The CycleChat Helmet Debate Thread

[glasgowcyclist]

I see the transport minister has said that helmet wearing should remain a matter of free choice.

http://road.cc/content/news/166714-...e-whether-wear-helmet-says-transport-minister

GC

 

[glasgowcyclist]

[QUOTE 3938195, member: 259"]A government minister's made a promise? [/QUOTE]

I don't think he went quite that far!

GC

 

[Justinslow]

One of our club's riders had a bad crash back in the spring where on a "chain" ride the rider in front went down and he had nowhere to go and went over the top. He landed on his head and was knocked out for a time and spent some time in hospital after, all the other riders and those that stopped to help are adamant his helmet saved his life.

 

[winjim]

Oh thank Christ. I've been thinking far too much about helmet testing standards and the laws of physics. Now I can just step back and enjoy the shitstorm that's about to ensue.

 

[Profpointy]

One of our club's riders had a bad crash back in the spring where on a "chain" ride the rider in front went down and he had nowhere to go and went over the top. He landed on his head and was knocked out for a time and spent some time in hospital after, all the other riders and those that stopped to help are adamant his helmet saved his life.

may well have done - presumably balancing out one of the near-miss-becoming a hit or broken necks.

being quite serious by the way - given on balance / average they don't seem to help on a population level the good and bad presumably balances out

 

[ufkacbln]

One could also argue that the choice to ride too close to the other cyclists and leave no room to respond to a fall or rapid deviation from course was the real issue


Which is a major point....

Should you rely on a plastic hat to "save you" when the accident could be prevented?

In an industry this incident would result in prosecution

 

[Profpointy]

I don't think he went quite that far!

GC

One could also argue that the choice to ride too close to the other cyclists and leave no room to respond to a fall or rapid deviation from course was the real issue


Which is a major point....

Should you rely on a plastic hat to "save you" when the accident could be prevented?

In an industry this incident would result in prosecution

I rather think that is a "false choice" . The question is plastic hat or bare headed, not accident versus safety.

I'm in the bare headed camp by the way as the befefits seem marginal on average - for whatever combination of reasons

That said, the hat gang do seem to a have a.lot of accidents

 

[theclaud]

the hat gang do seem to a have a.lot of accidents

If it weren't unnecessarily provocative in the forum context I'd have this as a sig.

 

[ufkacbln]

I rather think that is a "false choice" . The question is plastic hat or bare headed, not accident versus safety.

I'm in the bare headed camp by the way as the befefits seem marginal on average - for whatever combination of reasons

That said, the hat gang do seem to a have a.lot of accidents

Not false at all

In this instance, riding in a responsible, sensible and safe way could have prevented the accident....

 

[Profpointy]

Not false at all

In this instance, riding in a responsible, sensible and safe way could have prevented the accident....

It's a reason to ride sensibly or at least more skilfully , helmeted or otherwise.

It isn't a reason to not wear a helmet though is it? After all there are plenty of reasons for choosing not to

 

[ufkacbln]

It's a reason to ride sensibly or at least more skilfully , helmeted or otherwise.

It isn't a reason to not wear a helmet though is it? After all there are plenty of reasons for choosing not to

It is however a reason to remove the need to wear a helmet

The approach in every other walk of life is to make the activity safe, reduce the risks and only if these cannot be reduced is the possibility of using protective equipment

Yet it appears here that all that could be ignored

 

[Justinslow]

It is however a reason to remove the need to wear a helmet

The approach in every other walk of life is to make the activity safe, reduce the risks and only if these cannot be reduced is the possibility of using protective equipment

Yet it appears here that all that could be ignored

How do you know "why" they were riding in this way? It could be training for a team time trial for instance. To just say "don't ride that way" is a little simplistic.
You seem set on ignoring the part about the helmet hitting the road forming a barrier between head and road and instead focusing on the reason for the accident.
Accidents are accidents because we can't always predict when they will happen, sure we can limit their chances of occurring by the activities we choose to do, but I would suggest riding on bicycles always carries a certain level of inherent risk.

 

[ufkacbln]

How do you know "why" they were riding in this way? It could be training for a team time trial for instance. To just say "don't ride that way" is a little simplistic.
You seem set on ignoring the part about the helmet hitting the road forming a barrier between head and road and instead focusing on the reason for the accident.
Accidents are accidents because we can't always predict when they will happen, sure we can limit their chances of occurring by the activities we choose to do, but I would suggest riding on bicycles always carries a certain level of inherent risk.

Nothing is being ignored at all

This accident could have been prevented and using it as a supportive argument for helmet use is absurd

Why they are riding in a manner that is dangerous is irrelevant.....

 

[Justinslow]

Nothing is being ignored at all

This accident could have been prevented and using it as a supportive argument for helmet use is absurd

Why they are riding in a manner that is dangerous is irrelevant.....

I wasn't using it as a supportive argument, just telling an anecdotal story of what happened as reported to me!
And by the way pretty much all accidents could be prevented if we lived in a sterile riskless world, but we don't.

 

[Mugshot]

I wasn't using it as a supportive argument, just telling an anecdotal story of what happened as reported to me!
And by the way pretty much all accidents could be prevented if we lived in a sterile riskless world, but we don't.

You may well be right Justin, there may be certain cycling scenarios where the risk of falling is increased and therefore the wearing of a helmet may be beneficial provided the boxes where a helmet may help are ticked. However, the fact that certain scenarios present more opportunties to fall off should not be used as a stick to beat every other bare headed cyclist. The people that want a mandatory helmet law (and I suspect there's an awful lot that say they are pro-choice when they are nothing of the sort) would have you believe that the family having a pootle down the canal path on a Sunday afternoon are as likely to be involved in a pile up and be at risk of a head injury as a 25mph chain gang.
BTW Cunobelin is being a little disingenuous, we know he wears a helmet on his bike when it's icy for example as the risk of falling is greater, the obvious way to prevent the accident would be to not use the bicycle.