No more club rides for me

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Hitchington

Lovely stuff
Location
That London
Hello Matthew! I read with interest about your experience (I am a practitioner working with individuals with ASC). Us neuro-typicals are a strange bunch and I completely empathise with the difficulties that people with an ASC experience when trying to fathom out the confusing and chaotic minefield that is social interaction. Are there 1 or 2 members that you feel you could buddy up with? You could approach one who you think would be sympathetic and explain your condition to them. They could then make sure you're not feeling left out when the social aspect of club riding happens in the pub. There are a lot of helpful people out there who are patient and understanding, good luck :smile:
 

Rob3rt

Man or Moose!
Location
Manchester
Earlier this year I tried out a ride with a local club. I kept being left behind on any inclines as everone else were riding carbon and my bike is a 30 year old steelie. (I kept catching up on the flat and even had to keep breaking on down-hills). At the cafe stop I tried to join in with conversations but was definitely excluded and made to feel unwelcome.
I've not been with them since.
I do want a newer, lighter ride but enjoy riding on my own more than being ignored by a group with better more expensive gear than me.
It's about the cycling.

How so?

I think more often than not when someone is "excluded" that it is not actually a case of concious exclusion or rudeness but just forgetting that the new guy isn't on the banter or whatever. You can not realistically expect to join a pre-existing group and expect to instantly be "one of the gang", or the life and soul of the party.

Our club is traditionally a racing club, albeit one with a strong social rider base, most people ride fairly expensive bikes, a few ride very expensive super bling bikes, some ride old steel bikes. No-one gets looked down on. That is not to say that no-one feels they are looked down on, that is a distinct possibility and one a group can not really eliminate since that is down to someones thoughts, not the reality.

Getting dropped on hills is fairly normal too btw, on our club rides, hills are a free for all unless otherwise stated, this lets the guys who want a bit of training from the ride stretch their legs and also, when climbing many people can only really go at their own rhythm so it doesn't make sense to have someone setting the pace for a group.
 

PK99

Legendary Member
Location
SW19
I felt really excluded at tonights club ride. The ride itself was normal. But we went to the pub after to celebrate a members 50th. At the pub noone spoke to me, I felt really bored and unwelcome. I have been with the club for over a year and would have expected better from them.
Sorry to say that I will not be attending any club rides anymore.

A video from the evening is on the club Facebook page:
View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkMOqZmMRdY&feature=youtu.be


If I have you right, you are standing away from the group, seeming to observe as you sup your pint.
The rest of the group are sat/stood around a couple of tables, facing inwards - apart from one guy who at the start of the video is stood near you supping and staring into the distance. When the camera come back he has moved elsewhere.
You are physically outside the group and interaction requires someone to leave the group and come over to you.

Many people would read that as you not wanting to be part of the group - happy to sup and observe. They do not know what is going on in your head.
If you want to be involved in the group, put yourself physically there and make interaction the easy natural thing, rather than requiring someone to walk over to you.

I'm older than you, around 50 when I first joined my club, but it went something like this....
First club run I was on, at the end of run pub someone bought a round - I bought the second. Conversation flowed as it does when someone buys beer.
Second club run, same thing. But as I went to pay, one of the guys stopped me "You bought a round last time, it must by my turn" cue conversation about beer and the footie game on the tv.
Next week i bought a round
Next week, I went to buy a round and a different guy stopped me "You are always buying beer, put your money away it's my round"
By that time I was established as a beer drinker and buyer and had broken the conversational ice with a number of people.
 

Rob3rt

Man or Moose!
Location
Manchester
Just a thought, some people don't like having a camera pointed at them!

Edit: nm, I now viewed the video on youtube and can see the caption which I couldn't see with the embedded video.

