.

Would he though ?
Depending on how quickly the tour reaches the mountains in 2012, Wiggins could have a crack at getting an early yellow jersey? If it works out all well & good, if not then he gets off and finishes up preparation for the Olympic TT ?

 

[dellzeqq]

I don't see how that would work, Pete. Cavendish would be hoping to get two or more stage wins before the mountains and two or more after. My thought is that the team that pays him millions will move heaven and earth to ensure that he does get those wins, which means talented riders burying themselves in pursuit of escapes and, at the very least, maintaining a high tempo for the last 40km or so.

All of which can be done if you have the talent, and Sky could, we presume, afford the talent. But, looking at 2011's GC results it's clear that HTC were a team with one purpose only - their top GC rider came 19th and there were four HTC riders in the last twenty.

You have to go back to the 'halcyon' days of Team Telekom (forerunners of HTC?) to find a team capable of winning the green and mounting a serious challenge for the yellow. Is this possible without 'help'? And is Wiggins a serious GC contender?

Maybe you're right, and maybe Sky will simply hoover up the riders they need to accomplish the job, but it would have to be one heck of a line-up

 

[Tompy]

I was thinking similar after todays race, I don't know where Wiggins, Froome and Geraint finished but I wonder if would have been closer to the front without having had to look after Cav and is that a sign of things to come ?

What a ridiculous comment. Have you totally missed the point of the World Championships and the way they work?


Cav is going to Sky - trust me - it was confirmed to me by a very reputable source in June at the British Nationals.

In a grand tour, GC riders generally need one or two domestiques in the mountains. That leaves 5 or 6 riders able to chase down breaks for a sprinter. Cav doesn't need a lead-out train to win bunchies, look at yesterday's race.

I'm not saying it will definitely work out, but Team Sky do not just hoover up talented riders without considering how they will fit into the team - give them some credit.

Oh and just a wee claim to fame but if you saw the race yesterday, the large Union Jack being waved near the finish line (and visible in many of the photos of the race) was held by yours truly. :-)

 

[HLaB]

What a ridiculous comment. Have you totally missed the point of the World Championships and the way they work?


Cav is going to Sky - trust me - it was confirmed to me by a very reputable source in June at the British Nationals.

In a grand tour, GC riders generally need one or two domestiques in the mountains. That leaves 5 or 6 riders able to chase down breaks for a sprinter. Cav doesn't need a lead-out train to win bunchies, look at yesterday's race.

I'm not saying it will definitely work out, but Team Sky do not just hoover up talented riders without considering how they will fit into the team - give them some credit.

Oh and just a wee claim to fame but if you saw the race yesterday, the large Union Jack being waved near the finish line (and visible in many of the photos of the race) was held by yours truly. :-)

I know its a team game but Cav going to Sky IMO will change the team balance, Wiggins et al. will only become super domestiques and not able to challenge for the GC, only time will tell but thats MO and I'd like to be wrong. As to the flag

 

[martint235]

In a grand tour, GC riders generally need one or two domestiques in the mountains. That leaves 5 or 6 riders able to chase down breaks for a sprinter. Cav doesn't need a lead-out train to win bunchies, look at yesterday's race.

I agree that Cav can probably survive without a lead out train but given the way the points are decided in the TdF now, I still can't see how a team of 9 riders can go for overall GC and the green jersey. On a flat day you need to chase down the breakaways before the intermediate sprint and again before the end, now in the first week this is quite easy () but flash forward a week or so and with Wiggins defending the yellow jersey, are Sky really going to put that much effort into chasing down a break? And if they aren't it kind of negates Cav's presence, sure he'll still win lots of stages but not the green jersey.

 

[Tompy]

Well if they're chasing down a break they can put their GC man on Cav's wheel. He'll get a tow to the last 3km and keep him at the front of the race out of trouble. Easy.

Evans won this year without many riders around him in the mountains. That used to be the norm. The phenomenon of a whole team working for their GC rider even on mountain stages is from the Armstrong era. Look to Bruyneel trying that next year with Schleck.

Before Larry Armstrong, teams didn't do that although admittedly Team Sky did adopt this same tactic in this year's Dauphine to stifle attacks against Wiggins in the mountains.