Respect for the Fallen.

[VelvetUnderpants]

I wear the Grenadier Guards service pin in remembrance of my grandfather who raised me from six months of age, who survived Dunkirk and for all the brave men and women alive and dead who have served this country.

God bless all of them.

 

[Moon bunny]

Some of the companies, for instance the LNER had a medal they presented to particularly brave employees, they also had memorial books and in some cases memorials erected, but mostly for those whom enlisted in the forces. I’ll have a nosey around at work on Monday and see what I can find.
There is a memorial plaque on York station to two men killed in an air raid.

https://collection.sciencemuseumgro...l-london-north-eastern-railway-roll-of-honour

Not much in the archives, but this is from Hansard for 29 Oct 1945
Company.Killed, Injured.
G.W.R.52, 241
L.N.E.R.115, 702
L.M.S.R.48, 533
S.R.130, 796
L.P.T.B.40, 111
Other Lines7, 27
Total Casualties392, 2,410
It seems there are memorials in towns, on stations, even in a pub, but no central list. Where there are local memorials to civilians killed, usually no distinction is made for occupation.

 

[Time Waster]

My old town had a special memorial and new plaque added near or on the war memorial. Some representatives from USA including a USAF full bird colonel and diplomatic mission guys came up for it. Local cadets turned up, so did scouts and veterans. They all turned up in smart attire or uniform. Our local MP turned up in painting jeans and jumper. Plus he was late and kept ppl waiting.

But what was the special memorial and new plaque for? USAF bomber from WWII who was lost and gliding towards the ground to try and survive. They saw the town up ahead that was a locally important rail town at its height in terms of resident numbers. Iirc it was about home time for schools and local business. 4 or 5pm. The crew pushed the sticks forward as the only way to stop the plane hitting the town and killing a lot of ppl.

There's more than a few who will never forget their MP's lack of respect by turning up late and being so scruffy. Ignorance or arrogance I have no idea but you simply wouldn't if you were one of the dignitaries for that event.

It's a tale I heard from one of the leaders of the local cadets who had his cadets in full uniform ready to pay their respects for 2 hours plus. You can tell how hard it was to keep kids settled that long. I only mentioned it because there's a fair few who do not respect others no matter how deserving.

 

[Moon bunny]

Special mention must be made of the locomotive that was shot by a German fighter, the boiler exploded and either a sudden rush of steam or piece of broken metal hit the plane and brought it down, passengers and crew were unharmed, the pilot of the plane died.

 

[wiggydiggy]

My poppy order was only dispatched today so fingers crossed it will be here for Sunday as for a change I want to walk down to the cenopath in my town and see the parade. If it doesn't they've got my donation at least anyway.

 

[DaveReading]

Special mention must be made of the locomotive that was shot by a German fighter, the boiler exploded and either a sudden rush of steam or piece of broken metal hit the plane and brought it down, passengers and crew were unharmed, the pilot of the plane died.

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/55096086/heinz-bierwirth

 

[T4tomo]

Special mention must be made of the locomotive that was shot by a German fighter, the boiler exploded and either a sudden rush of steam or piece of broken metal hit the plane and brought it down, passengers and crew were unharmed, the pilot of the plane died.

I was moved to google that and found an account here:
https://ryesown.co.uk/german-bomber/

 

[Mad Doug Biker]

I also notice a lack of people wearing poppy emblems.

You do realise that it is not actually mandatory?
If it was, surely that would contradict why they fought WW2, only one of the biggest conflicts the Poppies represent?

No, no 'Emotional Fascism' please.

I had a close relative who used to drive trains carrying supplies into London from the docks at Southampton. He drove past many engines destroyed and just pushed off the track so they could get the line running again. They were always on the lookout for German planes because goods trains on that line were secondary targets for planes that had anything left to drop.

Anyone know if the sacrifice of those railway workers, of which my relative in grateful for not being one of, ever got any recognition for sacrifices made? Day after day they ran the gauntlet and the odds of survival on certain runs was low. Does anyone remember them or are poppies only for those who carried guns?

As others have said, there are plenty of memorials and even locos named after drivers who won George Crosses.

A 'Railway Poppy' would be interesting as I see ones for other things, like the animals used in wartime, etc.

I'm sorry to digress and ramble but I don't wear the red poppy or any poppy. That's not a consciousness thing but a practical thing. Why buy a stupid emblem one period of the year so you can virtue signal when a proportion of the donation made to get it goes to waste on the emblem itself or the distribution to you the punter. You are a customer of the business that is RBL Ltd. If you want to remember them remember and show respect. If you want to donate pick another forces related charity who don't waste money on poppies.

Sorry but it's a business wrapped around respect for the fallen and help for veterans. Not the best way to help veterans imho. But carry on wearing the emblem if you want to just know you're buying it is wasting a proportion of your money so put a little bit more in the pot to cover it.

Interesting, I'd never really thought about it that way before. How much does it actually cost to make poppies each year?

Some of the companies, for instance the LNER had a medal they presented to particularly brave employees, they also had memorial books and in some cases memorials erected, but mostly for those whom enlisted in the forces. I’ll have a nosey around at work on Monday and see what I can find.
There is a memorial plaque on York station to two men killed in an air raid.

https://collection.sciencemuseumgro...l-london-north-eastern-railway-roll-of-honour

There's a memorial plaque in the centre of Littleport to commemorate the bravery of two men who lost their lives when an ammunition train caught fire near Soham in 1944 - the fireman of the train (who hailed from Littleport) and the signalman in the box where the cargo eventually exploded.