You were stood completely away from the group. You are going to need to make yourself part of the group if you are to be treated as part of it.
 

lejogger

Guru
Location
Wirral
A couple of weeks ago my girlfriend of a few months invited me and my 9 year old son to her friend’s house for a birthday BBQ. I’d met the host and her boyfriend once before – we’d been out for a double date dinner – but the rest of the bunch were complete strangers.

I’d tried to arrive a little late to ensure that the GF would be there when I arrived but she’d gone to fetch her sister and a table or something and we ended up having to venture in alone.

While the host couple found time for a brief chat and some introductions, they were obviously busy hosting and couldn’t babysit me. I grabbed a beer and made my way over to a table in the garden where most were congregated, said some hellos and tried to pull up a chair. Not one of them made any attempt to engage me after the initial greeting, nor did they open up the circle of chairs to allow me to integrate, instead I ended up sat on the periphery feeling very much the odd one out. After a very long minute or so of feeling very awkward I made my way over to the host and made some small talk with him about golf and cycling while he BBQ’d until the GF arrived.

In complete contrast, my son had immediately gone over to the group of boys of varying ages, I think his awkward silence lasted for about 3 seconds until he showed them his water pistol and one of them asked him about playstations or trampolines or something, and then I barely saw him for the rest of the night while he tore around the place causing mischief with his new mates (ruining his socks in the process).

I don’t have aspergers, I consider myself to be generally a sociable person, but I must admit I did analyse the start of the evening wondering why it was so easy for children to bond and so difficult for some adults.

I think my conclusion was common ground. Kids tend to like similar things and form their opinions in a very simplistic manner at that age. They’re also not complicated by cliques and politics in quite the same way that us old ‘uns are. Plus, everyone likes a water pistol.

Also, from the other side, it can be just as difficult for someone on the inside to reach out to someone who looks like they’re feeling awkward or uncomfortable – even though we probably all like to think that we’d be that person, in that sort of informal gathering maybe they were just waiting for someone else to make the first move.

I have an inner squirminess when I see someone who I think feels uncomfortable. Maybe 6 times out of 10 it persuades me to do something about it.

I have a good friend who is naturally bursting with witty banter, jokes and talking points, and physically can’t help himself from making sure that everyone feels included in any sort of situation. His inner squirminess will persuade him to intervene 10 out of 10 times.

I have another pal who pretty much couldn’t give two hoots about how anyone unconnected to him is feeling, or what anyone else thinks about him as long as he’s ok. He doesn’t get that inner squirminess, or if he does he’s very good at ignoring it.

Both are fantastic mates, but polar opposites. They’re both good people, they just have different social strengths.

On the whole though, you can’t expect someone to make an effort with you unless you’re also making an effort with them. Common ground shouldn’t be hard to find when you’re a cyclist amongst a group of cyclists. Having something to say or show or share to break the ice with is what it’s all about. If you make an effort and get nothing in return then they’re not worth making the effort for, but I’d be very surprised if on the whole, you dangle a carrot and don’t get a bite.

So next time you find yourself in that sort of situation, be prepared to engage, have some questions to ask, like so many have suggested – be willing to get a round in, and also perhaps take a water pistol and a spare pair of socks.
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Earlier this year I tried out a ride with a local club. I kept being left behind on any inclines as everone else were riding carbon and my bike is a 30 year old steelie.

It's not the bike. I ride my 23 year old steel bikes with my club, many on very expensive super light kit. The only ones who get up hills quicker than me are the fitter ones ! Now't to do with the bike at all. :blush:
 
I was drinking and I was seriously racking my mind for something to start a conversation with. I was trying to listen to peoples convo's (without being nosey) and thinking of something I could input. It got to the stage where I was with the dog owner trying to think of something dog related.
Social interventions are very difficult for me to handle. I am not a person to start a conversation. Most of the people in the club I know but rarely speak to on the rides because we are all concentrating and moving about.
I know I shouldnt jump on them so quickly but this has happened before at the pub, and pretty much on every ride. People rarely come and speak to me.

