Sportive cancelled - should the cash be refunded?

[bianchi1]

Thankfully there's enough people like you who are prepared to bend over and take one for the team that it means the rest of us don't have to suffer.

Why do you think the banks are paying out billions in bank charges and mis-sold PPI? The customers signed up to the terms and conditions, didn't they?

No, in general they didn't. That's why the banks are paying out. They sold so many policies to people without showing them the terms and conditions and to people who wouldn't be able to claim, ie the self employed that they just put a huge amount of cash in a pot and decided to pay out on everyone's claim as to assess everyone would cost them more In the long run. Essentially the banks are paying out on some policies that were sold correctly, hence the huge market in ppi claims companies.

I still assert that the company (KTG?)did not mis-sell the product..customers mis-purchased it. If the terms and conditions are not legally binding I'm sure there will be a settlement, then to cover its costs the company will stick some more cash on tickets for its future events and put a new term and condition that will read something like:

In the event of dangerous conditions it will be left to the discretion of individuals whether to ride or not. We advise that individuals take out specialist dangerous sports insurance (available from the BMC) in order to cover injury of loss of life. Should you choose to take part please remember to sign the disclaimer at the start that removes any liability from KTG and its insurers.

Interestingly I notice that county cricket operates the same no refund policy on its ticketing (in Worcester specifically) in the event of bad weather. You just get admittance to another game. My guess is that they have a few lawyers floating about in first class cricket crowds, any yet I don't see this policy changing soon.

 

[nickyboy]

No, in general they didn't. That's why the banks are paying out. They sold so many policies to people without showing them the terms and conditions and to people who wouldn't be able to claim, ie the self employed that they just put a huge amount of cash in a pot and decided to pay out on everyone's claim as to assess everyone would cost them more In the long run. Essentially the banks are paying out on some policies that were sold correctly, hence the huge market in ppi claims companies.

I still assert that the company (KTG?)did not mis-sell the product..customers mis-purchased it. If the terms and conditions are not legally binding I'm sure there will be a settlement, then to cover its costs the company will stick some more cash on tickets for its future events and put a new term and condition that will read something like:

In the event of dangerous conditions it will be left to the discretion of individuals whether to ride or not. We advise that individuals take out specialist dangerous sports insurance (available from the BMC) in order to cover injury of loss of life. Should you choose to take part please remember to sign the disclaimer at the start that removes any liability from KTG and its insurers.

Interestingly I notice that county cricket operates the same no refund policy on its ticketing (in Worcester specifically) in the event of bad weather. You just get admittance to another game. My guess is that they have a few lawyers floating about in first class cricket crowds, any yet I don't see this policy changing soon.

I think that's a very fair summary of the situation.

However, it still remains the case that KtG could and should have handled the situation far better than they have done. By failing to explain their position, customer perception becomes the reality. It's still not too late for KtG to engage with this problem but by failing to do so their brand is being seriously damaged.

 

[dodgy]

Maybe we'll see a new age, thousands of would be sportive riders, blinking into the sun, riding out with routes they've studied by map or loaded onto their Garmins. A new dawn of realisation that you can put your own free 'sportive' together by ringing up a few mates and arranging to go somewhere.

 

[400bhp]

 

[DCLane]

I said I'd update you once I'd heard from Kilo To Go - and I have:

They have transferred my entry to the Wiggle White Peak on 13th October: http://www.kilotogo.com/index.php?option=event_detail&event_id=55

I'd asked for this or a transfer to next year's Cheshire Cat Long route as I wasn't likely to be available for either the re-scheduled Cat or the Shropshire Mynd.

Overall I'm happy with the outcome.

 

[Kestevan]

Just had an email from Kilo offering to transfer my entry to any other sportive of my choice (I pointed out I wasnt happy being shoehorned into an event I didnt know anything about).

Much better solution - if they'd done this in the first place I wouldnt have had any complaints.

Now just need to decide between the Yorkshire Weaver and the White Peak.......

 

[BimblingBee]

We've had the same email except we can't do any of the others as the cat was the nearest... Will be asking again for our money back.

 

[frank9755]

However when you get down to the voluntary level - club reliability rides, audaxes etc. some of which have got cancelled this year, I'd be sorry to see people expecting refunds there. It can be hard enough getting organisers without exposing them to an extra risk of their money going down a drain, or obliging them to go through all the palaver that comes with insurance.

I organised my club's reliability ride this year. We were only charging £5 but we said that we would refund advance entries if we had to cancel the event (not unlikely as it was early in January). We paid £50 up front for the hall and would have lost that.

I agree that, as a rider, I wouldn't have expected my £5 back but, for us it was the first time we had run the event so we wanted to give people confidence to enter in advance and build goodwill for the future.

 

[Turning Worm]

Clearly, Kilotogo have thankfully yielded to customer pressure. Their decision to widen the offering of substitute events is to be welcomed. An earlier intervention by Kilotogo would have circumvented this PR disaster and other potential long term damage, not just to their own name but also the broader reputation of the sportive movement.

As for me, their offering is academic. I have retrieved my entry fee.

 

[zombiemiked]

KTG have sorted out places in other events for the majority of riders. There are a few hell bent on causing trouble and accepting NO alternative place however.

 

[BimblingBee]

Well after an interesting conversation with k2g I've been promised my money back... Eventually!

 

[eric1962]

The whole sportive industry is immature and we are all learning as we go.

Perhaps the lesson learned is that if we want to enter events at the time of year with a chance of really bad weather then we should only do it with companies with either clear refund policies or with a track record of being reasonable

As 400bhp alludes, a sportive organiser would make more money by cancelling an event than by running it. So we need to be mindful that less scrupulous organisers may be tempted to cancel unnecessarily if they don't have to refund

Very true this comment, they "make more money cancelling an event than running it"