Team BKool CycleChat

[Brusgaard]

Please don't be mad at me, I'm trying my best to get things as equal as possible with extremely primitive tools from bkool for setting up league stages.

Sorry if I've pissed you off.

Yes, the Bkool search functionality leaves a lot to be desired and always has.

No, you haven't p*ssed me off, as I don't mind a climb. But if you want fun races, instead of a TT, one big climb is never gonna work. The time lost on a long climb is impossible to win back on a descent/downhill route. Gravity will always make even the lightest rider come to the bottom at some point. The time you lost on last months downhill was probably more related to you starting slow on the Pro and not getting on the draft-train. Still, the time gap was about 5 minutes for the top 10 - last night it was 11 minutes for the top 8.

Having a long flat(ish) lead-in before or a long descent after the climb, will make it more interesting because the heavier riders can then maybe build up a big enough lead before hitting the climb, or make up for some of the time lost, on the descent. Like @AndyMacca said, a pure climb is always gonna be a w/kg procession, and with BKOOL's algorithm, any rider above 80 kg will lose minutes.

 

[shimceltic]

Please don't be mad at me, I'm trying my best to get things as equal as possible with extremely primitive tools from bkool for setting up league stages.

If the search facility was as good as Big Ring's then finding routes would be relatively easy, in fact it's a real pain in the arse. Once you leave the initial set up page, for more detail or to go to the map select function then when you select the stage it assigns it to you personally, not the league stage you are trying to create! When you put a name in the search function it returns all results with those characters rather than the specific name you searched for. I have given up hope of bkool listening to suggestions for changes. As we know customer service is not their strong suit. if on the other hand you can offer any technical help/hints/ tricks to make searching for league stages easier I'd be thrilled!

With regard to this month I thought that the 21 kms of flat or descent would more than compensate for the 8kms of climb on stage 1. On yesterday's stage I expected to put 2 minutes and was hoping to put 3 into @AndyMacca to give me a buffer for stage 4 which will be hell for us lightweights as our legs flail around unable to generate any more power!. I was really surprised by the size of the gaps last night.

I thought people were generally happy with the one flat, one rolling, one climb , one descent monthly format and saw the benefit of it and of being encouraged? forced? to do rides we might not otherwise do in a competitive environment. However, your opinion, as a veteran member of the group has a huge amount of importance and I will try in future, given the horrendous limitations bkool imposes on creating league stages, to ensure that the climb and descent stages even each other out, by making the climb stages less extreme.

I am totally committed to trying to make our playing field as level as possible and as an example set up and manage the handicap league to try to give everybody an even chance of glory.

Sorry if I've pissed you off.

I like the format of different stages and it generally works. Didn't do last night but don't mind the grind once a month but maybe it was a little long. Keep up the good work.

 

[berty bassett]

I am grateful for the work put on to these leagues - I wouldn’t have a clue and really like the fact I haven’t got to scroll endlessly
I really like the race side of things and when you join a normal session wanting to race against someone , it is disappointing when they are just pootling around for fun , these league things I know I am going to have to bury myself

 

[keithaitch]

Yes, the Bkool search functionality leaves a lot to be desired and always has.

No, you haven't p*ssed me off, as I don't mind a climb. But if you want fun races, instead of a TT, one big climb is never gonna work. The time lost on a long climb is impossible to win back on a descent/downhill route. Gravity will always make even the lightest rider come to the bottom at some point. The time you lost on last months downhill was probably more related to you starting slow on the Pro and not getting on the draft-train. Still, the time gap was about 5 minutes for the top 10 - last night it was 11 minutes for the top 8.

Having a long flat(ish) lead-in before or a long descent after the climb, will make it more interesting because the heavier riders can then maybe build up a big enough lead before hitting the climb, or make up for some of the time lost, on the descent. Like @AndyMacca said, a pure climb is always gonna be a w/kg procession, and with BKOOL's algorithm, any rider above 80 kg will lose minutes.

Thx, feedback much appreciated, sorry rushing to class, but noted.

 

[Rod McG]

Thx, feedback much appreciated, sorry rushing to class, but noted.

Current format suits me, varied challenges giving less than an hour of max effort once per week. Easier for me as I accept that I am never going to win, due only to not being able to cycle fast enough regardless of the route! Thanks!

 

[Goldwolfie]

@keithaitch - don't worry about catering for me on your monthly route selections, as you can't cover extremes in fitness levels. I'll have reached my 3 score and 10 in a few months so I'm not going to change much. The league gives me the incentive to get a bit of 'organised' exercise.

For my speciality I take part in the USA Downhill league, weekly downhill stages with about 30/40 competitors, and I can imagine there are some big lads in that group, but I normally do quite well.

Anyway, I really appreciate all the hard work you have to put in, and as you say the handicap league you organise is aimed at levelling things out. However if I were to join that group I'd have to start the night before if there was a climb involved.

 

[Brusgaard]

Current format suits me, varied challenges giving less than an hour of max effort once per week. Easier for me as I accept that I am never going to win, due only to not being able to cycle fast enough regardless of the route! Thanks!

Agreed, but selecting routes the cater solely for the lightweights makes the league table somewhat useless. We are only about a handful of riders in the live races, so in most cases these become individual rides if all uphill. With a varied route, you can draft and work together to fight the lighter riders uphill advantage.