View: https://www.flickr.com/photos/sludgeulper/3366497536


There's also a plaque in Soham too.

The train's driver and fireman were both awarded the George Cross for their actions in saving many lives after detaching the burning waggon from the rest of the train.

BR named a few locos after George Cross winners... Names like 'Driver Norman Tunna G.C.', 'Driver Benjamin Gimbert G.C.', 'James Nighthall G.C.' (pictured above) are remembered by many an enthusiast!

There are other non wartime ones too like 'Driver John Axon G.C.' and 'Driver Wallace Oaks G.C., not to mention non traincrew, like 'James Kennedy G.C.' who was a security guard at Glasgow Works and in December 1973 was assaulted and then shot and killed, trying to repeatedly stop an armed robbery by a gang who stole the wage packets when they were being delivered.

I was moved to google that and found an account here:
https://ryesown.co.uk/german-bomber/

I never knew that, thanks.

The crew were lucky not to have been killed by an exploding engine themselves! 🤔

 

[Accy cyclist]

Made by the local Women's Institute members. The war memorial in this wonderful creation is a copy of the town's memorial.

 

[Time Waster]

Iirc there's been a few war service medals issued long after WWII to civilian occupations who served in Britain because their jobs were reserved. What criteria did they use to decide which were worthy? To me it seems it was whichever group had the most vocal and influential supporters.

@Mad Doug Biker you're late to the thread, good contribution. No idea how much poppy merch costs to produce. I do wonder how much more or less they might get with or without the poppy emblem/merch cost?

BTW I think I was the one who first raised non military service like rail workers. I don't really think the majority of the public really think about how much of a team effort for a country a large war really is. Or the sacrifice made often by people they never think of at poppy time. The women working in munitions factories, miners tunnelling under enemy trenches in WWI, etc. Merchant navy keeping Russia supplied via the Arctic route was another. Not military navy.

The whole remembrance day thing to me always seemed an army thing. It seemed to me to be about fundraising for soldiers after the great war that went on beyond it's need. Right now I think RBL Ltd has had it's day as I think there's other armed forces charities that seem more relevant and dare I say it do more good!

 

[Accy cyclist]

You do realise that it is not actually mandatory?
If it was, surely that would contradict why they fought WW2, only one of the biggest conflicts the Poppies represent?

No, no 'Emotional Fascism' please.

I was making the point that not many are choosing to not wear one voluntarily. I actually talked someone into wearing a poppy the other day. It's always been a case of encouragement, rather then enforcement.

 

[Drago]

I shall be pouncing about in my poppy and medals on Sunday. My beret will get its annual dust off and join the ensemble.

The currently suspended Chief Constable of Northants police will doubtless don his medals on Sunday.

 

[numbnuts]

My Father's medals

 

[wiggydiggy]

My RBL items arrived, was getting worried as they were only dispatched yesterday but they were sent RoyalMail24.



The spitfire is a card holder that I saw and looked pretty funky, pin badge and 2xreflectors.

50p for scale lol

 

[Reynard]

Iirc there's been a few war service medals issued long after WWII to civilian occupations who served in Britain because their jobs were reserved. What criteria did they use to decide which were worthy? To me it seems it was whichever group had the most vocal and influential supporters.

@Mad Doug Biker you're late to the thread, good contribution. No idea how much poppy merch costs to produce. I do wonder how much more or less they might get with or without the poppy emblem/merch cost?

BTW I think I was the one who first raised non military service like rail workers. I don't really think the majority of the public really think about how much of a team effort for a country a large war really is. Or the sacrifice made often by people they never think of at poppy time. The women working in munitions factories, miners tunnelling under enemy trenches in WWI, etc. Merchant navy keeping Russia supplied via the Arctic route was another. Not military navy.

The whole remembrance day thing to me always seemed an army thing. It seemed to me to be about fundraising for soldiers after the great war that went on beyond it's need. Right now I think RBL Ltd has had it's day as I think there's other armed forces charities that seem more relevant and dare I say it do more good!

I think you're right. People generally don't realise just how much effort was put in on the Home Front during WW2 to "keep the home fires burning" - the Land Girls and the Lumberjills were only recently recognised for their efforts in the general scheme of things, which is a bit mad considering that Britain suddenly had to produce more food and timber to make up for the lack of imports.

Then you had the people at the Ministry of Food making sure that everyone was fed and getting their fair share. The WI had a big role there, because much of the country's jam ration was made by the WI locally from donated fruit and then sent nationwide for distribution. Ration jam was made to a specific recipe which was 65% sugar to 35% fruit. You also had the ladies touring the country doing cookery demonstrations - Marguerite Patten spent the wartime years doing the MoF demos and writing leaflets and the like, although she was largely based in London.

And that's not taking into account the fire watchers and the ARP wardens and the people manning barrage balloons and ack-ack guns and the like. Then there's the fire brigade, who probably had one of the hardest and most dangerous domestic jobs during the war.

I actually find that the history of the Home Front is actually more fascinating than the military stuff - though that's interesting too