At work we constantly ask each other if they are 'alright' just to start the conversation. All I need is for someone to acknowledge my existence.


You're not alone. Starting a conversation can be difficult for most people. It's not always easy for me.....sometimes there'll be someone around that I get on with instantly and can talk about absolutely nothing with, quite happily, for hours. Rest of the time it is like trying to pull teeth out with a spoon and I would rather stand to one side and listen (or not as the case may be!). If they bore me stupid I tend to mooch off and hide :tongue:
As a side issue - have you let them know you have Aspergers? If not, it might be worth making sure they know - they might just think you are difficult to talk to, or that you don't want to talk, and accordingly not take much notice of you.... and if there is someone that effectively heads up the club, can you talk to them and ask them to let the others know? And explain how you feel too.. then if it doesn't change, you can think about moving to a different club.
 

brodiej

Veteran
Location
Waindell,
I must say I wouldn't tell a bunch of strangers on my first social get together I have Aspergers - that would be awkward for all concerned and people would talk to you not because of who you are but because of your Aspergers

I would find a drinks party with a bunch of strangers an occasion where I would not expect to be the life and soul.

I would sit to one side and observe.
Once a bit more comfortable it is likely I would have said a few words to a few people- but not many and I wouldn't be bothered if I didn't.

I wouldn't take it as an affront. I would consider it normal.

Next time something similar happens you will find the ice gradually breaks.

Don't expect too much too soon. It's not the end of the world if you don't talk to everyone on the first meeting.
 
[quote="brodiej, post: 2576436, member: 28824"]I must say I wouldn't tell a bunch of strangers on my first social get together I have Aspergers - that would be awkward for all concerned and people would talk to you not because of who you are but because of your Aspergers

The point is, it isn't the first social get together. And he has been cycling with them for a year. And people tend to be more forthcoming and helpful if they know the reason for seeming aloofness or lack of participation (or whatever you would like to call it).

As Matthew says in an earlier post, "this has happened before at the pub, and pretty much on every ride."



 

brodiej

Veteran
Location
Waindell,
That's not how I read it

He never said "this has happened before at the pub"

He said the ride was normal.

The pub trip was to celebrate someone's birthday - so presumably a one off.

I have kept myself to myself on rides - a lot of people have.

In a pub environment a little more circulating and conversation is normal although there's nothing wrong with being quiet and sitting on the edge. I certainly wouldn't bring up Aspergers
 
That's not how I read it

He never said "this has happened before at the pub"

He said the ride was normal.

The pub trip was to celebrate someone's birthday - so presumably a one off.

I have kept myself to myself on rides - a lot of people have.

In a pub environment a little more circulating and conversation is normal although there's nothing wrong with being quiet and sitting on the edge. I certainly wouldn't bring up Aspergers


Not the first post. I suggest reading his post #18.....where he says precisely that.
 

Rob3rt

Man or Moose!
Location
Manchester
I think often a bigger deal is made of aspergers (in general, not particularly Matthews case) than is necessary. Therefore there is no immediate need to put this out there whatsoever. Especially if you don't feel like you particularly want to, for whatever reason.
 

Brandane

Legendary Member
Location
Costa Clyde
I think often a bigger deal is made of aspergers (in general, not particularly Matthews case) than is necessary. Therefore there is no immediate need to put this out there whatsoever. Especially if you don't feel like you particularly want to, for whatever reason.

+1 to this. Two of my nephews have aspergers, and it affects them in totally different ways. In the case of one of them, you couldn't meet a more sociable bloke!
 

annedonnelly

Girl from the North Country
Maybe rather than confessing to having Aspergers Matthew could mention that he's a bit shy - maybe he's younger than other members - and ask someone to help him join in.

I'm hopeless in social situations like that but being older and wiser I don't much care any more.

I know that it can feel isolating and hurtful but if Matthew has been riding with them for a year it can't all be bad :smile:
 
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