The Football.....

[thom]

My last word: one of the things a referee is there to do is apply his discretion. To interpret the letter of the law so as to enforce the spirit of the law. What Nani did last night was in no way contrary to the spirit of football, and there's no way he should have been made to leave.

The problem is that cliched notion of consistency of refereeing, allowing players a well defined idea of the consequences to bad challenges or types of play. My impression is that no commentator, spectator or player was expecting Nani to get anything but a yellow card. European games are different in interpretation of the laws to the PL but not so different.
There was no nastiness in the game to that point, the ref did not need to take the players in hand for persistent abuses of discipline. The tackle did not badly injure the player. It was clear how Nani would challenge for the ball, yet the Madrid player did not feel endangered personally and that he ought to avoid it. Clearly this happened in the Man U half and the Madrid player cannot say he felt it necessary to risk harm to prevent a goal opportunity.

Refs make mistakes in good faith and ought not be castigated for it but for CL games and higher, discretion is very often the most important thing. Man U were showing how to beat a very good Real Madrid team, they were tactically superior and Mourinho was out thought to that point. We'll never know how that game would have resolved itself had Nani remained on the pitch. The CL lost something of it's spectacle as a result.

 

[green1]

It was hardly

Was it?

I'm erring on the side of a very VERY harsh red. Eight times out of ten in the PL it would have got a yellow at the most.

Yes it was, exactly the same sort of challenge. Compare the body positions of Nani & De Jong in those 2 challenges, almost the same only difference was Alonso got hit square in the chest were as Arbeloa was hit in his side. Only reason why De Jong got away with his is that it was a British ref, if it was a European ref he would have walked as well.

 

[Doseone]

...... Man U were showing how to beat a very good Real Madrid team, they were tactically superior and Mourinho was out thought to that point. We'll never know how that game would have resolved itself had Nani remained on the pitch. The CL lost something of it's spectacle as a result.

Well put, agree 100%.

 

[MarkF]

How many of you who are saying it was red card can honestly hand on heart say that when you saw the incident you immediately thought "that's a red"?

I thought, "That might be a red" and my lad said, excitedly, whilst Nani was rolling around cheating, "He might get a red". Like I said before, using the laws of the game I believe he went past a yellow card and towards a red one, leaving the final decision to the referees interpretation. Nani gave him the "opportunity" to produce a red and he can have no complaints.

I coach a team and if my player had have been fouled like that, I'd have be screaming for a red card and h.o.p.i.n.g to get one.

 

[green1]

How many of you who are saying it was red card can honestly hand on heart say that when you saw the incident you immediately thought "that's a red"?

I immediately thought he was in trouble and wasn't in the least bit surprised. If I'm honest I did a little jig and started pissing my self laughing when fergie took half an hour to get down 3 or 4 steps to go whine at the 4th official.

 

[MarkF]

The CL lost something of it's spectacle as a result.

I love football, for me Nani's getting sent off and Fergie having a tantrum, was the "spectacle", it enlivened what was a regular decent game. Come on, we all like controversy in footie............surely?

Just watched it again, first time since the game. I've changed my opinion slightly, it's a definite red card.

 

[thom]

Compare the body positions of Nani & De Jong in those 2 challenges, almost the same only difference was Alonso got hit square in the chest were as Arbeloa was hit in his side.

Quite different in my opinion :

The bent leg makes this much less dangerous in terms of the potential force going to Arbeloa and Nani's foot is nowhere near to Arbeloa's face.

 

[green1]

The bent leg makes this much less dangerous in terms of the potential force going to Arbeloa and Nani's foot is nowhere near to Arbeloa's face.

So you agree it's dangerous then? Dangerous play = Red card

What's his foot doing up there?

SMIDSY anyone?

 

[dan_bo]

Yes it was, exactly the same sort of challenge. Compare the body positions of Nani & De Jong in those 2 challenges, almost the same only difference was Alonso got hit square in the chest were as Arbeloa was hit in his side. Only reason why De Jong got away with his is that it was a British ref, if it was a European ref he would have walked as well.

No it wasnt don't be silly.

In the incedent above, De Jong was planted and sunk his foot into Alonso's chest. In last night's incedent BOTH players were travelling fast and there was very little contact, and the players were travelling almost perpendicular to each other. Also, De Jong above isn't even looking at the ball. Nani did nothing but.

 

[thom]

So you agree it's dangerous then? Dangerous play = Red card

What's his foot doing up there?

SMIDSY anyone?

I don't think it was dangerous as it happens. His foot is very close to controlling the ball and preventing it running away from him. The point is, I disagree with your claim that the challenge was similar to the de Jongh one. It wasn't.

 

[Fnaar]

Shouldn't have been a red card, imho. Accidental, yes foot was raised, but... going for ball

 

[green1]

I actually thought Arbeloa did well last night, because if I'd been in his position I'd have seen red for kicking the shoot of of Nani while he was lying on the ground feigning injury (as I would have in Alonso's position after the De Jong assault). He knew he was in trouble, it's amazing how quickly his limp disappeared after the card came out.

 

[dan_bo]

Shouldn't have been a red card, imho. Accidental, yes foot was raised, but... going for ball

You OK Fnarr?

Nothing smutty in that post....

 

[green1]

No it wasnt don't be silly.

In the incedent above, De Jong was planted and sunk his foot into Alonso's chest. In last night's incedent BOTH players were travelling fast and there was very little contact, and the players were travelling almost perpendicular to each other. Also, De Jong above isn't even looking at the ball. Nani did nothing but.

Okay lets look at them. Both feet in the air, one foot chest high with studs up, foot in opposing players torso... Yeah you right they are nothing alike.

 

[Hacienda71]

I'm going tell my son never to control the ball with his feet more than a foot or so of the ground when he plays in case he gets sent off. Perish the thought if he attempts an overhead kick I am too old to change my ways and will keep doing it, we were hard in the seventies when I learn't how to play. I will just have to risk a red card.