Most leagues on Zwift (and in the Danish BKOOL league) have only a set number of races count in the overall league, meaning you can afford to loose a lot of time (that is, not get any points) on some of them, as only your X best races count. Therefore, you can also skip these mountain stages all together, and go all in on the flats, downhill or whatever you specialty may be.

Unfortunately, the BKOOL league system doesn't have this functionality, so the minutes lost on for instance last night's ride is impossible to make up for in other stages, which means the league standing is almost final after stage 2. Both Berty and Keith are fast enough on the flatter stages as well to stay in contention.

I think/hope that most people find the races more fun, if more than 2 riders have a chance of doing something? My goals are usually to either stay ahead or together with the front group till the first climb. Usually I die trying, but at least I succeed once in a while. I know I'm doomed once we hit the uphill sections with my NEO, and drafting going uphill is not very noticable, so that is where I bid my goodbye to the group or get reeled in.

 

[Randyberlin]

Please don't be mad at me, I'm trying my best to get things as equal as possible with extremely primitive tools from bkool for setting up league stages.

If the search facility was as good as Big Ring's then finding routes would be relatively easy, in fact it's a real pain in the arse. Once you leave the initial set up page, for more detail or to go to the map select function then when you select the stage it assigns it to you personally, not the league stage you are trying to create! When you put a name in the search function it returns all results with those characters rather than the specific name you searched for. I have given up hope of bkool listening to suggestions for changes. As we know customer service is not their strong suit. if on the other hand you can offer any technical help/hints/ tricks to make searching for league stages easier I'd be thrilled!

With regard to this month I thought that the 21 kms of flat or descent would more than compensate for the 8kms of climb on stage 1. On yesterday's stage I expected to put 2 minutes and was hoping to put 3 into @AndyMacca to give me a buffer for stage 4 which will be hell for us lightweights as our legs flail around unable to generate any more power!. I was really surprised by the size of the gaps last night.

I thought people were generally happy with the one flat, one rolling, one climb , one descent monthly format and saw the benefit of it and of being encouraged? forced? to do rides we might not otherwise do in a competitive environment. However, your opinion, as a veteran member of the group has a huge amount of importance and I will try in future, given the horrendous limitations bkool imposes on creating league stages, to ensure that the climb and descent stages even each other out, by making the climb stages less extreme.

I am totally committed to trying to make our playing field as level as possible and as an example set up and manage the handicap league to try to give everybody an even chance of glory.

Sorry if I've pissed you off.

The new Beta SIM is a lot like Bigring to find routes. Hopefully it will make your duties easier. But until it's released, maybe all downhill.
Thanks again for doing these.

 

[Randyberlin]

@keithaitch - don't worry about catering for me on your monthly route selections, as you can't cover extremes in fitness levels. I'll have reached my 3 score and 10 in a few months so I'm not going to change much. The league gives me the incentive to get a bit of 'organised' exercise.

For my speciality I take part in the USA Downhill league, weekly downhill stages with about 30/40 competitors, and I can imagine there are some big lads in that group, but I normally do quite well.

Anyway, I really appreciate all the hard work you have to put in, and as you say the handicap league you organise is aimed at levelling things out. However if I were to join that group I'd have to start the night before if there was a climb involved.

Young punk. In February I'll test my wife with the old Beatles song.

 

[Randyberlin]

@shimceltic
Pouring rain, dark, up early for work and Jealous.

 

[Messab]

Ah I didn't recognise the 'world peace' name and thought it just someone randomly joining. Well done @Messab.

I hesitated between « world peace« or « peace train »

 

[inesfra]

Thank you all for slapping me in the second leg ...

Alas, uphill you are on another level.

Well done you all!

 

[Goldwolfie]

Young punk. In February I'll test my wife with the old Beatles song.

@Randyberlin - 3 score and 10 = 70, so "When I'm 65" was a while ago.

I notice you regularly take part in the USA Downhill League, and it mentions a Friday group ride, do you know if this still happens and if so at what time?

 

[Randyberlin]

@Randyberlin - 3 score and 10 = 70, so "When I'm 65" was a while ago.

I notice you regularly take part in the USA Downhill League, and it mentions a Friday group ride, do you know if this still happens and if so at what time?

That makes you routinely beating me hurt just a little more. Although when you did your ride to Skegness a few years ago I doubt you beat me in the fish and chip consumption when I went there. Of course I built up a huge appetite towing @bertybassett and he only had another 80 miles to ride back after pacing me from Boston.
I usually go the downhill league on Mondays. It is a way to start my week easy.

 

[AAAC 76C]

Sorry guys.
MIA/AWOL again.
Funny times for me this week.
Advised by HR that I am on the 'Christmas Chopping List' unless I can get myself one of the jobs going so they can release a volenteer and yesterday was my mums funeral in Kent.
I am on gardening leave until Christmas now with the job applications closing on the 18th Dec.
Oddly they told me off for working from my phone while I was in Kent as I am officially not supposed to work so I can concentrate on Job searches.
On the bright side it could be that I have a lot more time for cycling soon.
Elsewise I will have to get my 3rd job ever in 44 years excluding paperounds (so I am obviously one of those really unreliable employees. That said I had to quit my first job because I had served my time).
I will make it my aim to turn to tomorrow.